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G
The Voice of Reason



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PostPosted: 16:55 - 10 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

My previous opinion of bubbs.
Bought a chappel with Land in wales, even discussing BCF BBQ... up here then ... ¯
"I personally consider myself a feminist"... oh dear..., now gone right down \_

I have no problem with equality and entirely agree with it.

I have little problem with either sex being supported in achieving similar goals.
I do not consider it 'equality' for one sex to be positively discriminated in favour of, such as the recent BBC comedy thing and so on.

Make sure it's merit, yes. But not forcing discrimination to make up.

On the rape stats thing - I saw some survey giving horrific numbers for 'rapes' in Eastern countries.
If you looked at what constituted a rape, it included the woman consenually having sex with their partner when they might not really wanted sex themselves - say it was their partners Birthday or similar, but they were feeling a bit tired.
THAT was counted as a rape.
By the same definitions, I expect a good number of men had suffered similarly at some point.

Quote:

So your still suggesting that the women who dress "provocatively" somehow invite being assaulted. It really dousent matter if all women all of the time dressed like they were trying out for a job posing in porn mags that dousent justify or lesson the serious nature of sexual assault.

I tend to agree with this.
But then as with the football analogy, what would society say if someone wandered around a dodgy area of town with a flashy watch while waving a grand in twenties around in their hand was mugged?
The vast majority of people I'd say, would think "idiot".
Not "he has every right to do that".
We don't see signs saying "please leave your laptop in the back seat of your car because you SHOULD do things that will incite theft".

In some cases I suspect the issue is not so much dressing, but behaving - many women will happily 'play' with men, not understanding (or maybe are) that the bloke is thinking "sex" while she's just enjoy the attention.
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Benno
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PostPosted: 17:03 - 10 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Boozehawk wrote:
Benno wrote:


Why would you argue that? It was never the argument to begin with. They invented it themselves and then argued against it. The Canadian police officer that originally said it was only saying "you might be safer if you dressed more sensibly" which is akin to saying the same about how one might dress in a crime-ridden neighbourhood. They overreacted and started walking around Toronto naked.




Honestly I don't even get why this is something people argue about. Or anything to do with feminism really. It's simple stuff yet people twist it and misinterpret it (deliberately sometimes) and yell about it.


They went nuts because an officer of the law who should know better made a statement which could be easily interpreted as upholding the damaging misconception that getting raped is a womans own fault because of the way she dresses.


Jesus christ. Again, falling into the over-analysing category of common feminist fallacies.

He's an officer of the law. It's his job to protect and serve. He made a suggestion to help them be protected. It's not his fault that some men/rapists will be more likely to rape a girl dressed in a skimpy outfit. By all means wear what you want, but be aware of the risks. Telling rapists not to rape isn't going to help because they don't care about what you want, only what they want.

I live in a very safe neighbourhood. But for security purposes I lock my door every night, because there is a small - tiny - chance that someone might try to break in. I don't take a bus to London, strip naked, cover myself with £20 notes and shout "TELL BURGLARS NOT TO BURGLE! I SHOULD BE ABLE TO LEAVE MY DOOR UNLOCKED!"
Yes, in an ideal world I should be able to leave my door unlocked. But bad people exist and telling them that they are upsetting you won't change a thing.

I don't understand how this is even a debate. Shall we argue about how the world is round?
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slowlydoesit
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PostPosted: 17:08 - 10 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Boozehawk wrote:
Rapist are all about opportunity not "sexyness".

I don't see why "opportunity" and "sexily dressed victim" should necessarily be mutually exclusive for a rapist. Have there been peer-reviewed studies that demonstrate that dress is or is not a factor in rape? I found this post interesting.


Last edited by slowlydoesit on 12:39 - 05 Apr 2014; edited 1 time in total
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Benno
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PostPosted: 17:38 - 10 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

slowlydoesit wrote:
Boozehawk wrote:
Rapist are all about opportunity not "sexyness".

I don't see why "opportunity" and "sexily dressed victim" should necessarily be mutually exclusive for a rapist. Have there been peer-reviewed studies that demonstrate that dress is or is not a factor in rape? I found this post interesting.


