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Wave2k |
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Wave2k G's Stalker
Joined: 06 Apr 2004 Karma :
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Posted: 19:27 - 05 Jun 2006 Post subject: Ducati Vs Japanese Motorcycles |
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Nipped from another forum and interesting read if not a /little/ biased .
It is very difficult to compare a Ducati with a Japanese motorcycle: they are two different breeds, two parallel universes.
This might seem like a strong statement if it wasn’t backed up by the passionate devotion of countless Ducati fans from all over the world.
Let’s start from the beginning: Ducatis are born from a no-compromise design principle: they have always been developed directly from victory on the race-track.
Japanese motorcycles on the other hand, are created with the functional necessities of everyday biking in mind; from there they are transformed into race bikes.
These respective design philosophies are completely antithetical.
Now that we’ve introduced things, let’s take a closer look at those incredible features that make Ducatis unique.
First of all the heart of any bike, the engine. It is the engine that brings a motorcycle to life and also defines its character.
We don’t have to view the motorcycle as a rational sum of cold, lifeless mechanical parts: who can deny the existence of a specific character to their bike?
The heart of a Ducati is always a longitudinal L-twin cylinder, always a four stroke and, note carefully, always with Ducati’s trademark and track-proven Desmodromic timing.
What other motorcycle manufacturer can boast such loyalty to technical standardization, strictly derived from competition racing?
These unique factors could already be enough to make a drastic and definitive distinction between the red bikes of Borgo Panigale and any of those manufactured in the land of the rising sun.
But what do they mean in practice?
What differences can the “ordinary” (if a motorcycle rider can be defined as such) user perceive? Or do all Ducatisti have to be engineers in order to appreciate these subtleties?
The answer is very simple: it is the character, or rather the torque supplied and the power delivered that make the fundamental difference.
Thanks to its design, its desmodromic valve control that allows the finest valve timing with less power waste, and its well-tested and extremely sharp electronic fuel injection, the unique Ducati “Pompone” (Big pump) has a unique character throughout the rev range.
Torque and Power are two physical dimensions that represent the performance of an engine; they are expressed in Nm and KW, respectively, and their levels at different engine revs are shown as typical characteristic curves on graphs.
The driving torque is the capacity of the engine to pull, to accelerate the bike and its rider by projecting them inside the following curve: in practice, it is the measurement of how much the rear wheel manages to push on the road.
Japanese motorcycles also have good torque values with maximum values comparable even to our own, BUT what counts is the trend of the torque curve, not only its absolute value.
Indeed the torque available at low RPM is much, much more precious: and this is the precise advantage of our generous engines, the substantial torque at all levels.
In this way you get a really satisfying and successful ride, as our countless victories in the Superbike championships show.
How can someone handle and get the most out of an engine that gives maximum torque at 8000 RPM?
How big is the gulf that separates it from a Ducati twin cylinder that, at just 3500 RPM, is already delivering 85% of its maximum torque?
So far we have considered differences that could be linked to any two and four cylinder engine. In fact, a few years ago the Japanese began to use longitudinal V-twin cylinders, strangely enough a 90° V: practically copies of our engine…a design that is alien to their engine tradition and therefore, obviously imported.
Nonetheless, differences remain, even as far as those engines are concerned.
To understand them we have to forget the classic characteristic curves and think instead of something that isn’t represented by those charts, that happens when we open the throttle: the reaction of the bike to this movement - peculiar to motorcycles - is identified as power range.
It isn’t quite correct to think of torque when you feel, at the opening of the throttle, a “a big pull” and the bike tears you away from the handlebars.
In reality, torque is not so easily perceptible.
If we consider any engine, travelling at a constant pace (for example 90 kmph at 4000 RPM and in fourth gear) there is no notable “pull” but the torque is nonetheless delivered sure enough (see the torque curve…).
Another example: why, with the engine running at full speed, do we still feel the famous “pull”, even after the peak of the curve, when torque is falling?
Power delivery is not usually represented in charts but it qualitatively summarizes various technical aspects of the engine (torque trend during changes in load, degree of irregularity, etc) to describe the engine reaction.
Above all it is highly perceptible.
So, as far as power delivery is concerned, Ducati engines are at their peak in all capacities: from 600 to 1000cc we have a robust answer to every opening of the throttle.
What happens at the opening of the throttle, independent of the RPM, the bike speed or the gear selected, is truly the spirit of the engine.
It is obvious that this same generosity is the winning feature of the bikes that have dominated the world Superbike championships for more than 10 years… so there is no trick and no deception: our bikes are all sincerity and energy!
Another indisputable strong point in favor of the “Pompone” is the music it makes.
That’s right, music, not noise.
Ducatis don’t make noise but they create harmonious music: the low drone emitted by the exhaust joyfully combines with the tinkling of the timing system and the roar of the intake.
In sports models, this symphony is completed by the characteristic sound of the dry clutch, a real connoisseur’s piece…
And what about the engine’s song?
That’s what makes everybody on the side of the street turn round, that’s what impressively announces our arrival…let’s hear it in the words of a Ducatista: “…have you ever noticed how the sound of the exhaust evolves throughout the power curve?
When I open up the throttle the engine roars.
The filter case acts as a speaker, amplifying the low sound of a twin cylinder thirsty for fuel.
The intake port is finally free from limiting elements and the suction is heard in a muffled rumble, perhaps even more pleasant than the exhaust sound.
The engine revs up, between 5000 and 5500 the desmodromic roar is really hoarse and brutal.
The wicked sound that emanates during the intake stroke is mainly heard by those in front of us as the two intake horns face forwards.
