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smegballs
World Chat Champion



Joined: 28 Oct 2007
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PostPosted: 14:20 - 31 Jul 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Does anyone else think it's rediculous that as, generally, law abiding folks we have to be so paranoid about carrying a knife and 'put it in the toolbox' just in case...

Carrying a knife on my belt is no more likely to make any of us stabbists than if the same knife is stowed in a toolbox, likewise if we wanted to shank a bitch, a brief pause to retrieve knife from said toolbox isn't a big obstacle to overcome.

In portugal I'll wear my leatherman on my belt in town without thinking and if in the countryside/villages wear my sheath knife. No fucks are given, I don't go around stabbing folks left, right and centre and there is no problem at all. Portuguese opinion is that a knife is by default a tool, whereas over here it seems a knife defaults to a weapon.
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Rogerborg
nimbA



Joined: 26 Oct 2010
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PostPosted: 14:36 - 31 Jul 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Some hippy linking to a defunct source 6 years ago wrote:
a new study of 28 countries found 13% of violent crime victims in England and Wales had been stabbed or threatened with a knife. Scotland came close behind. Only Spain and Portugal had worse figures

Well, if you can't believe that, I just give up.
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.....
Quote Me Happy



Joined: 15 Jan 2005
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PostPosted: 14:47 - 31 Jul 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Rogerborg wrote:
Joe wrote:
You have to remember that you are allowed to carry such knives with a good reason. Being an engineer who uses one at work is a good reason although you may want to chuck it in the boot of your car or with your other tools when travelling to and from work.

Didn't work for the Director General of the Institution of Civil Engineers.

https://metro.co.uk/2006/11/20/brigadier-held-for-knife-on-train-400495/


Nope, but he wasn't on his way home from work with the knife in the boot of his car, he was travelling to another country.
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Im-a-Ridah
World Chat Champion



Joined: 20 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: 16:50 - 31 Jul 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Polarbear wrote:
I always have a multi tool on me. Always carried one since I became a qualified engineer and now carry a leatherman wave.

The problem with this is it has locking blades but I was told from just about day 1 of my apprenticeship never to use a folding knife that didn't have a locking blade due to the risk of it closing on your fingers if you misuse it.

I suppose if I get pulled for speeding or something and they come the cunt I am potentially looking at a prison sentence.

Stupid law.


Most Engineers don't really use tools, except of the pen/paper/computer type.

Rogerborg wrote:

Didn't work for the Director General of the Institution of Civil Engineers.

https://metro.co.uk/2006/11/20/brigadier-held-for-knife-on-train-400495/


Exactly my point. It's not actually illegal, but meh, arrest you anyways, 'cos I can. They know you won't get convicted at court, but you still have the indignity of being carted off in a police van through a busy train station and the inconvenience of a night in the cells and a day in court. Police effectively get the power to dish out 2 day jail terms and public humiliation to anyone they want to, and there will be no comeback for them.

Then again, it is a police state (due to the useless lazy incompetent citizens).

Polarbear wrote:

I quite agree, and never ever use a flat bladed screwdriver as a chisel Whistle

A multi tool is a wonderful bit of kit for those quick simple jobs and if it saves me a long walk back to the van, Thumbs Up


Don't know why anyone would. You can get a half decent chisel from poundland Thumbs Up
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Rogerborg
nimbA



Joined: 26 Oct 2010
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PostPosted: 17:48 - 31 Jul 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Im-a-Ridah wrote:
[Carrying a knife other than a folding pocket knife in public is] not actually illegal

Do you really, genuinely believe that, or are you on a wind up? Thinking
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Im-a-Ridah
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Joined: 20 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: 18:55 - 31 Jul 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Rogerborg wrote:
Im-a-Ridah wrote:
[Carrying a knife other than a folding pocket knife in public is] not actually illegal

Do you really, genuinely believe that, or are you on a wind up? Thinking


It isn't. We've even shown you the legislation. In reality it is illegal because police decide the law for themselves.
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Rogerborg
nimbA



Joined: 26 Oct 2010
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PostPosted: 20:06 - 31 Jul 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Im-a-Ridah wrote:
It isn't [illegal]. We've even shown you the legislation.