It doesn't even matter. In the tiny minority of cases seeing a woman dressed sexily may tip a rapist over the edge and drive him to commit the act he has wanted to commit for some time.

Whatever, it happens.

The other part of the issue is that this police officer was NOT demeaning the women, belittling them, or any of those other buzzwords feminists love to use. All he was doing was trying to be nice, kind and helpful.

But no. MUH PATRIARCHY DON'T YOU DARE OPPRESS ME YOU HAVE NO RIGHTS I HAVE ALL THE RIGHTS THE WORLD BELONGS TO ME DO MY BIDDING BEND TO MY WILL MUAUAUAUAUAHAAAAA I AM THE FEMINIST!
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waffles
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PostPosted: 22:31 - 10 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

slowlydoesit wrote:
waffles wrote:
Normally I try not to let comments like that get to me, but that really irritated. Why can't I be seen as an equal person?

I try not to let adverts on TV in the UK and the US that portray men as being a bit thick compared to their cool, competent female partners get to me, but they really irritate. "So easy even a man can do it", anyone? Why can't I be seen as an equal person?


Yes, I'm sure it was traumatising being subjected to that kind of abuse from your TV. Sadly I cant change the channel when that kind of thing is said directly to my face. If you are referring to the advert I think you are referring to (the oven cleaner one?) it was pulled after many complaints. Incidentally which company produced it? It would be interesting to see if it's a predominantly male or female group who came up with that shitty gem.

EDIT - apparently you should direct your anger towards Matt Stockdale, MD of HomePride who was pleased that the Advertising Standards Agency declared that that advert was "light-hearted humour" and in no way sexist.
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slowlydoesit
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PostPosted: 22:46 - 10 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

waffles wrote:
It would be interesting to see if it's a predominantly male or female group who came up with that shitty gem.

Maybe it would be interesting, but it's not the issue. The issue is that the advert panders to a widely held view among women that men are useless. In that sense it is as sexist as any of the adverts in the 1960s that portrayed to women as incompetent dolly birds. That's not progress.

Sadly, a common female response to this is the "aww, did your feelings got hurt, poor ickle man" approach, which attempts to derail the argument by belittling the man who makes it. That's exactly the kind of condescension that many men deployed against early feminists. Again, it's not progress.
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G
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PostPosted: 23:12 - 10 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

waffles wrote:
A couple of years ago I turned up at the Oakdene Cafe with a some friends. I rode my bike there, he rode his bike with his wife as pillion. We had had a good few hours ride in the sun with clear roads and little traffic. Some guy bedecked in leather waistcoat made a flippant remark to the guy asking how he "fit them both on the back of yer bike, haw haw haw!"

Obvious come-back quip (yes, I'm terrible at thinking of such things on the fly myself) would be "is that how you ride with your boyfriends - two on the back at once?"

Oh and you could have just walked away, as quickly as he could have changed the channel probably Smile.

How about being a bloke and basically being seen as a 'fixer' of stuff? Plenty of cases where blokes are pigeon-holed too.

Oh and I'd stay away from the norf - darling, sweetheart and so on are pretty common in daily use to friends etc it seems.
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smegballs
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PostPosted: 23:56 - 10 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

slowlydoesit wrote:
Sadly, a common female response to this is the "aww, did your feelings got hurt, poor ickle man" approach, which attempts to derail the argument by belittling the man who makes it. That's exactly the kind of condescension that many men deployed against early feminists. Again, it's not progress.


The good-old Code Blue.

https://i.imgur.com/999J9iS.jpg

Let's look at some types of abuse nasty men can commit....

https://i.imgur.com/44gFooS.png

Now the vast majority of these are obviously abusive behaviours: kicking, punching, rape etc etc

However some of these are a total contradiction of terms: Refuse to accept money from her? Abuse! Take money from her? Abuse!

More interestingly, both insisting on having sex with a woman and refusing to have sex with a woman are both abusive behaviours? Are we not told that a woman always has the right to say no (which I think is correct)? Yet if a man decides to refuse sexual relations it is abusive behaviour...

