Continuing woes with the KZ1000 clutch/gears

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The old fella's Kawasaki KZ1000 (1977/78 - classic UJM) is still giving him trouble. Symptoms: very hard to get into neutral as in physically difficult to lift the lever up (not the typical skipping past neutral on the way from 1st to 2nd happens with some bikes.)

What we did today was strip the clutch assembly down, cleaned and lubed everything (and yes, we put the ball bearing back!) and did all the adjustments. This time though I at least made sure some decent 10W40 motorbike oil went in

Made a marginal difference Note that it's a little easier to get into neutral from cold than with a hot engine.

This all started happening after renewing the clutch plates. With the old ones the clutch was slipping and definitely at the wear limit when we measured them. Of course the old fella's blaming the new plates and we're both thinking clutch drag...

However, with regards to clutch drag in my experience there's a notable difference trying to walk back a bike in neutral vs. 1st + clutch in; not much but something. This KZ1000 isn't offering much resistance with the same test so I'm wondering if it even is clutch drag fucking up neutral selection

I can only think of something up with the gear selector drum assembly but stripping the bottom-end apart is not a job either of us fancy
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Husqvarna Vitpilen 401, Yamaha XSR700, Honda Rebel, Yamaha DT175, Suzuki SV650 (loan) Fazer 600, Keeway Superlight 125, 50cc turd scooter

[Nobby the Bastard]

Did you check the drum for wear on the bits where the clutch plates slide against it?
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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha:"Remember this simple rule - scooters are for men who like to feel the breeze on their huge, flapping cunt lips."
Sprint ST 1050

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[jaffa90]

Hi, ( Note that it's a little easier to get into neutral from cold than with a hot engine.)
Do you know the idle speed with the engine cold & hot?

[Nobby the Bastard]

Don't start with your idle speed shit again.
____________________
trevor saxe-coburg-gotha:"Remember this simple rule - scooters are for men who like to feel the breeze on their huge, flapping cunt lips."
Sprint ST 1050

[stinkwheel]

You haven't got a dished washer behind the basket in the wrong way round?

Don't know if zeds have one but other bikes do.

EDIT: Kaswasakis also have a neutral position detent roller on a spring that engages in a recess on the selector drum in the gear selector mechanism when it's in the heutral position. Part 23. It's quite flimsy, as is the spring on it. https://www.cmsnl.com/kawasaki-kz1000d3-z1r-1980-canada_model15398/partslist/66493.html

For what it's worth, I've had problems with the primary selector on EX500 motors where the hooks on the gear selector (Part 8) which grabs the drum and rotates it became worn/deformed and needed dressing off with a file. This tended to cause "dead" shifts where they failed to engage properly though rasther than increased effort. I know on the EX500 motors, you could get at all of the primary selector without having to split the engine, it was under its own cover which was located behind the final drive sprocket (and isn't immediately obvious to see because the screws are usually totally filled with chain yack and under a deflector plate).

Looks from the fisches like Zeds also have a seperate transmission cover. (part 21) https://www.cmsnl.com/kawasaki-kz1000d3-z1r-1980-canada_model15398/partslist/66478.html

A lot of the selector parts under that cover are just made of stamped steel plate, they would be easily bent/mangled if you apply a lot of force to the gear lever.
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“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.”
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.

[struan80]

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[stinkwheel]

[Robby]

If it was fine before you did the clutch plates, and it's bad afterwards, you probably cocked up something when you did the plates.

Chain tension can also be a factor. Did you tension the chain for good measure after having it all apart?

[Easy-X]

[WD Forte]

have you tried putting it on the main stand and
whilst rocking the rear wheel back and forth, selecting gears?
It should be quite easy to go up and down the box unless the selectors are fooked and may help decide where the problem lays.
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bikers smell of wee

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[stinkwheel]

Worth noting that if you do decide to go into the external selector housing that it's wet but when I did it on my GPZs, you could lean it way over to the right against a wall and remove the cover without having to drain the oil.
____________________
“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.”
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.

[sickpup]

Could be the stack height. Take out a couple of the new plates and put a couple of the old ones back in and see if it's any easier.

[MCN]

Have yous tried switching it off then switching it in again?

I would put money on an assembly error. Its not toooo crazy to whip the clutch out again.

Clasping at straws here,, re-clutch drag, did yous soak the new plates?
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Disclaimer: The comments above may be predicted text and not necessarily the opinion of MCN.

[Easy-X]

Quick update. Up until last week the clutch was still giving the old fella troubles and to top it off the other day the cable snapped (one of the ends went.)

He couldn't get the right replacement so tried one billed as for a Z650. It's a bit long but now the clutch works perfectly. There's zero slack in the cable but there's no slip in the higher gears / rev range.

Can only put the previous woes down to cable routing
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Husqvarna Vitpilen 401, Yamaha XSR700, Honda Rebel, Yamaha DT175, Suzuki SV650 (loan) Fazer 600, Keeway Superlight 125, 50cc turd scooter

[A100man]

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