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Dads '67 Triumph TR6R Trophy, ongoing project.

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chris-red
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Joined: 21 Sep 2005
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PostPosted: 15:29 - 15 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Right I'm working from home to day which means I can crack on with the bike Laughing .

First off a big thanks to Steveh to has offered to help and sent me a very helpful PM Thumbs Up

Today I went to Leigh Classics to get some parts and advice.

The place is fantastic, I got everything I needed barring one minor part.

This is want about £105 looks like.

https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v295/chris-red/Bike%20back%20together/98f86b7c-cd0b-452f-985f-0106abe211e3_zps14aeb9df.jpg?t=1413381414

Maybe a bit expensive and had I shopped around probably could have got it for less, however the advice I got was worth more than that!

The guy who helped me, (Adam I think) was a walking encyclopaedia on these bikes. He answered all my questions in such a way I could tell it was no BS and he really knew what he wasn't talking about. He also said to pretty much ignore the manual Laughing

There were several things I asked about.

Firstly the carb, he said the 330 main jets were way to big even with out a filter, he said he normally uses 200-220. So I picked up a 200,220 and 230. He also said to put the needle in the middle and adjust as you go, he also said to start the mixture screw 1.5 tuns out and see how it goes.

With the clutch he said the crack I hear is due to poor adjustment so should be easy to sort.

He also told me the chain oil (There is a chain driving the Gearbox from the crank) shouldn't be anywhere near what they say in the manual If you do the clutch slips this should be just touching the bottom of the chain.

Fork oil, Manual States 10w 150cc, he said that is crap and should be 20w 225cc.

I picked up a new ignition barrel for £20, which is probably the same as getting a key made up.

As for the Compression it is the one thing I forget to ask him, Steve Said he would strip it with 100PSI, I think I am going to see about getting it running get it warmed up and do and proper test them see where everything is

So I have everything I need at the moment I just need to work on it.
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Well, you know what they say. If you want to save the world, you have to push a few old ladies down the stairs.
Skudd:- Perhaps she just thinks you are a window licker and is being nice just in case she becomes another Jill Dando.
WANTED:- Fujinon (Fuji) M42 (Screw on) lenses, let me know if you have anything.
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chris-red
Have you considered a TDM?



Joined: 21 Sep 2005
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PostPosted: 20:52 - 15 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well this was an interesting evening, the TL;DR is basically she runs and runs lovely! I literally have no idea what dad was going on about with head trouble Laughing

All we did today was fit the new ignition, change the jet and needle, fit new plugs and change the oils. Believe me that was much harder than it sounds! There are 3 Oils, The Chain case, engine and gearbox. They are a fucker to get to all the drain points. Anyway all the oil was drained and refilled. Fresh petrol was put in. And believe it or not she fired after a few kicks Cool.

No setup this was the first try at kicking it! Excuse my rapey smile I was excited! Laughing

https://youtu.be/iTLU9doD8hA

She was running really well too, I took her out for a spin round the block and she was great Cool

https://youtu.be/yXgzUdGkHf0

I checked the plugs after and the LHS looked perfect the RHS was a bit sooty but it didn't really have a long run so Friday I'll take it out for a long run and check them again. I'll also check compression and see what it looks like.

There seems to be an oil leak where the the inlet pushrod tunnel meets the crank case which might be a fucker to sort, I'll look at that next week maybe, depends how much it leaks in my shakedown runs.

Sorry Gang I feel like I have cheated you out of a thread and it was far easier than I imagined! I'll let you know how the MoT goes but it don't forsee any issues (assuming the bike gets here.)
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Well, you know what they say. If you want to save the world, you have to push a few old ladies down the stairs.
Skudd:- Perhaps she just thinks you are a window licker and is being nice just in case she becomes another Jill Dando.
WANTED:- Fujinon (Fuji) M42 (Screw on) lenses, let me know if you have anything.
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steveh
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PostPosted: 10:15 - 16 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glad you got it running bud! as for the pushrod tubes, they all leak.. well most.. dont worry too much unless its pissing out, you can get them to seal, correct headgasket thickness and good seals is key, as there is actually a measured clearence, too greater clearence and it will leak, too little clearence, youl distort the seal and it will leak.. sorting this does involve removing the head, but this isnt a big job, i cant remember what the measurement is but ill try find it for you if you tackle it.


oh and dont not try to remove the guide block without the special tool, theres a chance youl crack the barrel if its in there tight.
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chris-red
Have you considered a TDM?