I suggest that a possible explanation for the seemingly more and more mundane causes of outrage amongst modern feminists is trying to hold onto power. No-ones likes to have their power reduced in scope, whether it is social, financial etc, we all like to climb up the ladder and very much avoid taking a lower rung if at all possible. Now what would happen if overnight, men and women were magically 100% equal, the raison d'etre for the feminist movement would cease to exist - and (if equality is their true aim) they have won the fight, mission accomplished, demobilise the troops and head on home ladies, its time to party! Very Happy

The high level folks of the feminist movement stand to lose out here, with the equality achieved and the troops sent home. The organisers and speech-givers, and regional representatives no longer have a role to play. To speak nothing of the financial side of things (which I'm sure have their own part - I'm sure feminist fundraisers and lobbyists are a thing) the people involved stand to lose out on a lot of social status and influence should the war ever come to a close. As such no matter how "equal" things become, I predict there will be ever increasingly silly demands from the feminist movement, seeking to find something, no matter how trivial, to rally the troops around and keep the war-drums beating. Quite similar to how the top folks of the military game don't stand to benefit from peace, you can't sell much gucchi kit to 1st world nations if everything is all hunky-dory now can you?

Personally I think a girl I met this summer sums it up well: "Both feminists and men's rights folks are equally stupid. Men have some issues and interests, women have some issues and interests. We'll never get anywhere with a confrontational system of Men Vs Women. People should talk together and solve shit as people rather than defining themselves as side and seeing the other as the enemy."
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smegballs
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PostPosted: 00:00 - 11 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

G wrote:
Oh and I'd stay away from the norf - darling, sweetheart and so on are pretty common in daily use to friends etc it seems.


Same down here in the south west, pretty much everyone is "my love/handsome". Caused my polish friends a bit of confusion when they first moved over, they thought the man in the shop was saying he loved them... Laughing
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slowlydoesit
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PostPosted: 00:17 - 11 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

smegballs wrote:
I suggest that a possible explanation for the seemingly more and more mundane causes of outrage amongst modern feminists is trying to hold onto power.

I think that is exactly what is happening. After all, most of the high-profile feminists in academia and the media make a living out this, right? And what else can they do in life to make money?
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 00:26 - 11 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

smegballs wrote:

More interestingly, both insisting on having sex with a woman and refusing to have sex with a woman are both abusive behaviours? Are we not told that a woman always has the right to say no (which I think is correct)? Yet if a man decides to refuse sexual relations it is abusive behaviour...



The Quran says that if a mans wife acts above her her station he can punish her by a beating and then refusing her sex. So there ya go.
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Benno
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PostPosted: 01:03 - 11 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Boozehawk wrote:
smegballs wrote:

More interestingly, both insisting on having sex with a woman and refusing to have sex with a woman are both abusive behaviours? Are we not told that a woman always has the right to say no (which I think is correct)? Yet if a man decides to refuse sexual relations it is abusive behaviour...



The Quran says that if a mans wife acts above her her station he can punish her by a beating and then refusing her sex. So there ya go.


Oh? That settles it then.

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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 02:03 - 11 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Benno wrote:

Oh? That settles it then.

Neutral


If Top Trumps did religion then Sharia law is like like a B52 Bomber.
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mentalboy
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PostPosted: 02:18 - 11 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
CaNsA wrote:
hitting google images with Slap A Bitch

And it used to be just "slap".

We'll have a lot of apologising to do to our sons. Very quietly, where no one can hear.


I'm still a little concerned that Mr Borg regularly googled 'slap', we like that sort of thing do we Roger??? Wink
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Benno
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PostPosted: 02:48 - 11 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Boozehawk wrote:
Benno wrote:

Oh? That settles it then.

Neutral


If Top Trumps did religion then Sharia law is like like a B52 Bomber.


Shot to pieces by the glorious freedom-inspired Christian-built F-16 Fighting Falcon, Tear Shedding On Stars And Stripes version?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7R5A0pg4oN8

https://files.sharenator.com/America_Fuck_Yeah-s1200x676-360634-580.jpg

https://files.sharenator.com/13100_AMERICA_Fuck_Yeah-s500x400-171182-580.jpg

https://www.thesleuthjournal.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/us-military-formation.jpg

https://global3.memecdn.com/America-Fuck-Yeah_o_122740.jpg

https://shejkendotcom.files.wordpress.com/2013/07/america-fuck-yeah.jpeg
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_mjs_
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PostPosted: 06:06 - 11 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why did the feminist cross the road?

