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Carb cleaning and balancing

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Lupine Lacuna
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PostPosted: 18:21 - 11 Feb 2012    Post subject: Carb cleaning and balancing Reply with quote

What a difference it makes! I now have a bike that is easy to ride, predictable and smooth. Control at low speed in particular is now effortless. It sounds meatier, deeper, no flat spots or feel of slipping as before.
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mickfulton
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PostPosted: 23:17 - 11 Feb 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

What bike did you do this on btw and how long did it take. I'm contemplating doing this myself but I have one day a week to work on the bike max as I need it the other six days.
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Lupine Lacuna
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PostPosted: 23:38 - 11 Feb 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

It took the garage quite a few hours in total. Had trouble balancing it out. Also cleaned in a ultrasonic bath, which we don't have at home!

I wouldn't want to do it myself, but then I am clueless. Its on a 10 year old 600 Bandit
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Nick 50
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PostPosted: 00:58 - 12 Feb 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Can I ask how much the garage charged you?
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temeluchus
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PostPosted: 01:16 - 12 Feb 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Carb balancing and cleaning is an easy one to learn.

You don't need vacuum gauges, but they do offer better accuracy.
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GPZ600R
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PostPosted: 10:28 - 12 Feb 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Importantly it should be stated, the ONLY good method of carb cleaning is the ultrasonic method.

As for balancing, I have a home made carb balancing tool which is far far cheaper than buying one and due to the huge scale on it, much more effective and accurate than those tiny little manometer guages !

Anyone wants to know more, just PM me.

Jason
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Fizzer Thou
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PostPosted: 13:10 - 12 Feb 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Throttle bodies should only balanced after all other serviceable items have been done first.This includes valve clearances,cam chain tension,air filter,oil and filter,spark plugs etc.Otherwise the balance would need to be done again.
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Frost
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PostPosted: 13:43 - 12 Feb 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

You don't have to sonic clean carbs, a tooth brush and petrol does a damn fine job. It might not be a perfect job but if the carbs are really dirty anything helps massively!
The most important thing to do is to measure and inspect things like wear on the needles, holes in diaphragms, or dirt in the jets.
It's time consuming but not at all is it hard work. Getting the carbs on and off can be hard work on an old bike however as the rubbers become more like plastic Laughing
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nowhere.elysium
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PostPosted: 14:00 - 12 Feb 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Frost wrote:
Getting the carbs on and off can be hard work on an old bike however as the rubbers become more like granite


Edited to reflect my personal experience.
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GPZ600R
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PostPosted: 14:42 - 12 Feb 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Frost wrote:
You don't have to sonic clean carbs, a tooth brush and petrol does a damn fine job. It might not be a perfect job but if the carbs are really dirty anything helps massively!
The most important thing to do is to measure and inspect things like wear on the needles, holes in diaphragms, or dirt in the jets.
It's time consuming but not at all is it hard work. Getting the carbs on and off can be hard work on an old bike however as the rubbers become more like plastic Laughing


your not going to get the insides clean with a tooth brush. some of the channels are too fine for that. the problem with solvents is, it doesn't dissolve dried up fuel residue. If it did, the residue wouldn't build up in the first place.
but who am I to say what does or doesn't work. Each to their own, if it works fine, however, my tooth brush will stay where it is meant to be used, in the bath room Smile
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Cheeseybeaner
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PostPosted: 14:57 - 12 Feb 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've found just balancing the pilot jets makes a big difference for overall rideability.
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sickpup
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PostPosted: 15:26 - 12 Feb 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fizzer Thou wrote:
Throttle bodies should only balanced after all other serviceable items have been done first.This includes valve clearances,cam chain tension,air filter,oil and filter,spark plugs etc.Otherwise the balance would need to be done again.


Please explain how doing these things without touching the carbs necessitates them being balanced?
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GPZ600R
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PostPosted: 15:54 - 12 Feb 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

sickpup wrote:
Fizzer Thou wrote:
Throttle bodies should only balanced after all other serviceable items have been done first.This includes valve clearances,cam chain tension,air filter,oil and filter,spark plugs etc.Otherwise the balance would need to be done again.


Please explain how doing these things without touching the carbs necessitates them being balanced?


For example, by making adjustments to the valves you need to re-synch the carbs afterwards. If you dont you can end up with out of synch carbs. That is fact.
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sickpup
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PostPosted: 16:12 - 12 Feb 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

GPZ600R wrote:
For example, by making adjustments to the valves you need to re-synch the carbs afterwards. If you dont you can end up with out of synch carbs. That is fact.


No it isn't. Try again.

HTH Thumbs Up
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temeluchus
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PostPosted: 16:45 - 12 Feb 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

sickpup wrote:
GPZ600R wrote:
For example, by making adjustments to the valves you need to re-synch the carbs afterwards. If you dont you can end up with out of synch carbs. That is fact.


No it isn't. Try again.

HTH Thumbs Up


Maybe they dropped the carbs whilst removing them, might need to rebalance them then?
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sickpup
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PostPosted: 16:58 - 12 Feb 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Temeluchus wrote:
Maybe they dropped the carbs whilst removing them, might need to rebalance them then?


That was one of two reasons I could think of as well, the other way flexing the carb bodies so they went out of sync.
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Frost
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PostPosted: 19:17 - 12 Feb 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Surely a sticking / part opening / not properly closing intake valve would effect the amount of pull on the air through the carb and therefore the pressure reading? Admittedly if you were in that situation carb sync would be the least of your problems Laughing
I really can't see how changing the oil and filter would effect carb sync in any way at all. What next? Pumping up the tyres?!

I always do carb sync as there's no point doing it if you might be toughing the carbs again any time soon.
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GPZ600R
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PostPosted: 19:34 - 12 Feb 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

sickpup wrote:
GPZ600R wrote:
For example, by making adjustments to the valves you need to re-synch the carbs afterwards. If you dont you can end up with out of synch carbs. That is fact.


No it isn't. Try again.

HTH Thumbs Up


Whatever.
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sickpup
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PostPosted: 20:10 - 12 Feb 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Frost wrote:
Surely a sticking / part opening / not properly closing intake valve would effect the amount of pull on the air through the carb and therefore the pressure reading?


Only if the valves weren't closing, the butterflies not rotating or the slides rising.

Balancing is more to do with equalising the opening of the butterflies (Mechanical adjustment) on CV carbs or the raising of the slides on slide carbs (cable or mechanical).
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Lupine Lacuna
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PostPosted: 11:44 - 13 Feb 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

hmm, big problems again this morning. The engine now sounds like it is barely ticking over, very deep and slow, super sluggish on the throttle, always feels like I am in too low a gear....

And sometimes when coming to a stop it just conks out and I roll at 5-10mph. Any idea why this is? Mechanic said he was having some trouble balancing - it would work fine, and then overnight it would go funny again, suggested it could be the valve, any idea?
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sickpup
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PostPosted: 11:49 - 13 Feb 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Look at No.1 cylinder.
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GPZ600R
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PostPosted: 11:52 - 13 Feb 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

At the risk of sounding foolish, I would look at the sparkplugs. If a cylinder is not firing (for whatever reason) then you will see it here.
An out of balanced card shouldnt cause that much of a running problem, so I persoanlly think the problem lies elswhere.

Whip some new plugs in, that usually sorts a lot of problems out, and its an inexpensive check.
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Old Thread Alert!

The last post was made 14 years, 187 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful?
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