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Itchy
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 Posted: 09:13 - 07 Feb 2007  Post subject: 120gc02/km |
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Was flicking through TV channels and BBC news then came up with this news item,
EU is trying to push through a law which says by 2011 all cars much produce less than 120gc02/km.
Its not likely to be too sucessful , cus big EU manufacturers are threatening to leave and sack their staff + the environment minister of the EU drives a beefy merc which produces 235gc02/km.
Any effect on bikes? , I'm very skeptical about it anyway , considering almost all cars are way above 155g , while only the Kia Picanto and a few other micro cars produce around 115.
any thoughts>?
Ta
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Kickstart
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froggeh
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Itchy
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| Posted: 14:01 - 07 Feb 2007 Post subject: |
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believe it or not , any taxes levvied will NOT be used for anti global warming projects,
on my gas bill there is a 5% climate change levvy , does this get spent on anything ? , nope, other than general expenditure.
now if we had a hypothecated fund to stick a mirror into space (remember USD$4000 for 1kilo of matter to be put into space using Russian Rockets it goes down to $2000) ,
considering the lack of crap in space we can make a mirror 10 microns thick , place it at lagrange point between the sun and earth and the distance will cast a HUGE shadow over the earth cooling it.
, hell if the government was serious about it and thoughr space mirrors were too big a project (a lemonade stall is too big for them) , a small 1x1 metre mylar patch can be issued in EVERY council tax bill , to be put on the roof with 45 million buildings in the UK that = 45 million square metres of high albedo effect ground ,
which will affect the heat the earth absorbs , climate change still a problem? , issue another 1sq metre , so that 90 million square metres are used.
Considering the greeks used a few 100 square metres to set fire to roman ships, a few million will stop climate change full stop,
all these taxes are just THEFT no ifs no buts ,
hell Siberia / the Desert is worthless land , cover that with Mylar , and the earth cools , even better place heliostat power generation facilities ike they have in SO California and you get cheap energy AND no climatic effects.
conviently , putting a giant mirror into space or a heliostatic earth based array has two side effects.
#1 you can turn night into day anywhere on Earth
#2 you suddenly have an facsimilie of Gundam 0083 Solar System II heliostatic super weapon , as said a few 100 greeks with shiny mirrors can set wood on fire (paper 451 F , wood = higher) , a 90 million square metre heliostat array , fired down from space at a human would cause spontanous combustion of anything flamable , even if it used a wide focus , and would be cheaper than Rods from God , non WMD system NASA wants.
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Last edited by Itchy on 14:17 - 07 Feb 2007; edited 1 time in total |
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Itchy
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| Posted: 14:07 - 07 Feb 2007 Post subject: |
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just to illustrate even more (get a few more kicks in) ,
the government spends 3p per person per year on green energy like solar , the government take from me 5% of me gas + leccy bill , considering my gas and leccy bills are in the 100s , they take more than they give back,
thus it is all just a tax con ,  , though the stupid people are all falling over themselves to adopt these new taxes, thogh greenies are hypoctites,
On news night ethical man (who cut down his food carbon by 30% after going total vegan , but not food miles) , asked when the greenie took a flight he said last week , he asked him about before he said a couple weeks before that.
Me? , I've not flown since I think 2004
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froggeh
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Itchy
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Itchy
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| Posted: 14:33 - 07 Feb 2007 Post subject: |
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Ah but there is a school of thought which says emissions are slowing down global warming as particles in the air = higher albedo effect.
even jet vapour trails slowed it down more , such that to stop global warming we must all drive around dirty diesels, with the choke on at all times!
I saw an lorry engine recently wonder if I can shoe horn it into me NTV
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Kickstart
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Itchy
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| Posted: 09:22 - 08 Feb 2007 Post subject: |
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hell even water vapour is a green house gass
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froggeh
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| Posted: 09:58 - 08 Feb 2007 Post subject: |
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| Kickstart wrote: |
No the vast majority are not convinced. Some are. Some aren't. Plenty who are used to make up the numbers have areas of speciality that is nothing to do with climate research.
You can tell how much of a PR job it is that the latest IPCC report is released in 3 months time. 3 months after they released the summary (a few days ago) and they reserve the rights to amend the report to match the summary. Or put it another way, change the facts to match the press releases.
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Ok we'll never agree on this. It's in very few peoples interest, especially not governments, for global warming to be the issue I believe it is.
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Seems that people have been very quiet about methane. From the 2007 summary the level of CO2 has risen 35% between pre industrial times and 2005. In the same period methane levels have risen 148%. Methane is over 20 times more powerful as a greenhouse gas.
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Agreed. And one area we can attack this, is by recycling. A huge amount of methane is created by landfill.
Another more controversial, and probably impossible, would be to stop eating cattle. I'd be up for it.
