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My Pragmasis & Almax chains review

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woo
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PostPosted: 00:49 - 08 Aug 2012    Post subject: My Pragmasis & Almax chains review Reply with quote

I recently bought a 1.2 metre Pragmasis Protector chain which has 13mm links from Torc-Ancors.com now know as SecurityForBikes.com, and to be honest its actually great and practical for me.

It will take someone who is very strong and well built with the best bolt croppers to actually cut the chain in about maybe 5 mins to 10 mins but it wont be easy especially if the chain is kept of the ground.
However it is still better than the Oxford chain that I used to use which can be cut by my 16yr old brother in less than 30 seconds with a cheap bolt cropper.
Angle grinders will go through any chain but will make a lot of noise!

I got the chain which has an oversize end ring which gives the chain more length as shown the picture

The 1.2m chain easily fits in the seat compartment of my 2007 R1 so long as the sleeve is moved about.
And because the undertray is made from metal and not plastic it can actually support the weight of the chain without fear of the undertray breaking which is what happened on my older R1s

Here is a picture of the chain in my seat compartment:

https://i1158.photobucket.com/albums/p613/wooizm/IMG_1643.jpg

Here is a picture of the chain locking my bike:

https://i1158.photobucket.com/albums/p613/wooizm/IMG_1641.jpg

I currently also have an Almax chain which is kept at home for locking the bike as thats a 2metre, 16mm chain which is far too heavy and will not fit in the seat compartment

If you are thinking of getting a chain that is practical to carry around I highly recommend this chain which is the 13mm Pragmasis Protector chain with the oversized end ring.
Almax as yet do not do a 13mm chain.

When I went to vist Pragmasis up near Birmingham Steve was very friendly and helpful as we experimented with different lengths of chains to see if they would fit in my seat compartment

Their website is https://securityforbikes.com/index.php
Their phone number is 01827 286267

Out of all the chains for motorcycles the only ones I would recommend are Pragmasis Protector chains or Almax chains.

All the other motorcycle chains are made from very cheap metal which I even experimented with and croped my own oxford chain in 1.26 minutes which left me feeling gutted that if it was that easy for me to crop and I am a noob, those that steal bikes by cutting the chains could do it probably half the time it took me!
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woo
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PostPosted: 01:18 - 08 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you think this is spam then you need serious help!

Have we come to an age that when someone like me who has been on this forum since 14 Feburary 2005 has to worry about recommending motorcycle security to other fellow bikers has to worry about being branded with spam!

Use your bloody common sense look at length of time ive been here then if you still think its spam jump off a cliff as you have no common sense!!

If I find something that I believe can help others out and its a good product I will recommend it simple as, if people like you dont have the commonsense to distinguish between spam and a recommendation from another biker to another then you simply fail!

I have put links to their webiste and their contact number simply because they deserve it and if someone else is interested they have an easy link to it and dont have to faff about with google!

Bloody heck the cheek of it!
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Last edited by woo on 01:34 - 08 Aug 2012; edited 1 time in total
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Imonster
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PostPosted: 01:20 - 08 Aug 2012    Post subject: Re: My Pragmasis & Almax chains review Reply with quote

woo wrote:

I currently also have an Almax chain which is kept at home for locking the bike as thats a 2metre, 16mm chain which is far too heavy and will not fit in the seat compartment


Almax as yet do not do a 13mm chain.



So you're suggesting that if Almax were to bring out a 13mm chain you'd be over it like a shot, given that you use one for your home security? Otherwise, why not use the other brand at home too? Thinking
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woo
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PostPosted: 01:30 - 08 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

I bought the Almax chain in 2005 at the NEC show I think in Ally Pally and due to the weight of it had to keep it at home whilst using the terrible oxford chains for when I was out and about.

I only heard about the Pragmasis chains a couple of weeks ago from someone else on here who recommended them and then clicked on the link that they put and had look at their website and saw the 13mm chain and wondered if it would fit in my seat compartment so to be sure I rode from London on a sunday afternoon and went and visited Steve at his house and tried various different lengths of the chains and even tried the 16mm but that wouldnt fit lol

If Almax had a 13mm chain and it was the same quality as this and it was cheaper I would be over it like a shot but currently they dont so I was all over Pragmasis 13mm chain like a shot

If I could carry the Almax 16mm chain around I would but that chain is massive and weighs so much, back when I first got it, the Almax chain broke the undertray of my GSXR600 as it was made of plastic so I bought the lock bag and 3 of those broke (threading started to tear on the bag zips started to give) so I had to leave the Almax chain at home.