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PostPosted: 10:45 - 16 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

steveh wrote:
Glad you got it running bud! as for the pushrod tubes, they all leak.. well most.. dont worry too much unless its pissing out, you can get them to seal, correct headgasket thickness and good seals is key, as there is actually a measured clearence, too greater clearence and it will leak, too little clearence, youl distort the seal and it will leak.. sorting this does involve removing the head, but this isnt a big job, i cant remember what the measurement is but ill try find it for you if you tackle it.


oh and dont not try to remove the guide block without the special tool, theres a chance youl crack the barrel if its in there tight.


Cheers Steve,

Do I need to remove the guide block to change the seal? I'm planning on taking her out for a few runs over the next few days to check things like leaks and any other fettling needed.

I'll also be changing the Fork oil, adjusting the clutch at the engine end and checking the timing.

If it isn't leaking much I might leave the head. Part of me thinks it really isn't worth stripping it down that far if everything works allbeit with a bit of oil leaking. I Must admit I didn't think I'd need to take the barels off or new special tools to change that seal.
____________________
Well, you know what they say. If you want to save the world, you have to push a few old ladies down the stairs.
Skudd:- Perhaps she just thinks you are a window licker and is being nice just in case she becomes another Jill Dando.
WANTED:- Fujinon (Fuji) M42 (Screw on) lenses, let me know if you have anything.
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sickpup
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PostPosted: 11:27 - 16 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Have you considered that your Father was being deliberately vague as he can't or doesn't want to ride anymore?

Think carefully over whether you should tell him the bikes fine. Thumbs Up
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CBFcarl
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PostPosted: 11:36 - 16 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

sickpup wrote:
Have you considered that your Father was being deliberately vague as he can't or doesn't want to ride anymore?

Think carefully over whether you should tell him the bikes fine. Thumbs Up


Are you trying to tell us that someone with a motorbike wouldn't want to ride? Ridiculous Shocked
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chris-red
Have you considered a TDM?



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PostPosted: 11:40 - 16 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

sickpup wrote:
Have you considered that your Father was being deliberately vague as he can't or doesn't want to ride anymore?

Think carefully over whether you should tell him the bikes fine. Thumbs Up


I did actually, He handles his sprint fine and is quicker than me in the twisties. This is more comfortable, He always spoke lovingly of it, but I think he wasn't keen on the lack of reliability. I think he just didn't feel up to doing the work on it, his back is bad and he can't bend down easily to do the work. If he didn't want to ride it anymore he would have sold it/given it to me. He also recently bought an open face helmet, which he wouldn't wear on the sprint, I'm sure he bought it cause it was cheap but this shows he wants to get back on it at some point.

Worse case scenario he don't want it, It'll be T&T'd and probably worth £5k ish which is double what he paid for it.
____________________
Well, you know what they say. If you want to save the world, you have to push a few old ladies down the stairs.
Skudd:- Perhaps she just thinks you are a window licker and is being nice just in case she becomes another Jill Dando.
WANTED:- Fujinon (Fuji) M42 (Screw on) lenses, let me know if you have anything.
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chris-red
Have you considered a TDM?



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PostPosted: 11:41 - 16 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

chris-red wrote:
sickpup wrote:
Have you considered that your Father was being deliberately vague as he can't or doesn't want to ride anymore?

Think carefully over whether you should tell him the bikes fine. Thumbs Up


I did actually, He handles his sprint fine and is quicker than me in the twisties. This is more comfortable, He always spoke lovingly of it, but I think he wasn't keen on the lack of reliability. I think he just didn't feel up to doing the work on it, his back is bad and he can't bend down easily to do the work. If he didn't want to ride it anymore he would have sold it/given it to me. He also recently bought an open face helmet, which he wouldn't wear on the sprint, I'm sure he bought it cause it was cheap but this shows he wants to get back on it at some point.

Worse case scenario he don't want it, It'll be T&T'd and probably worth £5k ish which is double what he paid for it.