More than once I have seen people suddenly turn round, taken aback by the aggression of the engine …”
Even stops at traffic lights become opportunities to savor the harmony of the Ducati’s engine:
"…the tinkling of that moving part (the dry clutch) is music to my ears, and is obtained, contrary to what one might think, without the throttle, when the engine is running at its slowest and the feels as if it could switch off at any minute… in these moments, when the idling teeters, the clutch resounds as forcefully as ever and the wait at the traffic light isn’t all that long and boring." ____________________ Ducati 1299 Panigale
2009 Corvette C6 z51
RS125->CBR400->RXS100->GSXR750K2->Ducati749S->CBR600RR5->TL1000R->DRz400->RSVR1000->Honda VTR SP1->CBR400->GSXR1000K6->Honda H100->CBR600RR3->Ducati1299 |
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quacker_boy |
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quacker_boy Cuddle Bitch
Joined: 06 Sep 2005 Karma :
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Posted: 20:14 - 05 Jun 2006 Post subject: |
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Only a LITTLE biased Wave? It hardly, if at all, mentions the strong points of IL4's.
It's all that personal taste crap again, i'm a multicultural kinda guy when it comes to this.
Example: An 05 Duke 749R and an 05 CBR 600RR with modifcations such as uprated forks, rear shock, braided hoses, discs, 'zorst etc are sat in front of me, i wouldn't for the LIFE of me be able to choose between the toy.
Either way, what's it matter, both bikes are fast as f**k and handle and corner MILES better than bikes 5 years ago.
Just my two pence. ____________________ wizzzard wrote: Imagine God just stopping by, tidying your front room up and then quietly letting himself out again. Statisticly more likely to happen than Korn being on here. |
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Wave2k |
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Wave2k G's Stalker
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Posted: 20:24 - 05 Jun 2006 Post subject: |
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quacker_boy wrote: | Only a LITTLE biased Wave? It hardly, if at all, mentions the strong points of IL4's.
It's all that personal taste crap again, i'm a multicultural kinda guy when it comes to this.
Example: An 05 Duke 749R and an 05 CBR 600RR with modifcations such as uprated forks, rear shock, braided hoses, discs, 'zorst etc are sat in front of me, i wouldn't for the LIFE of me be able to choose between the toy.
Either way, what's it matter, both bikes are fast as f**k and handle and corner MILES better than bikes 5 years ago.
Just my two pence. |
your comparing the wrong type of bike
an 05 749 Bip and and 05 CBR6RR
as the R has all round Ohlins and a tuned engine with a shorter stroke.
even the S model has a slightly tuned engine and Showa all round. ____________________ Ducati 1299 Panigale
2009 Corvette C6 z51
RS125->CBR400->RXS100->GSXR750K2->Ducati749S->CBR600RR5->TL1000R->DRz400->RSVR1000->Honda VTR SP1->CBR400->GSXR1000K6->Honda H100->CBR600RR3->Ducati1299 |
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syl |
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syl World Chat Champion
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Kickstart The Oracle
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G The Voice of Reason
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NC30UK Scooby Slapper
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G The Voice of Reason
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G The Voice of Reason
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Posted: 21:25 - 05 Jun 2006 Post subject: |
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I'd take a GT550 over a Ducati twin with the same peak power .
I quite agree on the power delivery front, while I'm not a fan of SVs, I'm also not a fan of Hornets etc, thanks to their power delivery.
And thus I don't mind the TRX850, which despite being a twin, needs a lot more revving than many to keep going. |
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G The Voice of Reason
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Posted: 21:32 - 05 Jun 2006 Post subject: |
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Well, first I'd worry about what ducati I was getting with the peak power of a GT550. I can't see it having a much more lively power delivery, really.
Then there's tart value, people might recognise me riding a ducati! The shame!
I have actually said in the past that I quite liked the idea of the 748 for a road bike if it wasn't for me licence - got useable go for being lazy, but still a bit revvy. |
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wristjob |
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wristjob World Chat Champion
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Hotdog |
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Hotdog Nearly there...
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Posted: 22:27 - 05 Jun 2006 Post subject: |
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They might be overpriced, unreliable junk that only wins races when the rules (power and weight) are grossly in their favour.....
But..they are still much better than Harleys.....
Hotdog. ____________________ He's a gentleman, a scholar, he's an-acrobat, he's the one and only truly original.......
Hotdog....(Defender of the weak, the poor and the innocent)
He's The Ace - He's Amazing...He's the Strongest... He's The Quickest.... He's The Best! |
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Bendy Mrs Sensible
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Hotdog Nearly there...
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Klause World Chat Champion
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Posted: 23:41 - 05 Jun 2006 Post subject: |
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I like Ducati's, I like my monster, but that story above is gay.
Sounds awesome, wheelies easy and handles godlike and is good to commute on is why I like my monster. The monster is actually a very simple but clever bike. The 4 valver bikes are very, very race minded.
Most inline 4 jap bikes make me yawn, but a few tickle my fancy. Most of my friends bikes I have ridden and got rid of their chicken strips for them, they felt really light and fluffly in the corners whereas the monster digs into the ground and gives lots of grip, just something I like.
Another thing the japs do with V twins is make the bike huge!!! Argh, the whole point of the vtwin layout is to have a narrow chassis noobs! ____________________ Current bikes: 1960 Triumph 5ta x2, TTR600RE, KTM200EXC, Cagiva Elephant 900ie. |
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G The Voice of Reason
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Old Thread Alert!
The last post was made 17 years, 344 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful? |
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