Cows are massively inefficient and create enough methane in a week to power a house for a day( This could be bullshit - I read it on a cracker  ), which just floats up to join the rest of the greenhouse gasses
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It may be a problem. It may not. It is currently not known, and much of what is said either way is heavily biased by the various industries. Take reasonable precautions maybe, but that is not an excuse to destroy industry and stamp down on peoples mobility.
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Heavily biased by who, and why? If we ignore global warming and just plough on, then surely as you said industry thrives even more and so too the economy. I really don't think anyone would do this if the evdence wasn't there, and strong. Christ even Dubya has conceded this one.
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If something is needed then I would suggest the first action, and the one with virtually zero down sides would be to remove farming subsidies used to pay for farm land to be left unused and instead replace it with some framework to encourage the production of bio fuels.
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Certainly agree with this one. Not sure about removal of subsidies, but certainly we should be pushing bio fuels (Along with a massive reduction of duty on such fuels) |
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Kickstart
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| Posted: 10:05 - 08 Feb 2007 Post subject: |
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| froggeh wrote: | Agreed. And one area we can attack this, is by recycling. A huge amount of methane is created by landfill. |
True, or better still collect the methane and use it as fuel. Easy from landfill, more difficult from cattle.
| froggeh wrote: | Another more controversial, and probably impossible, would be to stop eating cattle. I'd be up for it. |
Possibly true
| froggeh wrote: | Cows are massively inefficient and create enough methane in a week to power a house for a day( This could be bullshit - I read it on a cracker ), which just floats up to join the rest of the greenhouse gasses |
So would we if we ate nothing but vegitables!
| froggeh wrote: | Heavily biased by who, and why? If we ignore global warming and just plough on, then surely as you said industry thrives even more and so too the economy. I really don't think anyone would do this if the evdence wasn't there, and strong. Christ even Dubya has conceded this one. |
Both sides are biased. There is a whole environmental industry trying to get peoples money. Just as much as the oil industry wants peoples money.
There is evidence the planet has warmed a small amount. How much it has warmed is still heavily disputed, let alone how much of that is due to human activity.
| froggeh wrote: | Certainly agree with this one. Not sure about removal of subsidies, but certainly we should be pushing bio fuels (Along with a massive reduction of duty on such fuels) |
Yep. Idea of removing subsidies would be to use the money saved to pay for the framework. Maybe that framework could be subsidies for growing crops for bio fuels, but that is just one option.
All the best
Keith
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Itchy
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| Posted: 14:00 - 08 Feb 2007 Post subject: |
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Points : , bio fuels esp diesel is taxed exactly as if it was the normal stuff, REVENUE PROTECTION IS PARAMOUNT
carbon trading does not work according to CH4 news and News night , we buy them to India they build an even worse polluting plant with the money , = net worse for the environment
I still want my 90 million square metre mirror in space ,
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Kickstart
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| Posted: 23:10 - 08 Feb 2007 Post subject: |
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| froggeh wrote: | Yes but who do you think is most powerful? |
Currently the environmental industry seems to be pulling the shots, although global warming theory certainly seems to be being challanged more now than a decade ago.
| froggeh wrote: | Which is in the governments interest? |
Excuse for environmental taxes is in the governments interests. The items they are going against are mainly imported, so reduced consumption does wonders for the balance of payments. And if you demonise someone for environmental behavior you then have a perfect excuse to tax them while giving them little grounds to complain.
None of us would rather give up our toys.
The government acheives nothing by it.
| froggeh wrote: | It's not such a small amount.
And it's hidden by global dimming. |
It is a small amount. Unless you beleive the (now) totally discredited "hockey stick" graph of temperatures.
If you mean the effects of aerosols on global heating effects then it is claimed by the IPCC to be 0.5W square km cooling, against 2.3W square km warming from carbon dioxide, methane, and nitrous oxide.
| froggeh wrote: | possibly. I don't really like subsidies for farmers either. I just wouldn't want them removed at a stroke. Possibly reduced over time, or as you say, paid for the growing of oli seed rape etc |
| Itchy wrote: | Points : , bio fuels esp diesel is taxed exactly as if it was the normal stuff, REVENUE PROTECTION IS PARAMOUNT |
No it is not
https://www.hm-treasury.gov.uk/pre_budget_report/prebud_pbr06/press_notices/prebud_pbr06_press02.cfm
Diesel and petrol fuel duty is 48.35p a litre, biodiesel and bioethanol duty is 28.35p a litre.
| froggeh wrote: | Just to add to this.
This weeks MCN has a look at the new 1250 bandit.
Euro emissions laws forced this on Suzuki.
And what do we get...
More power
More torque and lower down the rev range
Smoother
porbably more reliablity
More mpg
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All for £5500 brand new... f ing bargain. In fact... hmm |
So is more expensive and requires almost a 10% larger engine to compete with the heavily detuned old 1200 Bandit (remember the Bandit engine is just a bored out GSXR1100 missing about 25% of its power).
All the best
Keith
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Old Thread Alert!
The last post was made 17 years, 82 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful? |
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