Next Project the CX500.
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Well, you know what they say. If you want to save the world, you have to push a few old ladies down the stairs.
Skudd:- Perhaps she just thinks you are a window licker and is being nice just in case she becomes another Jill Dando.
WANTED:- Fujinon (Fuji) M42 (Screw on) lenses, let me know if you have anything.
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steveh
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PostPosted: 12:32 - 16 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

chris-red wrote:
steveh wrote:
Glad you got it running bud! as for the pushrod tubes, they all leak.. well most.. dont worry too much unless its pissing out, you can get them to seal, correct headgasket thickness and good seals is key, as there is actually a measured clearence, too greater clearence and it will leak, too little clearence, youl distort the seal and it will leak.. sorting this does involve removing the head, but this isnt a big job, i cant remember what the measurement is but ill try find it for you if you tackle it.


oh and dont not try to remove the guide block without the special tool, theres a chance youl crack the barrel if its in there tight.


Cheers Steve,

Do I need to remove the guide block to change the seal? I'm planning on taking her out for a few runs over the next few days to check things like leaks and any other fettling needed.

I'll also be changing the Fork oil, adjusting the clutch at the engine end and checking the timing.

If it isn't leaking much I might leave the head. Part of me thinks it really isn't worth stripping it down that far if everything works allbeit with a bit of oil leaking. I Must admit I didn't think I'd need to take the barels off or new special tools to change that seal.


No, you dont have to remove the guide block to remove the seal, it sits ontop of the guide block, its just an O-ring (see image) but some people have been known to try remove the guide, theres no real need to touch it, just a heads up really.
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chris-red
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PostPosted: 18:05 - 18 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Right long story short; she passed the MoT with NO ADVISORIES Cool

I also go to test how quickly the MoT updates on the system as I taxed it seconds after the bloke submitted it. Laughing

After the MoT, I took it for a blast and ended up putting 50 miles on it. It didn't skip a beat and was lovely Mr. Green

I got back to look at the Plug and found they were very sooty After a lot of switching out jets and needle positions. I found out I have been running it with the choke on Embarassed Being fair, it is backwards Laughing having the lever in line with the bars is on having it pointing towards you is off. Rolling Eyes It is also sprung to go to the on position. Anyway with that off we had to completely redo the jetting.

Currently it has a 250 main jet, 106 needle. The needle is in the bottom position is it worth going up a Needle jet? It feels OK but really lacking in power low down. Pulling away takes a fair amount of revs but once going it is good.

I tried settling the mixture by finding where the revs drop at each end then putting it in the middle I had almost completely unscrewed the air screw and the revs still hadn't dropped. Should I get a smaller pilot jet? It does feel like it is bogging or stuttering, just it feels under powered, or is that how they are?

I think the 250 main jet is a bit small 100% throttle is slightly lower powered that ~75% I'm going to try a 270 main.

How do the needle jet and position relate? is top clip on a 107 a step richer than bottom on a 106? do they overlap?

Other than that all that We've changed the fork oil and greased the head bearings. Still have a few odd jobs to do I really need a new main stand spring the current one is knackered and the stand bounces all over the place while going along.

I had a run down to Leigh Classics to pick up a bigger main jet and the guy there (Mr Encycolpedia) had a looks round, he said it sounded great and not to worry about the small oil leaks.

He says a lot of it is off a 71 bike the whole front end and other odds and sods arround it.
____________________
Well, you know what they say. If you want to save the world, you have to push a few old ladies down the stairs.
Skudd:- Perhaps she just thinks you are a window licker and is being nice just in case she becomes another Jill Dando.
WANTED:- Fujinon (Fuji) M42 (Screw on) lenses, let me know if you have anything.
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 18:13 - 18 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is it the spring that's stretched on the mainstand or is there perhaps a rubber stop missing that the stand rests agains when it's up?
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132.9mph off and walked away. Gear is good, gear is good, gear is very very good Very Happy
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c_dug
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PostPosted: 18:16 - 18 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a pretty decent selection of springs in a draw at work, could probably find something to fit if you can give me some rough dimensions.

Unless you want a proper Triumph spring I suppose, I doubt we'll have any of them Laughing
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chris-red
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PostPosted: 19:07 - 18 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

c_dug wrote:
I have a pretty decent selection of springs in a draw at work, could probably find something to fit if you can give me some rough dimensions.

