For Wildgoose (not what I promised, hope it's ok for now?)

Mr Lucky · Spanner Monkey Joined: 10 Nov 2002 Karma :

Part 2...

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Chains.

Seen my chain? Looks well clean usually and there is a simple reason for that.

I clean it. Lubing a chain is only part of looking after it. There is simply no point lubricating a chain if all you are doing is spraying lubricant onto dirt. It’s the best grinding paste mixture I can think of. A chain needs to be cleaned on a regular basis. It seems that everyone does it differently but I clean mine with WD-40 and an old tooth brush. I douse the chain with WD40 or brake cleaner if I want to get really high, being vary careful to avoid getting it onto my invariably shagged out rear tyre. I then work the tooth brush around both sides of the link faces and also on the rollers. Working all of the way around the chain. I regularly rinse the brush in a spray cap filled with the blood of innocents, sorry, WD40. Then I slowly wipe the chain with a soft clean cotton cloth until it is dry and the entire link faces and rollers are clean. Being this close to the thing that takes all of the power from your engine to your back wheel is a real eye opener. You can shock yourself with what you find. Of course if you carry out this maintenance with the engine running and in first gear with the bike on the centre/paddock stand the only thing you will find out is how efficient your local hospital casualty department is.

Anyway, getting this down and dirty with your chain means you can find out how many tight spots your chain has as well as what condition the chain rollers and sprockets. The clean rollers may show signs of pitting or even chipping or cracks. They may even rattle like loose beads on a tight piece of elastic when you move the chain (dead o/x-rings). All signs of wear. Your sprocket teeth should have about 2mm of flat edge at their tops. If your back sprocket is worn then imagine what the front one that turns approximately three times as much for any given wheel revolution looks like! If they are sharp like knife blades then you are in dire need of replacements. They may even, if viewed from the side, look hooked. After your chain is sparkly clean adjust it if necessary (refer to your handbook or Haynes manual for the specifics for your bike). Always adjust the chain at its tightest point. Meaning, turn the rear wheel and look at the bottom chain run. The chain may rise and fall as you turn the wheel. The point where it rises is a 'tight' spot'. It’s when the chain is at this position when you need to adjust the chain. You may be tempted to adjust the chain at its slackest point 'just to be sure'. Please feel free to do this if you are desperate need to have your gearbox output shaft bearing fail on you at high speed, locking the wheel and ending your life in a violent, fiery ball of blood.

Now contrary to popular belief chains do not 'stretch' in any way as much as people will have you believe. The stretching effect is in fact excessive wear between the rollers and the pins that holds the chain links together. This wear comes from the grinding paste you thought was lubing your chain for the last five weekends since you last wasted money by spraying expensive chain wax onto road crud. Or maybe your chain is as dry as a bone and you wondered why you burned your hand on it last time you checked the tension after a ride. Either way, you are killing your chain, sprockets and wasting money on useless chain lube. Next time you replace your chain take the old one and lay it on a flat surface like a concrete garage floor. Lay it as it would run on your sprockets, that is, with the chain links plates sitting on their edges and the rollers 'rolling' along the ground. Now, keeping the chain flat to the floor slowly pull the chain. It will probably move in the same way a goods train pulls away when it has lots of carriages attached. The front will move and then all the slack in the links will be taken up and eventually the last link will move too. All of that you have just witnessed is wear. Still keeping the chain on the ground try bending the link you are holding to one side. I have seen chains so worn that they can almost make a semi-circle. I have also seen chains that look like new, sparkling clean and all but have very little life left in them. Sprocket wear and the 'lift test' give the game away.

You may be glad to read that you can see how worn your link rollers and pins are without removing the chain. Take hold of any link that is currently sitting on your rear sprocket and see if you can lift the link away from the sprocket. If it lifts to and degree then its time for a visit to hunters motorcycles or a browse through the chain and sprocket section in the 'Busters 'Catalogue. Make sure you repeat this 'lifting' test over various points of your chain to get a good indication of how goosed your chain is. Replacing a chain and not replacing anything remotely like perfect sprockets is absolute madness. The worn sprockets will kill your brand new chain faster than any rust or grinding paste lubrication

Worn and poorly adjusted chains are the easiest way for your bike to loose between 8-15bhp between the engine and the rear wheel on a mid range/large motorcycle. Just think how your bike would feel with an extra 8-15bhp. Most £800 full race exhaust systems wouldn't give a power increase that high! It also means smoother gear changes and less false neutrals too. And for those of you who put the miles in touring it means improved economy.