To suck my fucking cock.
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RhynoCZ
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PostPosted: 09:56 - 11 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is it still on? Only desperate lads that can't get laid start that sympathy crap about feminism in false belief they could get some. OR, UK lads just lost their manhood. Thumbs Up
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Bubbs
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PostPosted: 10:19 - 11 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Boozehawk wrote:
Bubbs wrote:


I totally agree with that point. This is where I was having massive disagreements with feminist warriors. I was saying - well if a sadistic rapist wants to rape you then he would more likely get turned on more by a woman dressed slutty.


That's not true. Its the basic misconception around sexual violence. Men who rape are men who exploit a power differential in order to excersise their violent sexual impulses.

It does sound that despite your "feminist" stance your still holding onto the idea that women by wearing certain clothes women are hanging a big symbolic sign round their neck saying "please take whatever sexual gratification from me you want in whatever way you want". So what do you mean by "dressed slutty" anyway?


In my OP you'll see that I explained I am still very much learning about this stuff.

I think you took my post the wrong way. My 'original' stance with the feminists was that if you dress provocitively you will be more at risk from being raped.

Then after talking to a feminist friend she explained that it was not incumbent on how they dress or how they look. Most rapes happen within the home between couples.

I still can't shake the idea that if you dress in a certain way that it puts you at more risk though.... as much as I keep getting told otherwise it just feels like it would make more sense if it worked that way round.

I'm still trying to get my head around the whole thing to be honest.... I'd say I'm more a feminist sympathiser than a full on feminist as I'd have to actually understand it before I could say I believe it. Lets just say I that i'm beginning to look at things a different way.
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Bubbs
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PostPosted: 10:25 - 11 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

G wrote:
My previous opinion of bubbs.
Bought a chappel with Land in wales, even discussing BCF BBQ... up here then ... ¯
"I personally consider myself a feminist"... oh dear..., now gone right down \_


Crying or Very sad

Ha ha.... maybe a feminist was too strong a word. I definitely consider myself pro women and want to learn more about feminism. Again I see it the other way around - id also consider myself a manist? maleist!? Equality goes both ways, it's not just the ladies that are getting a shit time it's us gents too.

You're personal opinion has gone down because I am pro equality?

My opinion of you may have just gone down too... Wink


To be fair it's been an interesting thread so all you haters can suck my big hairy slightly sweaty left one.
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Bubbs
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PostPosted: 11:31 - 11 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just stumbled across a blog that covers the 'Male Privilage Checklist'..

To be honest I actually disagree with quite a few of them. What do you think?

The Male Privilege Checklist

1. My odds of being hired for a job, when competing against female applicants, are probably skewed in my favor. The more prestigious the job, the larger the odds are skewed.

2. I can be confident that my co-workers won’t think I got my job because of my sex – even though that might be true. (More).

3. If I am never promoted, it’s not because of my sex.

4. If I fail in my job or career, I can feel sure this won’t be seen as a black mark against my entire sex’s capabilities.

5. I am far less likely to face sexual harassment at work than my female co-workers are. (More).

6. If I do the same task as a woman, and if the measurement is at all subjective, chances are people will think I did a better job.

7. If I’m a teen or adult, and if I can stay out of prison, my odds of being raped are relatively low. (More).

8. On average, I am taught to fear walking alone after dark in average public spaces much less than my female counterparts are.

9. If I choose not to have children, my masculinity will not be called into question.

10. If I have children but do not provide primary care for them, my masculinity will not be called into question.

11. If I have children and provide primary care for them, I’ll be praised for extraordinary parenting if I’m even marginally competent. (More).

12. If I have children and a career, no one will think I’m selfish for not staying at home.

13. If I seek political office, my relationship with my children, or who I hire to take care of them, will probably not be scrutinized by the press.

14. My elected representatives are mostly people of my own sex. The more prestigious and powerful the elected position, the more this is true.

15. When I ask to see “the person in charge,” odds are I will face a person of my own sex. The higher-up in the organization the person is, the surer I can be.