Unless you want a proper Triumph spring I suppose, I doubt we'll have any of them Laughing


If you could that'd be great,

https://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/NDgwWDY0MA==/z/APMAAOxyOlhS19ES/$_12.JPG

Looks like that, I'm not sure on the exact size, it would appear the one on it not knackered but new, I think it is the wrong part.

The wire is 3mm thick and the length of this one is 105mm (loop to loop) I reckon 90mm would be about right, but I'd try anything between 80-100mm.

As an asside were the feck would one go to buy springs? Laughing

Could you let me know ASAP Monday please? If you haven't got one I'd like to try to get another ordered ASAP before Dad gets home.

I'll let you take it for a spin round the block if you find something Wink
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Well, you know what they say. If you want to save the world, you have to push a few old ladies down the stairs.
Skudd:- Perhaps she just thinks you are a window licker and is being nice just in case she becomes another Jill Dando.
WANTED:- Fujinon (Fuji) M42 (Screw on) lenses, let me know if you have anything.
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chris-red
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PostPosted: 19:37 - 18 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pete. wrote:
Is it the spring that's stretched on the mainstand or is there perhaps a rubber stop missing that the stand rests agains when it's up?


I don't think so, I can't see anywhere some a rubber too go tbh. I'm pretty sure the spring is too short If I hit a bump whilst lent over enough it will bounce enough to hit the road and into the swingarm.


Jobs left now...

Fettle the carb more
Check timing
Check clutch adjustment (engine end)
Sort stand
Have a look at front brake, the Conical Comical hub is atrocious although I think this one is especially bad, 2 up today and heavy braking it felt notchy inside. I'm wondering if it needs a skim, (any idea where and how much?) The only reason I didn't have a look when I had the front end was off is it needs a large imperial ring spanner, which I don't have.

Also I have bought a few jets from a shop for the carb I still need to sort the right one is it the done thing to ask them swap some I have already bought or is that a bit cheeky?
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Well, you know what they say. If you want to save the world, you have to push a few old ladies down the stairs.
Skudd:- Perhaps she just thinks you are a window licker and is being nice just in case she becomes another Jill Dando.
WANTED:- Fujinon (Fuji) M42 (Screw on) lenses, let me know if you have anything.
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 19:47 - 18 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not familiar with those carbs - does the needle act with the main jet orifice? If so I would tune WOT first and then set the needle height for part-throttle. If you mess with the needle before setting the jet size you'll have to re-do the needle height with every jet change.
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chris-red
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PostPosted: 19:55 - 18 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pete. wrote:
Not familiar with those carbs - does the needle act with the main jet orifice? If so I would tune WOT first and then set the needle height for part-throttle. If you mess with the needle before setting the jet size you'll have to re-do the needle height with every jet change.


There is a needle jet it goes into

https://www.burtonbikebits.net/images/monobloc-exploded.jpg
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Well, you know what they say. If you want to save the world, you have to push a few old ladies down the stairs.
Skudd:- Perhaps she just thinks you are a window licker and is being nice just in case she becomes another Jill Dando.
WANTED:- Fujinon (Fuji) M42 (Screw on) lenses, let me know if you have anything.
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chris-red
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PostPosted: 21:06 - 18 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hmm as the main jet screws into the bottom of a holder and the needle jet is on top I'm guessing the main jet affect the needle jet. Thumbs Up Thumbs Down
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Well, you know what they say. If you want to save the world, you have to push a few old ladies down the stairs.
Skudd:- Perhaps she just thinks you are a window licker and is being nice just in case she becomes another Jill Dando.
WANTED:- Fujinon (Fuji) M42 (Screw on) lenses, let me know if you have anything.
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Ed Case
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PostPosted: 21:32 - 18 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

If your dad is 'into' Meriden Triumphs he'll know that the forks and front brake are wrong for that period, they're much later. Should be black steel sliders with chrome oil seal holders and the 8 inch standard drum not the often regarded as inferior 'conical'.
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chris-red
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PostPosted: 22:07 - 18 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ed Case wrote:
If your dad is 'into' Meriden Triumphs he'll know that the forks and front brake are wrong for that period, they're much later. Should be black steel sliders with chrome oil seal holders and the 8 inch standard drum not the often regarded as inferior 'conical'.


