Help & FAQs    Search BCF    Members    Groups    Events Calendar
Resend my activation email : Register : Log in 
BCF: Bike Chat Forums


The Treehugger: First Hydrogen fuelcell motorbike

 Reply to topic
Bike Chat Forums Index -> Biking News & Rumours Goto page Previous  1, 2
View previous topic : View next topic  
Author Message

mchaggis
World Chat Champion



Joined: 10 May 2004
Karma :
PostPosted: 14:25 - 21 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
The last time I remember discussing this at uni, we came to the conclusion that the easiest source of hydrogen was that which could be cracked from crude oil. Hence, not much benefit whatsoever.
____________________
I must not be a troll...
Mmmm, Guinness
Discovering the delights of Hammerite and a 3/4" brush. Very Happy
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail You must be logged in to rate posts

Jack_Cheese
World Chat Champion



Joined: 14 Jul 2005
Karma :
PostPosted: 18:08 - 21 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
mchaggis wrote:
The last time I remember discussing this at uni, we came to the conclusion that the easiest source of hydrogen was that which could be cracked from crude oil. Hence, not much benefit whatsoever.


Then why do nasa get it from alcohol? Confused
____________________
www.bikepics.com/members/jackcheese <--- NOW FOR SALE! 51 Plate Cagiva Planet 125
Quacker_boy: "Jack, you really are a dick!"
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail You must be logged in to rate posts

Wafer_Thin_Ham
Super Spammer



Joined: 18 Nov 2005
Karma :
PostPosted: 10:48 - 22 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Hey, i'm all for biofuels, like gasohol etc. Part bioethanol mixed with normal petrol.

Or just pure bio-ethanol! It has a much high octane rating than petrol so hello monumental compression figures!
____________________
My Flickr
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Itchy
Super Spammer



Joined: 07 Apr 2005
Karma :
PostPosted: 13:57 - 22 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Jack_Cheese wrote:
mchaggis wrote:
The last time I remember discussing this at uni, we came to the conclusion that the easiest source of hydrogen was that which could be cracked from crude oil. Hence, not much benefit whatsoever.


Then why do nasa get it from alcohol? Confused


alcohol ain't free either you know , you have to grow sugar beet , harvest it (10 joules per 1 joule onto a dinner plate) , then you have to turn it into mash (more energy) , and distill it for ages,

While oil we just suck it out the ground and not withstanding fighting a bloody war to make them our best friends and killing 10000s of people it is economically cheaper.
____________________
Spain 2008France 2007Big one 2009 We all die. The goal isn't to live forever, the goal is to create something that will. In the end, your life will flash before your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail You must be logged in to rate posts

Jack_Cheese
World Chat Champion



Joined: 14 Jul 2005
Karma :
PostPosted: 18:44 - 22 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Itchy wrote:
alcohol ain't free either you know , you have to grow sugar beet , harvest it (10 joules per 1 joule onto a dinner plate) , then you have to turn it into mash (more energy) , and distill it for ages


I didn't say it was free, but surely nasa would use a method which gives a good compromise between cost, yield and purity.
____________________
www.bikepics.com/members/jackcheese <--- NOW FOR SALE! 51 Plate Cagiva Planet 125
Quacker_boy: "Jack, you really are a dick!"
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail You must be logged in to rate posts

Steve_k
Nova Slayer



Joined: 18 Aug 2006
Karma :
PostPosted: 18:53 - 22 Sep 2006    Post subject: fuel cell bike Reply with quote
I like the bit about making it sound like a bike for pedestrian safety.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

angryjonny
World Chat Champion



Joined: 01 Sep 2006
Karma :
PostPosted: 23:21 - 22 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
A hydrogen fuel cell is, at best, an alternative way of storing electricity. As Itchy pointed out - you have to use huge amounts of electricity to split water into hydrogen and oxygen in the first place. You then put the two together and ignite them and *bam* you have power. As for energy efficiency, it's no different to charging up a battery or winding up a big spring. The power still has to come from somewhere.

A solar panel takes 10 years of use to generate the power it took to build the thing in the first place. There is not enough oil left in the world to manufacture the plastics required to replace oil power with wind turbines. We're screwed, environmentally. Far as I can see we have two options:

(1) Learn to use a lot less power, soon. Unlikely, because even if we've got the "green" bug, India and China haven't, and half the world's population lives in either India or China.

(2) Sod it. The planet can look after itself. Sooner or later we will all die (probably sooner), but the planet itself will recover fairly quickly, geologically speaking.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Fahd
World Chat Champion



Joined: 17 Jan 2006
Karma :
PostPosted: 11:55 - 23 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
In my opinion that bike is hideous, but I'm also all for new fuels/technology...
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

froggeh
World Chat Champion



Joined: 20 Jul 2006
Karma :
PostPosted: 23:42 - 29 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Interesting idea. But the performance needs to be upped a touch!
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

mchaggis
World Chat Champion



Joined: 10 May 2004
Karma :
PostPosted: 00:07 - 30 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
angryjonny wrote:
There is not enough oil left in the world to manufacture the plastics required to replace oil power with wind turbines.


I don't really want to sound like a corrupted oil person (I hope I'm not yet Shifty ), but do you realise just how much oil there actually is around? People would have you believe that the North Sea will be dry by 2030. Laughing The exploration companies are making major discoveries all the time.

Ultimately, you're right though. Oil is finite, and the name of the game is to get it out and sell it at just the right rate to make the most money. Money is what makes the world go round, and more oil = more money, at least certainly while China and India are booming. God only knows just how much scope there is for development into China... Shocked
____________________
I must not be a troll...
Mmmm, Guinness
Discovering the delights of Hammerite and a 3/4" brush. Very Happy
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail You must be logged in to rate posts

lilredmachine
World Chat Champion



Joined: 24 Jan 2005
Karma :
PostPosted: 11:59 - 05 Oct 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Quote:
I don't really want to sound like a corrupted oil person (I hope I'm not yet ), but do you realise just how much oil there actually is around? People would have you believe that the North Sea will be dry by 2030. The exploration companies are making major discoveries all the time.


Yep, the chances of actually running flat out of oil are pretty damn slim. Oil will become an economically unfeasible fuel source way before it runs out. I.E the cost of finding and retrieving becomes greater than the cost of finding another source. Petrol prices may go up more, but don't expect petrol to disappear altogether.
____________________
Bikes: too many, too much for one man to maintain anyway.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail You must be logged in to rate posts

GearboxGeezer
World Chat Champion



Joined: 06 Sep 2005
Karma :
PostPosted: 15:14 - 11 Oct 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
This is what annoys me. We got the technology to save this world. Yet they put all this green technology in the most ugly pile of shit the world has ever seen, from electric cars to this. If they just got an r1 or somthing, and stuck the engine in that, then I reckon theres a %100 better chance of the idea taking off.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts
Old Thread Alert!

The last post was made 17 years, 203 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful?
  Display posts from previous:   
This page may contain affiliate links, which means we may earn a small commission if a visitor clicks through and makes a purchase. By clicking on an affiliate link, you accept that third-party cookies will be set.

Post new topic   Reply to topic    Bike Chat Forums Index -> Biking News & Rumours All times are GMT + 1 Hour
Goto page Previous  1, 2
Page 2 of 2

 
 You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum

Read the Terms of Use! - Powered by phpBB © phpBB Group
 
Debug Mode: ON - Server: birks (www) - Page Generation Time: 0.08 Sec - Server Load: 0.93 - MySQL Queries: 17 - Page Size: 79.38 Kb