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it250 will it fit in a 125 honda cg/clone frame

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halo123.
Renault 5 Driver



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PostPosted: 09:38 - 03 Oct 2007    Post subject: it250 will it fit in a 125 honda cg/clone frame Reply with quote

http://www.bikepics.com/pictures/554105/
Will the engine in that bike fit in a honda cg 125 clone.
this bike http://www.huntermotorcycles.co.za/NewCarDisplay.aspx?Variant=5421

As i have the cg but have managed to bend the crank shaft with out breaking any covers so i think the engine quality is crap so i would maybe replace the engine with one of these if it fits.
(Nb i bent the crank by over revving and letting clutch out to fast , so now it eats stators( what i know as a magneto)(nb south africa)

Thanks
Angus
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G
The Voice of Reason



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PostPosted: 11:01 - 03 Oct 2007    Post subject: Re: it250 will it fit in a 125 honda cg/clone frame Reply with quote

It might fit, but with a hell of a lot of bodging, probably better to get an it250 frame to put it in Smile.
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Kickstart
The Oracle



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PostPosted: 11:24 - 03 Oct 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi

Anything will fit with enough effort, and I suspect that would be a hell of a lot of effort.

Think the CG engine acts as the lower frame rails as a brace, unlike that IT, and not sure the IT engine could take the stress.

All the best

Keith
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halo123.
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PostPosted: 11:35 - 03 Oct 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

hi thanks.
i saw a reasonal priced motor thats why i thought of it, then i realised , that the it 250 is a two stroke and i really dont do two strokes, they scare me
he he

well i gave the 125 to my mom because she told me she wanted it so she can put another motor in it and learn to ride a Motorbike on.
But maybe i must just look for a reasonable priced bike with repairable motor ,and just fix that.

Hunter lifan in sa =junk (brand new)
Hehe
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Spoon261 This post is not being displayed because it has a low rating (Spam). Unhide this post / all posts.

G
The Voice of Reason



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PostPosted: 15:13 - 03 Oct 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spoon261 wrote:
My Honda CG125 website has now been updated with how to increase the engine size.

Not sure how that's relevant, as his engine is dead?

Anyway, I read a bit of your page.
Do you have links to details about honda converting the CB engine for use in the CG?
Also, what 'sports bike manufacturuer' uses a sleeved down 250 engine in their 125. Only bike I can think of that even comes close is the comet, and that's only just a commuter, never mind sports.
Note that power is just as important as torque for going up hills or into head winds genearlly.
What you are considering is 'range of torque' probably, which is rarely specified when looking for a bike.
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Spoon261
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PostPosted: 11:11 - 04 Oct 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Do you have links to details about honda converting the CB engine for use in the CG?


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_CG125

Its also common knowledge about the Honda CB125 engine is the Honda CG125 engine but just the valves have changed as already mentioned, but remember the CB125 was before the internet, ask any old mechanic who has worked on them both.

Quote:
Also, what 'sports bike manufacturuer' uses a sleeved down 250 engine in their 125. Only bike I can think of that even comes close is the comet, and that's only just a commuter, never mind sports.


The bike was not a common brand like a Japanese one, I have tried to remember the manufacture and failed, the review was from a magazine.

The bike was reviewed this year and was a twin cylinder 250cc engine and a real sports bike frame and fairing with a very high price.

The review was for the 125cc version and it said it was the same exact bike but the engine sleeved down to 125cc.

I donít believe the 250cc engine version is imported in to the UK, but the 125cc was or is going to be?
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veeeffarr
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PostPosted: 11:34 - 04 Oct 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

Isn't the CB125 a twin?
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halo123.
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PostPosted: 11:48 - 04 Oct 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi toby maybe you on to something except they both naked


http://www.bikepics.com/honda/cb125/

http://www.motorcyclespecs.co.za/model/Honda/honda_cb250sc_00.htm

http://www.motorcyclespecs.co.za/model/Honda/honda_cb125t%2081.htm

Edit again without fairings but maybe something like this
http://www.motorcyclespecs.co.za/model/Hyosung/hyosung_gt_250%2004.htm

Then again could it be a hyosung comet or something similar they have a 125cc and 250 vtwins
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Last edited by halo123. on 12:01 - 04 Oct 2007; edited 1 time in total
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Kickstart
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PostPosted: 11:57 - 04 Oct 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spoon261 wrote:
Its also common knowledge about the Honda CB125 engine is the Honda CG125 engine but just the valves have changed as already mentioned, but remember the CB125 was before the internet, ask any old mechanic who has worked on them both.


While the CG and CB (single) engines are closely related, it is a lot more of a difference that just a different head for the cam and valves. There was a large family of OHC Honda engines (CB100N, XL185 are 2 other examples of closely related engines). The CG engine is quite cleverly designed for cheap production (ie, using the same cam for both the inlet and exhaust valves).