Now I have this chain I can relax a bit better when at work as my 05 R1 was stolen from a car park whislt I was at work in 2010 which left me pissed!
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ThoughtContro...
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PostPosted: 02:38 - 08 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the reason Almax don't do 13mm chains is because they market their chains as being uncroppable. A 13mm chain will be croppable and not give the same protection as a 16mm, Almax or not.
It is a lot more portable tho, but that's the trade off you make.
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U_W v2.0
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PostPosted: 06:45 - 08 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

almax definatly need to do a transport bag for thier chains. something like a tool roll or super duty pannier for it lol
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Jim Mc
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PostPosted: 07:03 - 08 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are they making swingarms out of carbon fibre these days or is it fake?

If it's only carbon, I reckon you could saw through that in seconds.
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ThoughtContro...
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PostPosted: 07:07 - 08 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

They used to do a deal with a free Kriega US10 with every chain/lock combo. Apparently they stopped it because people were selling them cheap on ebay, and Kriega thought it devalued their brand.

The US10 is great. I can easily store a 1.5m series III + Squire lock. You can even squeeze in a Xena XUL210 too. If you have 2L of milk explode inside it, it will even demonstrate how liquid proof it is Confused It lasts, it's just bloody expensive for a well made 10 litre bag.
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lilredmachine
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PostPosted: 07:39 - 08 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jim Mc wrote:
Are they making swingarms out of carbon fibre these days or is it fake?

If it's only carbon, I reckon you could saw through that in seconds.


Lol, it's a swingarm protector. You can see that in the photo.

Besides, carbon or lightweight ally, it can still be sawn through quite happily and quickly.
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Ichy
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PostPosted: 07:41 - 08 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

woo wrote:


Have we come to an age that when someone like me who has been on this forum since 14 Feburary 2005 has to worry about recommending motorcycle security to other fellow bikers has to worry about being branded with spam!



You have to get use to ignoring it there are far too many gimps ready to negative rate posts, it makes them feel 'special'.

Anyway....
Interesting post. Like you I'm willing to compromise security for useability. I'll certainly take a look. Out of interest what lock are you using?
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 08:22 - 08 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, that's a properly helpful review. That "noose ring" is one of those things that once you see it, you wonder why everyone doesn't do it. Thumbs Up

Actually, it's such a good idea that it's "temporarily out of stock". Very Happy
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woo
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PostPosted: 08:34 - 08 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

lol a swing arm for a sports bike made out of carbon.....lol

No its a carbon swing arm protector stuck on with glue which protects it from damage such as stone chips as my model is prone to getting stone chips on swing arm.
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DrDonnyBrago
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PostPosted: 09:36 - 08 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

+1 to the noose ring being a great idea Doh! .

Like the review Thumbs Up .
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Joncrete Cungle
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PostPosted: 09:44 - 08 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good review I have a 13mm Pragamsis chain that just about coils up and fits under the seat on the NC35. Thumbs Up
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colicabcadam
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PostPosted: 09:52 - 08 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

how can you state it will take 5 - 10 minutes to crop ?

where did you get this figure from ? is it just an assumption?
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woo
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PostPosted: 10:09 - 08 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Steve the owner of the business told me that he had the tests done and those were the results I chose to believe him, hopefully i wont have to find out how strong they are against bolt croppers, if you want further information on the facts check out their website
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colicabcadam
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PostPosted: 10:29 - 08 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

woo wrote:
Steve the owner of the business told me that he had the tests done and those were the results I chose to believe him, hopefully i wont have to find out how strong they are against bolt croppers, if you want further information on the facts check out their website


ever thought he's a sales person ? bollocks can that 13mm chain last over 5 minutes with bolt croppers !!!

the links are too small, the croppers wont have to be opened wide to attack them, which is what makes cropping hard work
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woo
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PostPosted: 10:40 - 08 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

well what ever they are they better than my old oxford piece of tin chain
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Joncrete Cungle
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PostPosted: 10:42 - 08 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

From the pragmasis website.