OK, you're on a wind up. Nice try, I'm not biting any more. Wink
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Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike
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Im-a-Ridah
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Joined: 20 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: 02:17 - 01 Aug 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Rogerborg wrote:
Im-a-Ridah wrote:
It isn't [illegal]. We've even shown you the legislation.

OK, you're on a wind up. Nice try, I'm not biting any more. Wink


What a strange reaction Confused
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Rogerborg
nimbA



Joined: 26 Oct 2010
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PostPosted: 08:43 - 01 Aug 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
I know, right, but I can't cite the actual wording any more than I already have, so I have to assume that you're just having a laugh.
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Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
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grr666
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Joined: 16 Jun 2014
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PostPosted: 09:22 - 01 Aug 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Like anybody who works with tools, at any given time I carry in my van a number of items that can be used
to kill or injure a person in a variety of imaginative ways. And most of the stuff needed to then section a
corpse into smaller parts, and of course the room inside away from prying eyes to perform either act.
It's never concerned me that what might be in the van may get me nicked, I'll worry about that when
and if I need to.
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ScaredyCat
World Chat Champion



Joined: 19 May 2012
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PostPosted: 09:33 - 01 Aug 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Rogerborg wrote:
Didn't work for the Director General of the Institution of Civil Engineers.

https://metro.co.uk/2006/11/20/brigadier-held-for-knife-on-train-400495/


Well, if you're the type that needs to get on a train to sharpen your pencils then you deserve everything you get.
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Jmoan
Brolly Dolly



Joined: 18 Nov 2015
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PostPosted: 19:36 - 18 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Rogerborg wrote:


Polarbear wrote:
The problem with this is it has locking blades

Which as you surmise means that it's not a folding pocket knife. Sad

https://www.bailii.org/cgi-bin/markup.cgi?doc=/ew/cases/EWCA/Crim/1998/385.html




Presumably the moronic appeal case only applies to England and Wales. The irony is there are plenty of knives which don't have locking mechanisms but won't close on your fingers if you hold it.
This for example.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=STBu90KHsSw
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Rogerborg
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Joined: 26 Oct 2010
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PostPosted: 20:31 - 18 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Curious bump, but let's go.

Jmon wrote:
Rogerborg wrote:
https://www.bailii.org/cgi-bin/markup.cgi?doc=/ew/cases/EWCA/Crim/1998/385.html

Presumably the moronic appeal case only applies to England and Wales.

Yes, but I wouldn't bet on a different interpretation in Scotland.


Jmon wrote:
The irony is there are plenty of knives which don't have locking mechanisms but won't close on your fingers if you hold it.
This for example.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=STBu90KHsSw

I would have no doubt that knife would fall foul of the current case law in England and Wales:

Appeals backing Divisional wrote:
to be "a folding pocket-knife" the blade has to be readily and immediately foldable at all times simply by the folding process.

Their underlining. If it won't fold while you're holding it (which is when it's usable as a weapon, right?) then it's not immediately foldable.

I can't see that the exact mechanism for preventing it folding matters.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike
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Im-a-Ridah
World Chat Champion



Joined: 20 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: 05:46 - 19 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Rogerborg wrote:
Curious bump, but let's go.

Jmon wrote:
Rogerborg wrote:
https://www.bailii.org/cgi-bin/markup.cgi?doc=/ew/cases/EWCA/Crim/1998/385.html

Presumably the moronic appeal case only applies to England and Wales.

Yes, but I wouldn't bet on a different interpretation in Scotland.


Jmon wrote:
The irony is there are plenty of knives which don't have locking mechanisms but won't close on your fingers if you hold it.
This for example.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=STBu90KHsSw

I would have no doubt that knife would fall foul of the current case law in England and Wales:

Appeals backing Divisional wrote:
to be "a folding pocket-knife" the blade has to be readily and immediately foldable at all times simply by the folding process.

Their underlining. If it won't fold while you're holding it (which is when it's usable as a weapon, right?) then it's not immediately foldable.

I can't see that the exact mechanism for preventing it folding matters.


Pointless law though really. All they need to do is drill a hole in the handle, then put some kind of pin or small screw through the hole before using it, then remove after use. Lock knife, without the lock!
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Old Thread Alert!

The last post was made 8 years, 159 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful?
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