The 125 OHC engines were quite renowned for seizing the cams into the heads, or just destroying the cam "bearings" in the head (there was no bearing, that was part of the problem).

The 125 twin engine is different again, although I supect the mounting points to the frame are the same, or at last very close.

Spoon261 wrote:
The bike was reviewed this year and was a twin cylinder 250cc engine and a real sports bike frame and fairing with a very high price.


Sounds like the Hyosong that G mentioned.

All the best

Keith
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halo123.
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PostPosted: 12:05 - 04 Oct 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

oops i missed G with the comet first.
but thats most likely check the specs , they are almost identical exept the cc

edit
hyosung uk http://www.hyosung.co.uk/range.php
could also be gt125r /gt250r

(he he people gonna think i am spamming them site now with links)
but i am just bored at work.
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Spoon261
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PostPosted: 12:19 - 04 Oct 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

Toby R wrote:
Isn't the CB125 a twin?


2 versions are twins, but one was a single

http://www.usedbikeguide.com/bible/display.asp?id=480

http://www.usedbikeguide.com/bible/display.asp?id=481

http://www.usedbikeguide.com/bible/display.asp?id=119
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Spoon261
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PostPosted: 12:31 - 04 Oct 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

The only official history I can find on the Honda CG125 online, is from honda.

http://world.honda.com/history/challenge/1975cg125/index.html
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G
The Voice of Reason



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PostPosted: 13:50 - 04 Oct 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

halo123. wrote:
oops i missed G with the comet first.
but thats most likely check the specs , they are almost identical exept the cc

And I'd hardly call the comet a 'sports bike' - as far as I know it was developed from the SV650, which it's self is on the sporty side of commuting.
When they produced the 125 and 250 version, they however forgot to lose any significant weight, so it weighs almost as much as a SV650, but makes only a little more power than a CG.
Not really 'sports bike' material, instead a rather heavy commuter.
Suzuki stuck for fairings on their GS500, didn't mean it was a sports bike Smile.
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halo123.
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PostPosted: 14:15 - 04 Oct 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

yeah i realise that but was the most likely ( or so i thought then i saw the gtr s that hyosung have and realised that those were more likely to fall in the sport bike category) but that said bikez .com list the gs 500 as a sports bike oddly enough
and wht category would you say it normall falls in
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Kickstart
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PostPosted: 19:07 - 04 Oct 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

halo123. wrote:
but that said bikez .com list the gs 500 as a sports bike oddly enough


There seem to be more things wrong than right on that site.

All the best

Keith
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halo123.
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PostPosted: 09:14 - 05 Oct 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

bad research
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Spoon261
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PostPosted: 10:32 - 05 Oct 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does any of this sports bike or not, or which part of the engine is different in the CB125 vs the CG125, really make any difference?

Lets just put this in perspective.

I stated a 250cc engine has been sleeved down to make it 125cc.
Are we all agreed that we all no of an engine where that has been done.

The difference between the CB125 engine and the CG125 engine is in the valve system, that includes all the parts kickstart has mentioned.

You can all argue as much as you like what makes a sports bike.
Have a look at definitions on page 9 of the following file
http://www.mcia.co.uk/_Attachments/612_101CMS.pdf
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Kickstart
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PostPosted: 11:55 - 05 Oct 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spoon261 wrote:
Does any of this sports bike or not, or which part of the engine is different in the CB125 vs the CG125, really make any difference?

The difference between the CB125 engine and the CG125 engine is in the valve system, that includes all the parts kickstart has mentioned.


Yes, when the similarity is a vague external likeness, with the same basic shape so that no great changes in tooling are required.

Suspect that the parts that are actually the same are outnumbered by those that are different. Different heads, barrels, crankcases, cranks, valves, etc. OK Piston might be the same (but that will likely change between different markets with different fuel requriements) and the gearbox might be the same (but probably shared with the 125 twins).

There is about as much similarity as there is between a Ducati 1098 engine and a 900SS engine.

Certainly not a case that with a bit of juggling you could lob the top end of a CB125 engine onto a CG125 bottom end.

Spoon261 wrote:
I stated a 250cc engine has been sleeved down to make it 125cc.
Are we all agreed that we all no of an engine where that has been done.


Maybe, but hardly a common thing and when done it is to be cheap. Describing Hyosung as a sports bike maker is really stretching a point, although as in that case both the bore and stroke have changed it is not a simple sleeve down job.

All the best

Keith
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Spoon261
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PostPosted: 12:30 - 05 Oct 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

kickstart

I was correct, Haynes Honda CG125 workshop manual say the same as me, read it for yourself, about the CB125 and the CG125.