You've cleaned and adjusted your chain and you may have even bothered to clean your rear sprocket. I suggest you do the job properly and also clean the inside of your front sprocket cover (there are things as big as stones and bolt heads hiding in there, believe me!) and the inside of your chain guard. Other wise all of your hard work will be ruined in seconds when black goo is reunited with your clean chain.

Then sigh with delight as you spin the wheel and apply the fresh, virginal chain lube to your clean chain, listen as the chain goes from metallic rattle to silky smooth swish. Apply the lube to the rollers and inside the link faces. Do this by first applying the lube to the inside faces of the chain a little way in front of the rear sprocket. Then once you have done all the way around maybe twice apply the lube to the outside face of the rollers just as the chain leaves the sprocket an the top run back to the engine. Replace your chain guard and front sprocket cover and count your fingers, you should have five on each hand.

Double check that all bolts that you slackened to adjust the chain have now been tightened to the correct torque (I don't know, look in the manual) and your wheel is adjusted straight and true with the swing arm and run of the chain. There are various ways to check wheel alignment and I am not going into them here, except to say that it is crucial for safety reason and for reasons of chain wear (yet again) to make sure your rear wheel is aligned correctly.

People with Scottoilers will have their own arcane way of looking after their chain, involving flow rates and drip rates and nozzle positions.

They can tell you all about how their chain will outlive them and this is all very impressive in their own minds but people with Scottoilers are invariably single and collect beer mats.

Some bikes just kill chains due to appalling cush drive design, ask any ZZR600/1100 owner.

People with shaft drive bikes need to check for a pulse...

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https://www.labusas.org

WildGoose · White Van Man Joined: 21 Mar 2002 Karma :

thanks a lot mr lucky, i really appreciate that

im now sufficiently scared into selling my bike, and im goin to buy a Runner 180 Confused

do you ride your Busa 365 days a year?
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So in other words, he stopped you for being flagrantly in posession of a motorcycle in direct contravention of the Hippies, Darkies and People Whose Face I Don't Like The Look of (Police Powers) Act. 1976

Mr Lucky · Spanner Monkey Joined: 10 Nov 2002 Karma :

Why does that scare you? I thought you would find it helpful maybe? Sad

Sorry I didn't mean to do anything wrong... Sad

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https://www.labusas.org

Mr Lucky · Spanner Monkey Joined: 10 Nov 2002 Karma :

I can't due to my work but I do ride it when I can.

How about this for a winter mauling!

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And the back end!

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Just in case you were thinking of throwing that 'fair weather biker' tag my way... Wink

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WildGoose · White Van Man Joined: 21 Mar 2002 Karma :

its scary cos ive been killing my chain and sprockets for 4000 km's

<trademark ignorance> i had no idea a "real" bike needed so much home maintenence </trademark ignorance>

how often does it need to be cleaned like that, its gonna be every week right?
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So in other words, he stopped you for being flagrantly in posession of a motorcycle in direct contravention of the Hippies, Darkies and People Whose Face I Don't Like The Look of (Police Powers) Act. 1976

Mr Lucky · Spanner Monkey Joined: 10 Nov 2002 Karma :

Time to suck on some more of my drivel...

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OK here's another one for you all take unreasonable offence at and bleat on about like a bunch of ZZR owners. "Dear Anne Robinson, why oh why oh why do we pay a licence fee just to put up with the rantings of Mr Shaw etc etc etc blah blah blah..."

I need not respond to the Wylam Wildcard's last comments...

Tyres.

A sticky one this (yes it’s a pun, well spotted). Do you go for supper sticky knee down superglue compound or do you go for 'Lego-Tourmasters'. Believe me, I've seen most of you lot ride, you are only kidding yourselves if you get the sticky stuff. (Joke! JOKE! I was Joking for Christ's sakes! Except for the people who wasted their money on race rep 400's. Here we go again!)

Whatever you get you need to get the right tool for the job. I personally am quite happy to try out various makes of tyres and experiment with pressures but that is because I only get three figure mileages from mine. Expect your tyres to wear out rapidly if you do any of the following

Excessive miles on straight roads.

Accelerate and brake hard.

Carry a pillion regularly.

Wheelie.

Drag race.

Track days.

Run lower pressures than is recommended.

