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Are bikes the green alternative

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junglejim This post is not being displayed because the poster is banned. Unhide this post / all posts.

lihp
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PostPosted: 23:24 - 23 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

My bike takes me to the shops.

My bike takes me to work.

My bike has ocassionally taken relatives to school.
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Redoko
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PostPosted: 23:25 - 23 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Please tell me how a £280,000 two seater Ferrari is more practical than my £2,000 two seater Honda?
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Redoko
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PostPosted: 23:40 - 23 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

junglejim wrote:
Redoko wrote:
Please tell me how a £280,000 two seater Ferrari is more practical than my £2,000 two seater Honda?


Now you're being silly.
If you were stuck on the M25 in a static queue as far as the eye can see (common on the M25), would you be glad to be in the car ?


It's a £280,000 Ferrari.

What do you think?
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Ariel Badger
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PostPosted: 23:41 - 23 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Redoko wrote:
Please tell me how a £280,000 two seater Ferrari is more practical than my £2,000 two seater Honda?


Loan me both for a year and I will answer your question ( I may not put that many miles on the bike though).
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snikks
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PostPosted: 23:44 - 23 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

My bike is actually my sole means of transport - it takes me to work, it takes me to the shops, it takes me to wherever I need to go.

If I'm on my bike and I hit traffic, I'm straight up the middle and out the other end - thus contributing a good 30-40 minutes less emissions.

In a lot of foreign countries small capacity bikes are the cheap go-to vehicle for the every-man.
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whitedevil
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PostPosted: 23:45 - 23 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mythbusters proved that bikes actually put out more harmful emissions than a car. Altho you could argue that you are on the road for less time.
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lihp
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PostPosted: 23:45 - 23 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

junglejim wrote:

If you were stuck on the M25 in a static queue as far as the eye can see (common on the M25), would you be glad to be in the car ?


I'd be making more progress on the bike.

A bike is what it's owner makes it, if they use it as a summer tool then yes it's just a fun way of burning petrol.

But there's a lot of Summer Cars too, caterhams, etc.

There's also a lot of year round bikers.

I'm not saying that a car license isn't useful, but to say that bikes are ONLY for recreation use, says more about YOUR use than an overview of the population.
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MG
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PostPosted: 23:46 - 23 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

junglejim wrote:
Redoko wrote:
Please tell me how a £280,000 two seater Ferrari is more practical than my £2,000 two seater Honda?


Now you're being silly.
If you were stuck on the M25 in a static queue as far as the eye can see (common on the M25), would you be glad to be in the car ?


No, because you'd filter on the bike.
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lihp
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PostPosted: 23:50 - 23 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

whitedevil wrote:
Mythbusters proved that bikes actually put out more harmful emissions than a car. Altho you could argue that you are on the road for less time.


To go off on a tangent, Ferrari's etc put out more kg/m of harmful emissions than say a Nissan Micra, so pay more road tax per year.

But, over a one year period, which will produce more harfmul emissions?

The Micra used everyday, or the Ferrari likely only to be used on Sunny weekends?
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stonesie
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PostPosted: 23:55 - 23 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

My bike does only slightly better MPG than my car, If I want to save fuel (and emissions) then I will resurrect the CG and bumble about at 90-100 mpg Wink

The main problem is that there is nowhere secure at work for my kit, the bike would be parked in public so leaving the kit with the bike is out too, so I take the car and save the bike for fun Thumbs Up
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CaNsA
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PostPosted: 23:58 - 23 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

IMO this is fkin pointless thread.

The whole "stuck in traffic on the M25" thing is as pointless as the thread.

"Cars sitting there belching out exhaust fumes for no reason apart from keeping the engine running" vs "bikes belching out far less exhaust fumes to actually move"

Seriously, wtf.

Ok so you may have a car and a bike.
You may use the car to ferry kids about, but when you need to go somewhere you take the bike.
Seems pretty "Green" to me.

When travelling from A to B bikes are usually on the road for a shorter amount of time, therefore using less fuel.

Get a grip.
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Ariel Badger
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PostPosted: 23:59 - 23 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

My bike does 9 MPG but my car does 25 MPG. Car wins.
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CaNsA
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PostPosted: 00:00 - 24 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

whitedevil wrote:
Mythbusters proved that bikes actually put out more harmful emissions than a car. Altho you could argue that you are on the road for less time.


Tests like that on mythbusters are very general and shouldn't be used as an example... EVER!

edit - My zxr400 does avg. 45mpg.
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lihp
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PostPosted: 00:15 - 24 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

KA gets 41

R6 gets 49
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The Shaggy D.A.
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PostPosted: 00:45 - 24 Mar 2012    Post subject: Re: Are bikes the green alternative Reply with quote

junglejim wrote:
What do bikes do apart from guzzle fuel in the name of leisure ?


Carry my lardy arse to and from work cheaper than the car does. Costs me about £120 a month in fuel for commuting, it's half that on the CB500.

Playing with some figures recently, I can get a new CBF125 on 0% over 3 years for £99 down and £66 a month. Looking at a real world average of 129 MPG (average of all CBF125s on Fuelly.com) it'll cost me £30 a month - a saving of £90. It'll buy itself in a couple of years, assuming I commute all year round. I can alter the commute to ignore the dual carriageway stretch and then won't be bothered by the lack of speed - I lived with motorway commuting on the Enfield, so am quite laid back anyway.

