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Musketeer
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PostPosted: 21:31 - 05 Oct 2013    Post subject: Oulton Park incident Reply with quote

Sad day Sad

From No Limits Trackdays FB page...

Update, Ref; Oulton Park incident today.

I have just been officially informed of a update. Its with the deepest of sorrows, No Limits Trackdays are tasked with the duty to confirm that the incident involving 5 bikes at Oulton Park has resulted in the death of one of our customers.
A further two riders are critical but not thought to be life threatening. One of the riders is undergoing an operation now. I will keep this subject updated.


https://www.facebook.com/Nolimitstrackdays
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Slacker24seve...
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PostPosted: 00:07 - 06 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Any news on what the incident was? Condolences to the family of the deceased. It could happen to any of us.

Sounds like 5 bikes were involved but no further details about it.
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Supermoto_Fan
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PostPosted: 00:38 - 06 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

A cruel reminder that, even on a track day accidents can happen and you don't just slide off into the gravel. Poor sods probably never saw it coming, I know track days naturally have an element of danger but you still don't expect to hear of these incidents
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CaNsA
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PostPosted: 01:00 - 06 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Slacker24seven wrote:
Any news on what the incident was? Condolences to the family of the deceased. It could happen to any of us.

Sounds like 5 bikes were involved but no further details about it.


2nd fast session.
2 dudes came over the hill and collided and wiped out.
3 dudes came round the blind corner and went into them.

1 died, 1 serious spinal injury, 2 critical, 1 minor injuries.

Sad
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Ichy
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PostPosted: 01:17 - 06 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm guessing that some other people that I didn't know or care about but may have rode a bike died today. RIP.
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bladerunner
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PostPosted: 01:22 - 06 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

I also got the fb report of the accident from oulton ..... Very sad to hear Crying or Very sad it's a beautiful track to ride and a very committed part of the track for fast bikes. Thoughts are with all involved
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Slacker24seve...
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PostPosted: 09:03 - 06 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ichy wrote:
I'm guessing that some other people that I didn't know or care about but may have rode a bike died today. RIP.


This is very different to an RTA, in fairness.
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Ichy
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PostPosted: 09:44 - 06 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Slacker24seven wrote:

This is very different to an RTA, in fairness.


How?

Irrespective of the environs bikers will occasionally make mistakes and possibly suffer as a result. Motor vehicle racing is dangerous and accidents will happen on a regular basis, it is one of the reasons people watch it.
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lihp
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PostPosted: 10:23 - 06 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

I believe there was a marshal station near the incident, which on this trackday was unmanned due to staffing levels, so there was no warning of an incident at that point of the track.
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Musketeer
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PostPosted: 10:58 - 06 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

PhilDawson8270 wrote:
I believe there was a marshal station near the incident, which on this trackday was unmanned due to staffing levels, so there was no warning of an incident at that point of the track.


Yeah.. I've just read that too. I haven't been there so I cannot comment. I've been with NL in Bedford and couldn't complain about the number of Marshalls.. but that's a different track with good visibility.

Quite a shock that such a serious accident happened during "just" a trackday. I always thought of trackdays as safe environment to go fast and that as the place that people rarely get seriously hurt. And 5 bike high speed pile-up is not something I would ever expect to happen.

A bit freak accident from what I've read.
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Ichy
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PostPosted: 11:14 - 06 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maggot wrote:
I always thought of trackdays as safe environment to go fast.


I guess that is a mistake that many make. They are safer than the road but there is a reason why track day insurance is expensive. I spent a fair bit of time at Oulton Park. Crashed bikes were pretty common, some of them looked pretty much like they had come straight from the showroom.
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Al
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PostPosted: 11:30 - 06 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ichy wrote:
Maggot wrote:
I always thought of trackdays as safe environment to go fast.


I guess that is a mistake that many make. They are safer than the road but there is a reason why track day insurance is expensive. I spent a fair bit of time at Oulton Park. Crashed bikes were pretty common, some of them looked pretty much like they had come straight from the showroom.



The chance of sliding off trashing your bike and maybe even breaking a bone is fairly high I'd say, certainly more common then on the road but the chance of dying is very low and the result of the odd freak incident every few years so pretty safe really.

Regarding the lack of marshals I was under the impression that No limits just collected the money and hired the track, I thought the marshals and services ect were provided by the track owner a bit like when you hire go-kart tracks. May be wrong though Confused
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MattJ
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PostPosted: 11:34 - 06 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

You're right Al, marshals are employed by the track, not the trackday company. If there was a shortage of marshals on track it will have been nothing to do with No Limits and entirely down to the organisers at Oulton Park.
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Slacker24seve...
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PostPosted: 12:59 - 06 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ichy wrote:
Slacker24seven wrote:

This is very different to an RTA, in fairness.


How?

Irrespective of the environs bikers will occasionally make mistakes and possibly suffer as a result. Motor vehicle racing is dangerous and accidents will happen on a regular basis, it is one of the reasons people watch it.