I usually run my rear tyre at 42psi and front at 38psi when I am two up. If I know I am going to play one up in the twisties I will drop the pressure in both tyres slightly. This means that the tyres reach operating temperature quickly and stay warmer, thus increasing grip. It is easy to get the tyres too hot and pass through that grip window so it is essential that I do not drop pressures to much. All that will happen then is that the tyre will over heat and loose grip. If it looses grip then it is wearing out quicker and I am costing myself money and risking my neck. Those that do track days will know all about altering tyre pressures.

So as you can see best grip does not sit comfortably with best mileage and it is a compromise. Refer to the owner’s manual and see what is recommended for your bike and your riding style.

Always check your tyre pressures when the tyre is 'cold'. Even a journey of half a mile is enough to heat up the air inside the tyre and give a higher, false reading. When up to operating temperature a difference of 5-7lbs per square inch tyre pressure difference from cold is normal. So you can see that checking your tyre pressures at this point is then irrelevant and could be dangerous.

When your tyres do wear out then you will find a huge difference in handling. This is not necessarily noticeable as the tyre wears but is really apparent once you fit new ones. Fronts usually wear on the sides due to the fact that they steer the bike in an unusual way, using the differing radius of the tyre across its profile to 'counter steer' the bike around a corner. This takes its toll on the sides while the centre gets a relatively easy life (excepting braking forces), especially under acceleration. Alan Headley's front tyre hardly touches the ground so his lasts for ages! The front tyre takes the load under braking and when cornering under neutral or trailing throttle. It tends to under steer (you would rarely notice this action in normal riding conditions) or 'run wide'. Here is where the experienced cry "I never enter a corner on a closed throttle or on the front brake! I always go through with power on! etc etc blah blah yawn". Yes you do is the answer. You will be surprised just how much force you will put through your front tyre when you are tootleing around town and rolling around roundabouts in traffic. It all takes its toll on the shoulders as the narrower profile with the smaller contact patch rolls around with all the bike weight on it, especially when you are braking. "I never brake into corners!" Oh shut up! This wear is magnified on the shoulders by the way a motorcycle uses its front wheel to steer too. And of course, the faster you go around a corner, the further you lean so harder the wear towards the sides (Not applicable to you Mally). The consequence with a shafted front tyre means that the steering of the bike takes on a strange 'doesn't want to turn and then AAAGH drops into the corner like a stone!' feel once you bank the bike over to a certain point. Couple that with a rear tyre that is worn out in the centre and life gets remarkably focused very quickly.

The rear tyre will always wear out in the centre unless you do a lot of fast track days. The rear tyre takes huge acceleration forces, mostly when the bike is close to the upright position and does not get subject to the forces that the front tyre does (well we can talk about slip angles and dynamic and passive rear wheel steering but you would bore me to death and that's my job, write your own rant!)

Add some luggage and a pillion and a few miles of motorway or some exciting throttle action combined with every inline four riders favourite, engine braking, and you can kiss Bridgestone's promise of dual compound improving wear rates goodbye. Everybody has seen that squared off look on a big bike rear tyre. To get an idea of how much contact patch is being chewed away from a big cc machines rear tyre follow Geordie on his Blackbird on a warm day. When Tyres reach operating temperature they develop a sheen at the contact patch this sheen runs around the tyre as a black line about as wide as the palm of my hand (I have small hands). As the bike leans you can watch the black shiny strip move towards the edge of the tyre and as Geordie brings the bike back to the upright position, the shiny strip moves back to the centre. Hot rubber constantly wearing away. Just looking at it gives you a sense of tyre biting into tarmac. It’s hypnotic to see and it is a sign that the tyre is doing its job well and giving its life in the process. Sad but true.

All of this wobble handling due to wear will start to happen, albeit gradually, long before the tyres reach their legal tread depth limit of 1mm (1.6mm for cars).

Around the tyre there are things called wear bars or Tread Wear Indicators. These are blocks of tread that sit in the groove or the tyre that break up the tread shape when the tread reaches a certain depth. Ideally you should replace your tyres before they reach this wear point. With tyre deals on The Hill like never before there is no excuse for worn-out tyres. If a dealer is trying to sell you a bike with worn tyres, even if they have a few miles left on them, demand new ones fitted before you collect the bike. Dealers will try to maximise profit in many ways and this is just one of the way they do it. That is why you never see dealers fitting new tyres to second-hand bikes before they are bought by anyone. My Exup sat with an absolutely ragged front tyre in a dealer’s showroom for a good long time. They even put tyre polish on the damn thing! It was dead! There was more life in a graveyard than there was in that front BT56! If someone bought that bike without a new tyre on it then the dealer has just saved the cost of a new front tyre and mechanic labour time to offset against the trade in price. Bingo, a few more quid saved for them and a punter replacing it in a month’s time anyway. More cash in their coffers.

