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Vincent |
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Vincent Banned
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Posted: 19:00 - 22 Jan 2016 Post subject: 1957 Showa 250cc "Cruiser" |
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pepperami |
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Vincent |
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Vincent Banned
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Ed Case |
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Ed Case World Chat Champion
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Vincent |
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Vincent Banned
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Triton Thrasher |
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stevo as b4 |
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stevo as b4 World Chat Champion
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Triton Thrasher |
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Vincent |
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Vincent Banned
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Posted: 20:35 - 23 Jan 2016 Post subject: |
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Apparently, expansion chambers were invented by a German in 1938 to help with fuel consumption rather than power.....although they're connected to some degree I guess. Looking at the Showa bike, maybe stingers were yet to be invented.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expansion_chamber ____________________ Space Is Deep |
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RhynoCZ |
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RhynoCZ Super Spammer
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Posted: 23:13 - 23 Jan 2016 Post subject: |
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Expansion chamber exhaust systems were invented/first time used on the track by MZ, you can even see the lack of Japanese two strokes before that time period and the Japanese crazy fast revving 4 strokes.
And as always, Japanese manufacturers took all the European ideas, not giving a feck about any patent laws, and coppied it so well, the final product was even superior to the European original.
The Showa Cruiser is made in Japan, in that time period (50's to late 60's), so it is in fact a copy of generic motorcycles that you could see here back in the day. ____________________ '87 Honda XBR 500, '96 Kawasaki ZX7R P1, '90 Honda CB-1, '88 Kawasaki GPz550, MZ 150 ETZ
'95 Mercedes-Benz w202 C200 CGI, '98 Mercedes-Benz w210 E200 Kompressor |
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Triton Thrasher |
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Triton Thrasher Could Be A Chat Bot
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Ed Case |
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Ed Case World Chat Champion
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RhynoCZ |
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RhynoCZ Super Spammer
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Posted: 19:28 - 24 Jan 2016 Post subject: |
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Ed Case wrote: | Triton Thrasher wrote: | MZ's designs were stolen by their East German rider/engineer Ernst Degner, when he defected (during a race) and joined Suzuki. |
No shortage of rumours when Ernst Degner, development engineer/racer, died somewhat 'prematurely'. He reportedly absconded with a load of technical information in his head which was the property of Walter Kaaden the brains behind the extremely successful, considering the miniscule budget, MZ 250 2-stroke racing bike. He joined Suzuki and all of a sudden their 2-stroke bikes went from wank to wonderful.....can't imagine why !. |
See this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JoXA_tCHJJ0 ____________________ '87 Honda XBR 500, '96 Kawasaki ZX7R P1, '90 Honda CB-1, '88 Kawasaki GPz550, MZ 150 ETZ
'95 Mercedes-Benz w202 C200 CGI, '98 Mercedes-Benz w210 E200 Kompressor |
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Vincent |
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Vincent Banned
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Posted: 20:09 - 24 Jan 2016 Post subject: |
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From the youtube clip:- "Harmonic chamber"......love it
har·mon·ic (här-mŏn′ĭk)
adj.
1.
a. Of or relating to harmony.
b. Pleasing to the ear: harmonic orchestral effects.
c. Characterized by harmony: a harmonic liturgical chant.
2. Of or relating to harmonics.
3. Integrated in nature.
'Got that right.
'Nothing to do with mechanics really.....two stroke exhaust tuning....and I never got my Physics level
So why have the chamber nearer the cylinder Or does it not matter and just a question of where it fits? ____________________ Space Is Deep |
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RhynoCZ |
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RhynoCZ Super Spammer
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Posted: 20:21 - 24 Jan 2016 Post subject: |
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Looking at this simple diagram, I'd say it does not really matter where the chamber is. But, I don't know much about two stroke efficiency.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/52/Arbeitsweise_Zweitakt.gif ____________________ '87 Honda XBR 500, '96 Kawasaki ZX7R P1, '90 Honda CB-1, '88 Kawasaki GPz550, MZ 150 ETZ
'95 Mercedes-Benz w202 C200 CGI, '98 Mercedes-Benz w210 E200 Kompressor |
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Kickstart |
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Kickstart The Oracle
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Vincent |
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Vincent Banned
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Posted: 22:26 - 24 Jan 2016 Post subject: |
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The few "things" I've learned about expansion chambers over trhe years:-
1; They sound good
2: They sound even better if they're made from stainless steel but SS pipes don't perform as well on race bikes.
3: The downpipe part...ie, the first ...say 6 inches from the cylinder...needs to be conical. You see some pipes where they've just welded a normal tube onto the first part of the pipe and apparently that's not good.
4: Generally, a thinner chamber will perform better at high revs and the fatter chamber will gain torque at lower revs.
5: They sound good...did I say that already? ____________________ Space Is Deep |
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Old Thread Alert!
The last post was made 8 years, 92 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful? |
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