Just need to make a decision on what I'm doing with the CB.
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G
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PostPosted: 01:50 - 24 Mar 2012    Post subject: Re: Are bikes the green alternative Reply with quote

junglejim wrote:
We are constantly being told that bikes make sense on today's congested roads.

Are we? Only by the likes of me, I thought.
One thing I keep going on about for commuting is electric bikes - I think this makes a lot of sense for regular short journeys.
The reality is that most people are too short-term lazy, so will happily take the car and walk from the other end of the car park, rather than stick bike kit on. Never mind considering getting a top box.

I'm presuming this is a bit of a troll, considering your other postings.
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LordShaftesbu...
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PostPosted: 08:04 - 24 Mar 2012    Post subject: Re: Are bikes the green alternative Reply with quote

junglejim wrote:
Bikes are great fun, but useless for anything else as proven by some here, who prefer their cars.

You're going to have to explain the logic of that one. Just because a few people prefer cars doesn't mean bikes are impractical.

whitedevil wrote:
Mythbusters proved that bikes actually put out more harmful emissions than a car.

I doubt it. Their experimental methodology often leaves a lot to be desired.
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Cheeseybeaner
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PostPosted: 08:23 - 24 Mar 2012    Post subject: Re: Are bikes the green alternative Reply with quote

junglejim wrote:
We are constantly being told that bikes make sense on today's congested roads.
There are organisations such as the MIA who spend a lot of time and money trying to coax the motoring public out of their cars and onto bikes, but on another thread, we see quite clearly that they have their work cut out, as it seems that even the people who own bikes don't really believe that, and opt for the car for the daily grind.
So where does that leave motorcycling in the grand scheme of things.
It's hard to justify bikes as a green alternative, when for most people, they exist solely for the recreational burning of fossil fuels.
Bikes are great fun, but useless for anything else as proven by some here, who prefer their cars.
Cars, even flashy expensive one's, as well as providing enjoyment for their owners, also serve a practical purpose.
Sure they might also be taken on holidays etc. but they also take people to the shops to spend and inject money into the economy.
They take kids to school so they can learn and become productive members of society.
They take people to work so they can earn money and pay tax into the treasury.
What do bikes do apart from guzzle fuel in the name of leisure ?


I don't get that.
Loads of people commute by bike in congested cities like say London, to suggest they have no 'practical purpose' doesn't make any sense.
They can serve as much practical purpose as a car, depending on what the owner needs and is willing to do with it.
I do the shopping on mine just as much as I do everything else, it takes me wherever I need to be as a form of transport.
Does transport need a minimum of four passenger carrying capacity to serve a purpose?
Yes some of it could also be 'leisure use' but that's not necessarily everything.
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junglejim This post is not being displayed because the poster is banned. Unhide this post / all posts.

MG
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PostPosted: 10:16 - 24 Mar 2012    Post subject: Re: Are bikes the green alternative Reply with quote

junglejim wrote:


No.
I am genuinely interested to know if people think of bikes as anything more than the road going equivalent of jet ski's.


Jet skis are actually a very common commuter tool in many third world countries.
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CaNsA
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PostPosted: 10:16 - 24 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Try reading what is posted on the BCF.

Most of the threads will contain atleast 1 "I was on my way to work when" post.

/thread
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 10:29 - 24 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

My daily commute and shopping run is almost always on 2 wheels, powered or otherwise. Bear in mind that any practicality argument against PTWers also applies even more against pedalists, the current apples of the ecomentalists' eyes.


CaNsA wrote:
whitedevil wrote:
Mythbusters proved that bikes actually put out more harmful emissions than a car. Altho you could argue that you are on the road for less time.


Tests like that on mythbusters are very general and shouldn't be used as an example... EVER!

edit - My zxr400 does avg. 45mpg.


Speaking of generalising, it's not all about CO2, that's just a propaganda figure.

Motorcycles were indeed more fuel-efficient than cars and emitted less of the greenhouse gas carbon dioxide, but they emitted far more smog-forming hydrocarbons and oxides of nitrogen, as well as the toxic air pollutant carbon monoxide. For the most recent model year vehicles tested -- from the '00s -- the motorcycle used 28% less fuel than the comparable decade car and emitted 30% fewer carbon dioxide emissions, but it emitted 416% more hydrocarbons, 3,220% more oxides of nitrogen and 8,065% more carbon monoxide.

If you get a chance, watch the episode. Hyneman (and Belleci, at least) are bikers, they didn't have an agenda, and I'd trust a real world comparative test more than an easily fiddled static test. Even their aerodynamic rigged modern FI 250 didn't get close to modern cars for the non-CO2 emissions.

Now, that's under Californian emissions regs, not EU, but the trend is similar here: motorcycle emissions regulations lag a couple of generations behind cars, we do kill kittens in the immediate locality.

There's likely a good argument to be made that over construction-to-scrappage a bike is far better than a car, but since they tend to be 2nd (or 3rd or 4th...) vehicles in the UK, we might not want to stress it too much.

Anyway, I'm off to B&Q to buy some 8' fence posts. Reckon I'm taking the bike?
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Old Thread Alert!

The last post was made 13 years, 316 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful?
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