End of argument, if you want to take it further argue with Haynes not me.

I never said or mentioned Hyosung
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Kickstart
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PostPosted: 13:01 - 05 Oct 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spoon261 wrote:
I was correct, Haynes Honda CG125 workshop manual say the same as me, read it for yourself, about the CB125 and the CG125.


I have no Haynes on the CG125 but just look at the 2 engines and you will see. CB125 has no provision for a cam in the bottom end, a cam chain tunnel in the barrel, plus a totally different head. That is the 2 major components that are different as well as the head. It is obvious that, although superficially similar, they are different engines. Certainly not a case of a CB engine with a minor mod for the valve operation

Spoon261 wrote:
End of argument, if you want to take it further argue with Haynes not me.


They are not known as a "Haynes book of lies" for nothing.

Spoon261 wrote:
I never said or mentioned Hyosung


True, but you never argued and it is the only example anyone has come up with for a current 125 sports (ish) bike that might be a sleeved down 125.

All the best

Keith
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bish777
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PostPosted: 23:17 - 05 Oct 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spoon261 wrote:
kickstart

I was correct, Haynes Honda CG125 workshop manual say the same as me, read it for yourself, about the CB125 and the CG125.

End of argument, if you want to take it further argue with Haynes not me.


Haynes manuals are as accurate and true to life as a labour party spin doctor. Not to mention one book often tries to cover several models/revisions.

As Kickstart said, the CG and CB motors are different engines. Youll try and tell us the CB125T engine is the same as well now?
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Spoon261
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PostPosted: 02:14 - 06 Oct 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

bish777 wrote:
Spoon261 wrote:
kickstart

I was correct, Haynes Honda CG125 workshop manual say the same as me, read it for yourself, about the CB125 and the CG125.

End of argument, if you want to take it further argue with Haynes not me.


Haynes manuals are as accurate and true to life as a labour party spin doctor. Not to mention one book often tries to cover several models/revisions.

As Kickstart said, the CG and CB motors are different engines. Youll try and tell us the CB125T engine is the same as well now?


You did not read the post I made at 12:19 on 4th October did you?

Hears it again

Quote:
Toby R wrote:
Isn't the CB125 a twin?



2 versions are twins, but one was a single

http://www.usedbikeguide.com/bible/display.asp?id=480

http://www.usedbikeguide.com/bible/display.asp?id=481

http://www.usedbikeguide.com/bible/display.asp?id=119
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Spoon261
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PostPosted: 04:04 - 06 Oct 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kickstart

Where do you get your Honda CB125 information from?
Post a link to the technical details of the engine.

I have found some very basic information about there being several different changes over the years to the single cylinder Honda CB125.
one-piece cylinder head, two-piece cylinder head etc..

http://www.cyclechaos.com/wiki/Honda_CB125

I have also been reading about the Honda CG125 engine, it has also changed over the years.

If your argument is correct, you should also say the Honda CG125 has had several totally different engines and should have been renamed.

With all the many changes inside both the Honda CG125 and CB125, one thing has definitely staid the same.
Honda CG125 is overhead valve
Honda CB125 is overhead cam
And they both have the same bore and stroke

The only way to resolve this argument would be to get the technical specs for both the Honda CG125 and CB125 for the same year and made in the same country.

I have had to research the Honda CG125 and found there are several factoryís in different countryís. Problem is they are not all making the same Honda CG125.
At least I no for sure they were not around the year 2000, I have found several 4 speed gearboxís as well as the normal 5 speed. There are engine differences as well.

One thing I do no, all of this argument is totally irrelevant to my website page, it was about increasing the engine size of the Honda CG125. If you read the webpage how to increase engine size, you will see someone has used the exact information from the Honda TL125 (overhead cam) website to increase his Honda CG125 engine size.
The Honda TL125 website claims the CB125 engine is pretty much the same as the TL125, he claims the parts are often interchangeable.
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halo123.
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PostPosted: 09:04 - 06 Oct 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

okay everyone sit down and relax!!
The topic was [/quote] Post subject: it250 will it fit in a 125 honda cg/clone frame

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://www.bikepics.com/pictures/554105/
Will the engine in that bike fit in a honda cg 125 clone.
this bike http://www.huntermotorcycles.co.za/NewCarDisplay.aspx?Variant=5421

As i have the cg but have managed to bend the crank shaft with out breaking any covers so i think the engine quality is crap so i would maybe replace the engine with one of these if it fits.
(Nb i bent the crank by over revving and letting clutch out to fast , so now it eats stators( what i know as a magneto)(nb south africa)


and the answer was not with out a h*** of bodging.
then went randomly with an idea for another engine.
then out of control.
so all yall relax now ye hear??
hehe
Chill
And leave the topic alone
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