It's 4 years later, its off a 71. The Comical Hub is good if you can get it set up properly (apparently).
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Well, you know what they say. If you want to save the world, you have to push a few old ladies down the stairs.
Skudd:- Perhaps she just thinks you are a window licker and is being nice just in case she becomes another Jill Dando.
WANTED:- Fujinon (Fuji) M42 (Screw on) lenses, let me know if you have anything.
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Ed Case
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PostPosted: 23:47 - 18 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

chris-red wrote:
Ed Case wrote:
If your dad is 'into' Meriden Triumphs he'll know that the forks and front brake are wrong for that period, they're much later. Should be black steel sliders with chrome oil seal holders and the 8 inch standard drum not the often regarded as inferior 'conical'.


It's 4 years later, its off a 71. The Comical Hub is good if you can get it set up properly (apparently).


Quite right there chris-red, the earlier TLS very handsome brake was highly regarded but was superseded by the 'conical' variety probably as it was cheaper to make. Ugly buggers though.
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chris-red
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PostPosted: 00:31 - 19 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Personally I prefer the look of this brake, however I would rather have the original!
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Well, you know what they say. If you want to save the world, you have to push a few old ladies down the stairs.
Skudd:- Perhaps she just thinks you are a window licker and is being nice just in case she becomes another Jill Dando.
WANTED:- Fujinon (Fuji) M42 (Screw on) lenses, let me know if you have anything.
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c_dug
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PostPosted: 00:43 - 19 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Chris, I'm not in tomorrow to look for a spring, but I can let you know first thing Monday morning if that's any good?
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chris-red
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PostPosted: 01:13 - 19 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

c_dug wrote:
Hi Chris, I'm not in tomorrow to look for a spring, but I can let you know first thing Monday morning if that's any good?



That's wicked cheers, I just want enough time to order one from a specialist if you don't have anything, I know it is only a little thing, but it is actually very noticeable when riding, it bangs about and I want to have the bike as perfect as possible for then first time dad takes it out.


Also I didn't say another Compression test when it was warm and I got 135PSI. The guy in the shop said this was good Thumbs Up
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Well, you know what they say. If you want to save the world, you have to push a few old ladies down the stairs.
Skudd:- Perhaps she just thinks you are a window licker and is being nice just in case she becomes another Jill Dando.
WANTED:- Fujinon (Fuji) M42 (Screw on) lenses, let me know if you have anything.
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chris-red
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PostPosted: 20:20 - 19 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Right had the front brake apart, looks alright, just cleaned it up and greased everything.

https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v295/chris-red/Bike%20back%20together/3B550400-7950-4246-943D-0D53563FB2E2_zpsrvqef6wg.jpg

https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v295/chris-red/Bike%20back%20together/CCE3720D-2CF9-4E6B-B2CF-D2281FE7C6B2_zpszlf8ornm.jpg

https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v295/chris-red/Bike%20back%20together/10D953BA-E8D8-4F7D-8B2C-DDDA98A9BA9F_zpskuqzvspj.jpg

After!

https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v295/chris-red/Bike%20back%20together/893022F6-5698-485F-9A02-9C0C12656624_zps6l3tdqjc.jpg

After cleaning it up, greasing it, then adjusting the shoes, it became clear I need a new front brake cable. The front brake is much better now, but the cable is at maximum adjustment and not very secure on the bracket. I adjusted the rear shoes too. Now the brakes just scary whereas before they were terrifying!

I still need to sort the fuelling out which is a right ball ache, another problem appeared as well, it isn't charging, 9-10v at idle. We'll have to have a look at that too.

Next update will be tuesday, I'm working from home again and will be popping to the shop to get some more advice a brake cable and some jets.
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Well, you know what they say. If you want to save the world, you have to push a few old ladies down the stairs.
Skudd:- Perhaps she just thinks you are a window licker and is being nice just in case she becomes another Jill Dando.
WANTED:- Fujinon (Fuji) M42 (Screw on) lenses, let me know if you have anything.
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c_dug
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PostPosted: 10:34 - 20 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

chris-red wrote:
As an aside were the feck would one go to buy springs? Laughing


You mean you don't have a draw full of springs? I thought everybody had one?!

https://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee81/paddy2007dug/DSC_0397_zps1hppfcy5.jpg

These should do the trick I reckon:

https://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee81/paddy2007dug/DSC_0398_zps3kj6gr6v.jpg

Both 90mm give or take a shade. I'll pop both to yours as one is stiffer than the other.
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