Quote:
The Motorcycle Gold test on the Protector 13mm chain (July 2009) resulted in a brand new set of Irwin Record 42" bolt croppers having their straps being bent such that the jaws no longer line up and the jaws themselves were also wrecked. This was a very determined attack but the chain did fail in the end. We are unable to crop the 13mm chain as it needs someone with a lot more weight to do it.

However, even the very best sub-16mm chains are marginal at the new Motorcycle Gold standard as that test is performed by big guys. Whether thieves are all big enough, regularly so determined and frequently wrecking 'their' croppers is another matter, but we still recommend that you use a minimum of a 16mm chain if you are protecting any item where that type of attack is common. Much better to have security that gives you confidence rather than something where the thief may well get lucky.


Last edited by Joncrete Cungle on 10:49 - 08 Aug 2012; edited 1 time in total
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sickpup
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PostPosted: 10:45 - 08 Aug 2012    Post subject: Re: My Pragmasis & Almax chains review Reply with quote

woo wrote:
Angle grinders will go through any chain but will make a lot of noise!


No they don't, especially if you use plasma cutting blades.
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Pragma
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PostPosted: 12:11 - 08 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi,

Steve here, from Pragmasis.

Joncrete Cungle wrote:
From the pragmasis website.

Quote:
The Motorcycle Gold test on the Protector 13mm chain (July 2009) resulted in a brand new set of Irwin Record 42" bolt croppers having their straps being bent such that the jaws no longer line up and the jaws themselves were also wrecked. This was a very determined attack but the chain did fail in the end. We are unable to crop the 13mm chain as it needs someone with a lot more weight to do it.

However, even the very best sub-16mm chains are marginal at the new Motorcycle Gold standard as that test is performed by big guys. Whether thieves are all big enough, regularly so determined and frequently wrecking 'their' croppers is another matter, but we still recommend that you use a minimum of a 16mm chain if you are protecting any item where that type of attack is common. Much better to have security that gives you confidence rather than something where the thief may well get lucky.


Quite right, even if I say so myself Smile __If__ you can carry a decent 16mm, use that. If you can't, which is a common problem, you have to choose something else. We do _not_ guarantee our 13mm as uncroppable because you need at least 16mm and properly made at that, to be confident it can't be cropped. It took about 3.5 minutes to cut our 13mm at one of the tests, but someone even bigger (than 6'4" 20+ stone) could potentially cut it quicker. A lot of scrotes are not that big and not that determined, but you might be unlucky if one comes along and you are using a sub-16mm chain. That's the trade-off: if it's 16mm or nothing and portability means it has to be nothing (or just a disc lock/alarm/etc), then you're leaving yourself open to the whole range of thieves; if it's a decent 13mm and kept off the floor, it is likely to stop the majority of them.

Interestingly, some people go for a 14mm but in our experience, they are generally about the same weight as a decent 16mm and they can be very marginal as the heat treatment etc has to be spot on to get them good enough. (We recently heard about two batches of Chinese-made 14mm that has failed tests, and who knows what the quality has been like between the tests.) You may as well use a 16mm and do it properly, __if__ the weight is not an issue. If the weight _is_ an issue, you have to choose something else and when my wife and I have been staying away at a hotel on the bikes, we've always used a 13mm as the 16mm is great for home but too heavy to carry.

I hope that helps,

Steve.
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T0MMY
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PostPosted: 00:54 - 09 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

If you are thinking of getting a chain that is practical to carry around I highly recommend this chain which is the 13mm Pragmasis Protector chain with the oversized end ring.


Quote:

Out of all the chains for motorcycles the only ones I would recommend are Pragmasis Protector chains or Almax chains.


These lines were a bit home shopping channel Laughing

This is clearly spam; the owner of the company then pops up a few hours later?

Hey if it's relevant though...
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Im-a-Ridah
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PostPosted: 08:04 - 09 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Of course if you make it really secure, they'll just break into your house and steal the keys.
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woo
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PostPosted: 08:04 - 09 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

TOMMY

If you think this is SPAM then can you tell me how to rewrite my review without it sounding like or appearing like SPAM?
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