Hands up, who was at fault in a accident?

[Whosthedaddy]

I was thinking this as I was chugging through the christmas sale traffic.

The BCF Spill Counter is an interesting read with a very similar theme, and the general consesus is that its always someome elses fault.

The latest example:

[G]

Generally when people blame someone else, it mostly is "the other person's fault" - they performed a manoeuvre without looking, for instance.

However, the rider usually ignores the fact that they could have also prevented the accident by better observation and actions on their part.

[gixxersixx]

I was to blame for my highside pushing too hard on cold tyres and damp conditions should know better really

some people say its not their fault to save some pride, in the end probably in a high percentage of offs/accidents theres something that whoever was involved could have done differently to prevent it. Wether it was being more alert, slowing down, riding within their limits and not the bikes etc. Yes theres going to be some where they were genuine accidents but these will be in the minority.
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[Whosthedaddy]

[G]

On the diesel thing: I have often seen diesel on the road, but never slid on it, although I have slid and crashed on many other poor road surfaces.

Until I do crash on it, I'm not convinced it's anything more than just an excuse for being less than a perfect rider .

I think they drum in sequences of manoeuvre's and to ensure you rigidly stick to the speed limits for your test, rather than useful bike riding advice.

[Whosthedaddy]

[mattish]

[stinkwheel]

Well, I've fallen on my arse simply WALKING on diesel when spilled in sufficient quantities. Slipperiness seems to vary with the road surface, it can be very trecherous on back roads with the big stones in, especially in winter after they're nice and polished from the salt.

If I see it, I slow RIGHT down. There was a big diesel spill in Glasgow town centre earlier this year, even had the cars sliding about and crashing.

[Whosthedaddy]

[Barney]

I spend a lot of time on the roads and judging from my experience i.e. near misses I've had and watching others mistakes, I think bikers are to blame in most circumstances.

[st3v3]

People who ride bikes will always have some element of blame, no matter what the circumstances, and some bikers are only too quick to blame someone/thing else so they feel they have some pride/dignity/ego left...

E.g, when i had my off, t'was painfull, but minor although had i not gone through a pedestrian zone to get to where i was, the dizzy bint might not have pulled out on me, as i may not have been there...

The crash was her fault for not looking properly, however i could of avoided the whole situation by simply adding 5 mins to my journey, instead of 2 hrs in casualty...and one less bike, but it happened, nowt i can do about it now, except learn from it, and be more responsible next time, not taking a shortcut to get home like a 10 yr old


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Roger wrote: Women don't get damp for clingy puppies. Get some better happy pills, hit the gym & buy a medallion the size of a dinner plate. Job done

[Ste]

[dicko]

As my spill is quoted in the first post may I direct all persons to a recent high court ruling from 27th june 2006.
Case

DAVIS CLAIMANT/RESPONDENT
- v -
SCHROGIN DEFENDANT/APPELLANT

Cutting a long story short the motorcyclist was doing the same as me and an impatient driver decided to do a uturn in front of him. The initial judge ruling found in favour of the motorcyclist and this was appealled hence the high court decision, the final assessment is below.

"It does not, as it seems to me, follow from that that he was at that point sufficiently on enquiry of the prospect of a U-turn. But in any event on the judge's primary findings, whether the estimate of five car lengths is a mathematically precise one or not, the claimant was right on top of the scene and the point of impact when the defendant emerged from the line of traffic without looking. There is, as it seems to me, simply no basis for challenging the judge's finding upon causation. Once it is held, as the judge was plainly entitled to hold, that the claimant was so close to the point of impact that he could not avoid the collision, then there is simply no basis for any finding of contributory negligence.


I would for those reasons uphold the judge's finding and dismiss this appeal.


LORD JUSTICE HOOPER: I agree


LORD JUSTICE AULD: I also agree that the appeal should be dismissed for the reasons given by my Lord, Lord Justice Hughes.


Order: Appeal dismissed with costs.

Anybody needs a full copy of the ruling send me an email.
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[Kickstart]

Hi

Maybe we should add "whose fault" to the spills thread for 2007.

For the record, I lobbed my FZR across the road this year. Cold new tyres, cold road, etc. Still my fault.

Went straight on at a corner several years ago on the FZ750. Again my fault.

All the best

Keith
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[Walloper]

Yes all my accidents were not my fault.
If the bike used a different propelant, like parrafin/cooking oil, instead of that dangerous petrol stuff, then I would have had loads more time to take evasive/corrective action.
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[Whosthedaddy]

[Whosthedaddy]

[Misc]

Who would be at fault if you was doing say 200mph down a road & a car pulls out without looking?

[SoND]

[Walloper]

[Whosthedaddy]

[MattEMulsion]

I think that its human nature to try to avert the cause of the blame for an accident to something else other than your own actions.

I have been there, done it, but no matter how I try to justify why I crashed (not on a bike, but in a van) it was my own stupid fault as I wasn't looking what was happening in front of me. I braked way too late as I didn't see the car in front had stopped and I wellied it up the backside. Now I could sit here and tell you that the front brake pads were almost worn out at that time and that the tyres were on the legal limit, but it wasn't because of these that I crashed, it was because I wasn't bl**dy looking at what I was doing.

I think the same can be said about some of these bike accidents. Whosthedaddy used the example of a car U-turning whilst the rider was filtering through traffic. Okay not strictly the riders fault but if you are filtering/overtaking a line of traffic then you need to be extra careful of whats going on and be on the lookout for these things.

Similarly I noticed a post on the Spills thread about a rider attempting to get in front of a car at a set of red lights. The lights changed, the car moved and hit this biker that was trying to go round him on his outside. The biker gives the impression that he totally blames the car driver. To me he shouldn't have tried to get in front of the car by going round the outside in such a dangerous situation.

I've noticed another few posts in the Spills thread as well where riders have had to anchor up hard (and then lost it) trying to avoid other road users. One guy lost it when the taxi in front of him anchored up hard for a red light. The rider then fell off trying to avoid the taxi. To me it wasn't the taxi drivers fault, he was stopping for the lights, so what would the biker have done if the taxi wasn't there? Would he have managed to stop for the red light anyway?

I'm not criticising anyone, just highlighting the fact that it is often easier on our conscience to pin the blame on others, than to admit that we have made a mistake.
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[st3v3]

Tis simple, we(at least the rider in question) will alwaysbe at some degree of fault in some way or another.

we(same again) will always be quick enough to jump up and shout 'your fault', this is human nature. Nothing we can do about it except take a step back and take the logical view which may mean dinting pride etc..
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Roger wrote: Women don't get damp for clingy puppies. Get some better happy pills, hit the gym & buy a medallion the size of a dinner plate. Job done

[Walloper]

[Whosthedaddy]