16. As a child, chances are I was encouraged to be more active and outgoing than my sisters. (More).

17. As a child, I could choose from an almost infinite variety of children’s media featuring positive, active, non-stereotyped heroes of my own sex. I never had to look for it; male protagonists were (and are) the default.

18. As a child, chances are I got more teacher attention than girls who raised their hands just as often. (More).

19. If my day, week or year is going badly, I need not ask of each negative episode or situation whether or not it has sexist overtones.

20. I can turn on the television or glance at the front page of the newspaper and see people of my own sex widely represented.

21. If I’m careless with my financial affairs it won’t be attributed to my sex.

22. If I’m careless with my driving it won’t be attributed to my sex.

23. I can speak in public to a large group without putting my sex on trial.

24. Even if I sleep with a lot of women, there is no chance that I will be seriously labeled a “slut,” nor is there any male counterpart to “slut-bashing.” (More).

25. I do not have to worry about the message my wardrobe sends about my sexual availability. (More).

26. My clothing is typically less expensive and better-constructed than women’s clothing for the same social status. While I have fewer options, my clothes will probably fit better than a woman’s without tailoring. (More).

27. The grooming regimen expected of me is relatively cheap and consumes little time. (More).

28. If I buy a new car, chances are I’ll be offered a better price than a woman buying the same car. (More).

29. If I’m not conventionally attractive, the disadvantages are relatively small and easy to ignore.

30. I can be loud with no fear of being called a shrew. I can be aggressive with no fear of being called a bitch.

31. I can ask for legal protection from violence that happens mostly to men without being seen as a selfish special interest, since that kind of violence is called “crime” and is a general social concern. (Violence that happens mostly to women is usually called “domestic violence” or “acquaintance rape,” and is seen as a special interest issue.)

32. I can be confident that the ordinary language of day-to-day existence will always include my sex. “All men are created equal,” mailman, chairman, freshman, he.

33. My ability to make important decisions and my capability in general will never be questioned depending on what time of the month it is.

34. I will never be expected to change my name upon marriage or questioned if I don’t change my name.

35. The decision to hire me will not be based on assumptions about whether or not I might choose to have a family sometime soon.

36. Every major religion in the world is led primarily by people of my own sex. Even God, in most major religions, is pictured as male.

37. Most major religions argue that I should be the head of my household, while my wife and children should be subservient to me.

38. If I have a wife or live-in girlfriend, chances are we’ll divide up household chores so that she does most of the labor, and in particular the most repetitive and unrewarding tasks. (More).

39. If I have children with my girlfriend or wife, I can expect her to do most of the basic childcare such as changing diapers and feeding.

40. If I have children with my wife or girlfriend, and it turns out that one of us needs to make career sacrifices to raise the kids, chances are we’ll both assume the career sacrificed should be hers.

41. Assuming I am heterosexual, magazines, billboards, television, movies, pornography, and virtually all of media is filled with images of scantily-clad women intended to appeal to me sexually. Such images of men exist, but are rarer.

42. In general, I am under much less pressure to be thin than my female counterparts are. (More). If I am fat, I probably suffer fewer social and economic consequences for being fat than fat women do. (More).

43. If I am heterosexual, it’s incredibly unlikely that I’ll ever be beaten up by a spouse or lover. (More).

44. Complete strangers generally do not walk up to me on the street and tell me to “smile.” (More: 1 2).

45. Sexual harassment on the street virtually never happens to me. I do not need to plot my movements through public space in order to avoid being sexually harassed, or to mitigate sexual harassment. (More.)

45. On average, I am not interrupted by women as often as women are interrupted by men.

46. I have the privilege of being unaware of my male privilege.
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slowlydoesit
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PostPosted: 11:34 - 11 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bubbs wrote:
I still can't shake the idea that if you dress in a certain way that it puts you at more risk though.... as much as I keep getting told otherwise it just feels like it would make more sense if it worked that way round.

Bubbs, if your intuition says it's not true, there's a good chance it's not true. Just because somebody with a different opinion "explains" it to you, it doesn't mean they are correct. What hard data do they have to support their claims? Statements beginning "Everybody knows that..." and "It's been proven that..." are not enough. I would need to see details of the research done, information on the scale of any surveys, how the respondents were selected and - so that we can assess ideological bias - who designed and wrote up the research.