RTAs don't usually involve a five rider pile up. RTAs don't usually involve everyone going in the same direction. Yes, racing is dangerous. There's enough signs up on the entrance to circuits and enough in the disclaimers you sign to make you well aware of it, not withstanding the fact we've all seen the likes of Simoncelli and Tomizawa and countless TT riders lose their lives. But it's not racing, it was a trackday, and I think it's just a bit too close to home really.

Perhaps I'm just being soft - but either way an incident like this might put people off from riding with NL or at Oulton in future until the facts are known. Nobody in their right mind would avoid a road because a biker died on it but a trackday organiser and/or venue is a different matter.
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G
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PostPosted: 13:08 - 06 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://www.speyside-stages.co.uk/Images/warning.jpg
Slacker24seven wrote:
Nobody in their right mind would avoid a road because a biker died on it but a trackday organiser and/or venue is a different matter.

If you want to ride the road at a decent pace, but if there's bits that are blind where another vehicle might pull out, you may well avoid that road for fun riding.

No Limits are generally one of the decent companies in my experience; it'd be sad to see them going down because of this, which could all too easily happen.
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CaNsA
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PostPosted: 13:12 - 06 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Slacker24seven wrote:
But it's not racing, it was a trackday.


Some trackday go-ers go with mates and race each other, some go just to be on a track.

But 2 fast group lads coming over a hill and knocking into each other.....?
Sounds like they were racing to me.


Slacker24seven wrote:
Today I was learned that people race on a trackday
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G
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PostPosted: 13:19 - 06 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

The difference between racing and 'going as quickly as you reasonably can' is rather small, often.

Personally, I do like to ride 'competitively' on trackdays, but that doesn't mean I'll push the boundaries nearly as much when out with ACU riders in a 'race' environment.
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fozzym
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PostPosted: 13:03 - 09 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oulton is my local track and I've done a few track days there without any problems other than a couple of delays for riders lowsiding.

Very saddened to hear about this accident but these things happen from time to time and I'm sure its will serve as a stark reminder to riders and organisers that tragic accidents can happen. If there are any lessons to be learnt I'm sure they will be.

Until we know the full facts I think its pretty futile to speculate as to what went on.

As for the debate on track days v's racing; I'd say the big difference is that on a track day, while many of us ride hard and try to catch the guy in front, we should be riding within ourselves and when it comes to overtaking we should be taking a much more conservative approach.

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MG
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PostPosted: 01:57 - 25 Feb 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/manchester-motorcyclist-bobby-khan-speaks-6713362

Saw this yesterday, seems like someone who said that a marshal post was unmanned may have been right.
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G
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PostPosted: 02:44 - 25 Feb 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

You don't expect the number of Marshals at trackdays you get at a decent race meeting.

ESS made a thing about having loads of marshals, well run day and so on. They didn't last too long.
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Musketeer
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PostPosted: 08:22 - 25 Feb 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

I cannot blame the guy that he's doing it but...

... if he wins it will ruin track days for all of us. I've already seen reports that this year all track day organisers red flag all minor incidents Sad
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G
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PostPosted: 09:22 - 25 Feb 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

mJZ wrote:
I cannot blame the guy that he's doing it but...

... if he wins it will ruin track days for all of us. I've already seen reports that this year all track day organisers red flag all minor incidents Sad

Indeed.
Focused events used to be really bad like that (haven't done any trackdays recently) - some days you'd barely get any track time because they'd red flag it despite someone being out of danger and so on.
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Clutchy
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PostPosted: 09:25 - 25 Feb 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Al wrote:


Regarding the lack of marshals I was under the impression that No limits just collected the money and hired the track, I thought the marshals and services ect were provided by the track owner a bit like when you hire go-kart tracks. May be wrong though Confused


Marshals are provided by the circuit, however the company that hires the track will be asked how many marshals do you require and will be billed accordingly, so I suspect it is a little bit more complicated than that.

However if no-limits said they only wanted 2 marshals when the tracks risk assessment says 5 is the min it could only go ahead if no-limits were using their own insurance to cover the track which a lot of companies like them do in my experience.

Without further information it would be hard to place the blame correctly.
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Old Git Racing
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PostPosted: 18:31 - 25 Feb 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

G wrote:
The difference between racing and 'going as quickly as you reasonably can' is rather small, often.

Personally, I do like to ride 'competitively' on trackdays, but that doesn't mean I'll push the boundaries nearly as much when out with ACU riders in a 'race' environment.


Agree with this. There seems to be a new breed of egotistical idiots in fast groups now who are there to race, clock laps with onboard timing and have no consideration for anyone except themselves and how fast they can go, woe betide if you get in their way or don't come up to their supposedly exacting level of riding. Funny thing is its rare that even a couple of them could even hack it in a club race.

By the way, none of this is aimed at the riders in the Oulton incident, just a general ob about fast groups being supposedly safer than road riding. They aren't.

Done plenty of trackdays, even instructed, But when I go on one now I go in the inters, find a bit of clear track and enjoy it. I don't need to race on a trackday, got a cabinet full of trophies doing that for real.

Organisers need to get a grip and chuck the idiots out then maybe there will still be a trackday scene in 5 years time.

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