Buying private, knock the price of replacement tyre off the asking price. Even if they are new but mismatched point that out and try to yank some cash back to sort it. Mismatched tyres are just as bad and dangerous as worn tyres in some cases (and can be an MOT failure) and do you know if the Pirelli Dragon Corsa front has the same profile as the Avon AV50 rear? Exactly!

Remember. Get the right tyres for the right job. Do some homework regarding speed ratings and recommended manufacture fitment. Then, if you want to some time in the future you can mess around as I and no doubt a few other experienced riders in the club do, with different profiles for turn in rates etc.

Of course worn tyres are also very prone to punctures due to the fact that there is less tread protecting the carcass...

Can you guess what the last post is going to be about?

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Kickstart · The Oracle Joined: 04 Feb 2002 Karma :

Mmmm, you will have fun changing the rear pads. Bloody Suzuki calipers.

All the best

Keith
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Traxpics, track day and racing photographs - Bimota Forum - Bike performance / thrust graphs for choosing gearing

Mr Lucky · Spanner Monkey Joined: 10 Nov 2002 Karma :

Finally my penance is done. Yours dear reader (if indeed there are any reading this diatribe) is almost at an end too.

Read on, for the sakes of the children if not for your own...

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OK then the last bit and owners of Italian sportsbike (is there such a thing?) may wish to skip this last one...

Brake Discs and Pads.

Possibly the most difficult to check at a glance and certainly the least obvious as they are hidden away in many cases, unless you ride a Ducrapi and then they can be found bouncing off the Hayabusa fairing that is following behind. But even there, there lies a cautionary tip!

Don't be scared to pull off the dust/inspection covers on the callipers that protect the pads. Many pads have a groove slotted in the 'meat' of the pad face. The opposite to a wear marker of a tyre, when the pad wears the groove eventually disappears when there is about 2mm of pad material left. Time to replace! If the pad seems to have worn unevenly across its surface, font to rear (if it looks like a wedge basically) or if one pad is worn heavily and the other looks comparably fresh then all signs point to a tedious strip down of the calliper to free off seized brake piston. They may free off, they may not, in which case it’s a new calliper and they are far from cheap.

Even if you do manage to get the pistons out of the calliper can you guarantee they will be salvageable?

Front brake calliper seal kit for Hayabusa £39.00 per side (set only not available individually)

Front brake calliper piston kit for Hayabusa £91.00 per side (set only not available individually)

All prices plus VAT.

Ouch! So are ya feelin' lucky punk? Are ya? Step away from the calliper and raise your tools above your head!

What state are the pins in that the pads slide on? Still have the retaining clips? Corroded to bollocks? Never going to come out no matter how many God's you pray to?

Or maybe it does just need new pads. Phew! Worn pads let a little more heat through than new ones so brakes fade earlier and won't be as effective

Or...

Oh great the last owner has put the latest Kevlar VESRAH green coloured all singing all dancing pads in! Fab! But they have shafted the discs because the discs were worn and couldn't dissipate the extra heat generated by the super frictiony (it’s a technical term ok?) pads and now the discs are warped! Which is confirmed when you test ride the bike and if you are lucky there is a pulsing feeling through the front brake lever under your fingers, or if you are unlucky the front end shimmies and shakes so violently under braking that your vision is blurred and some of the fairing mounts have actually started to stress-fracture. Oh no wait, the owner says it’s just the front wheel needs balancing and he will knock off a fiver for you to cover the cost. That's ok then isn't it?

I am happy with the EBC HH pads in the front brakes of Bucephalus but I made a mistake putting them in the rear. The sinter content is very high and they have eaten the rear disc. Lots of brake dust to get onto my chain too. Back to subject one!

In fairness, floating discs can cope with some runout and if you are unfortunate enough to own a Big Suzuki like a TLR or a Hayabusa then they use the same discs and carriers. FZR Thousand Exups share their front discs with Ducrapi 900ss/916 series although the Ducrapi has a nicer carrier which is easier to clean (looked nice on my Exup too).