To your other point, perhaps being "sexily clothed" is not relevant to rapes committed at home. On the other hand, I still believe that in some situations a woman dressed in ways that accentuate her sexuality is going to attract more attention (positive and negative) and have more chance of triggering a sexual assault than a woman dressed demurely. Feminists can talk all they want, but loudly and aggressively insisting that a particular view is true does not make it true: I need to see some proper studies.

The link I provided in an earlier post suggests that there is no significant research to support the view that clothing and dress do NOT have a bearing in cases of sexual assault.
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slowlydoesit
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PostPosted: 11:37 - 11 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bubbs wrote:
Just stumbled across a blog that covers the 'Male Privilage Checklist'..
To be honest I actually disagree with quite a few of them. What do you think?

I think they're straw man arguments. These days - unlike say 40 years ago - we could build a similar list showing female privilege. It would be as meaningless as this one. It's just a tool to beat men over the head with and discourage any kind of dissent.

But if you think the list is interesting, check out this post:
https://www.avoiceformen.com/men/mens-issues/male-privilege-checklist/
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G
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PostPosted: 11:39 - 11 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Feminism ≠ equality would be the point.

Some feminists are now describing them selves as 'equalists' or similar, on the basis that 'feminist' is in it's self a rather sexist term Smile.

As above, I am all for equality of opportunity, justice and so on.
But I'm also all for accepting that different people are different and taken as a whole, men and women are different to each other and do have different needs etc from life - I think some many drives towards 'equality' which don't recognise this end up being counter-productive for that reason.

Quote:
Most rapes happen within the home between couples.

Do you have stats for this? And how they were worked out and so on?
I've known plenty of male friends to suffer all sorts of 'abuse' by women, from physical to physiological. And there's a much bigger stigma to men discussing this or trying to do anything about it. Yet our 'equal rights' feminists I only ever see going on about "violence against women" and so on.
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Bubbs
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PostPosted: 12:02 - 11 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

G wrote:
Quote:
Most rapes happen within the home between couples.

Do you have stats for this? And how they were worked out and so on?
I've known plenty of male friends to suffer all sorts of 'abuse' by women, from physical to physiological. And there's a much bigger stigma to men discussing this or trying to do anything about it. Yet our 'equal rights' feminists I only ever see going on about "violence against women" and so on.


Hmmm you know what. I'm usually a person that doesn't get sucked in by propoganda and goes out and researches this info for myself. I do seem to have believed what I have been told about a lot of this stuff rather than looking at solid evidence.... so no I do not have stats for it. Embarassed

I am going to study it though and see if it all holds weight. I imagine it depends where in the world you come from as women are treated very badly in some countries and very well in others.

I really don't like these warriors who feel like the whole world is against them and take offense at everything. Some lad on FB put up a sexist joke which was intended to be tongue in cheek but was a bit of a silly thing to put, and a whole forum of feminists took hold of it and blew it up to be something massive. I don't agree with that at all... I don't like vicious/malicious jokes and usually don't find them funny... but it's a fuckin joke at the end of the day. If someone made a joke about me being white and Welsh and male I would probably find it funny.

This whole culture of getting offended is such a load of tosh.

I just want the blatantly unfair things in everyday British life to be more fair - for both sexes. Basically I am for Common Sense!!
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Bubbs
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Joined: 28 May 2009
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PostPosted: 12:09 - 11 Mar 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

slowlydoesit wrote:
Bubbs wrote:
Just stumbled across a blog that covers the 'Male Privilage Checklist'..
To be honest I actually disagree with quite a few of them. What do you think?

I think they're straw man arguments. These days - unlike say 40 years ago - we could build a similar list showing female privilege. It would be as meaningless as this one. It's just a tool to beat men over the head with and discourage any kind of dissent.

But if you think the list is interesting, check out this post:
https://www.avoiceformen.com/men/mens-issues/male-privilege-checklist/


Just reading this now... it's really interesting.

Bit of a 'mind'field this topic isn't it.
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