Floating discs sometimes rattle when they have no brake biting on them. Sometimes they rattle alarmingly. What they should do is make a nice 'hissssss' when the brake is applied (well mine do). Apply the brake gently and listen for the rattling to stop and a constant hissing sound. 'Constant hissing' is the key word not 'intermittent hissing'. Intermittent means warped and even though the floating disc may hide the other effects of the warping, soon they are going to start manifesting themselves and costing you bucks (if you are lucky that is all they will cost you). It’s a definite MOT failure like everything else I have mentioned here and it is a possible cause of an accident to boot.

Bike a few years old eh. Well consider braided hoses. Cheap enough and a very good way of improving braking feel and performance. Good bargaining point too if the bike has got a few miles under its belt.

Might also be a good idea if you do not want to pay the extortionate prices dealers charge for fitting the simple stuff, to get another club member who knows their stuff and you can trust to do it? Saves you a whole heap of cash!

So a long post to point out a few short points. There is so much I have missed or glossed over and I am sure many of the more, experienced riders can cogitate and challenge some of what I say.

I care not one fig!

So.

Don't be taken in with the glamour and ardour that a new love can create in your lustful eyes.

Do take a mate along to at least stop you buying that VFR800 anniversary that looks like it has been made from two bikes, one silver one red. He/she may even stop you buying a bike that has actually been made from two bikes!

Do check all of the consumables and don't be fobbed off with any excuses from the seller. Tyres, brakes and chain and sprockets can all be checked over in less than 10 minutes.

Do take time out to maintain and adjust your bike where it needs it. It can save you money in the medium to long term.

Save cash on simpler jobs to get an experienced, trust worthy, knowledgeable mate to fit parts or help maintain your bike.

And buy a manual if you can.

Here endeth the lesson.

Ride safely...

Lucky.
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Mr Lucky · Spanner Monkey Joined: 10 Nov 2002 Karma :

Mr Lucky · Spanner Monkey Joined: 10 Nov 2002 Karma :

Mr Lucky · Spanner Monkey Joined: 10 Nov 2002 Karma :

OK chaps I am off to see Miss L. Catch you all later...
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Scooby · Scrappy Doo Joined: 26 Mar 2002 Karma :

Bendy · Mrs Sensible Joined: 10 Jun 2002 Karma :

They missed out 'do massive burnouts leaving more rubber on ground than on tyre'. Now why does Zim leap to mind again... Laughing

Hex · Party Boy Joined: 04 Feb 2002 Karma :

Can I just point one small thing out in the chain cleaning bit

Scooby · Scrappy Doo Joined: 26 Mar 2002 Karma :

Problem with parrafin though is that when you reoil the chain the oil will just run off.
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A big enough hammer fixes anything!

Mr Lucky · Spanner Monkey Joined: 10 Nov 2002 Karma :

WD40 does seem to have a reputation for hardening rubber, but I have never witnessed this in all of my years of using it. I have never had any problems with WD40 causing damage to rubber or plastics (In fact I use it as a cheap effective alternative to 'back to black') so I am confident about its prolonged use with my bikes/cars.

It is great to see alternatives being suggested though. I am always on the look out to try new stuff/methods. People have many different ways of doing things with their bikes. I pick up what I can from many sources when I can... Cool

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Kris · World Chat Champion Joined: 03 Feb 2002 Karma :

Kickstart · The Oracle Joined: 04 Feb 2002 Karma :

Kickstart · The Oracle Joined: 04 Feb 2002 Karma :

Mr Lucky · Spanner Monkey Joined: 10 Nov 2002 Karma :

Now you know why I am so keen on keeping them well maintained. And still nope on the pins as well... Laughing

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Motoboy · L Plate Warrior Joined: 27 Jan 2006 Karma :

subj................... Rolling Eyes

veeeffarr · Super Spammer Joined: 22 Jul 2004 Karma :

lurker · Trackday Trickster Joined: 19 Sep 2004 Karma :

problem with wd40 is not the hardening of the rubber, its the removing of the paste in the 'o' rings which you can't replace, which the chain then grinds down and in turn leaves you with major tight spots.

deputy · Scooby Slapper Joined: 12 Jun 2004 Karma :

Thanks for that Mr Lucky, just given my chain a good clean during my break and can now actually see the chain not just the crud covering it. This will now become a weekly task.