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Moving a bike around leicester

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Alpha-9
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PostPosted: 12:28 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Moving a bike around leicester Reply with quote

Hi

Gonna be moving in a month or two, need my XJ selling by then or moving, anyone got riding other bikes policy that can ride it to my new house once we're movign in?

LE12 current postcode
Is tax'd and MOT'd until October, hopefully get it done this month, else i'll take it apart and transport it in the van
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anthony_r6
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PostPosted: 12:43 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are you still insured on it? I would imagine most people's policies require insurance on the bike before they're able to ride it.
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LockyUK
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PostPosted: 12:51 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

i think this is the case, to be insured 3rd party on another vehicle that is not your own must already be insured by the owner, so alpha i think unless it is still insured, no chance im afraid
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Timmeh
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PostPosted: 12:57 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

flog it on eBay, job jobbed.
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P.addy
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PostPosted: 12:58 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Depends on policy wording.

What you want is a number plate of a legit bike.. Thumbs Up
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thepuma
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PostPosted: 13:19 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

For someone to ride your bike on their 'riding other bikes' clause, the bike in question MUST be insured in its own right by the owner.
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-Matt-
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PostPosted: 13:29 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd just hire a van for an hour presuming you have a driving license, won't cost that much.
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thepuma
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PostPosted: 13:30 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

-Matt- wrote:
I'd just hire a van for an hour presuming you have a driving license, won't cost that much.


Hes banned from driving isnt he?
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-Matt-
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PostPosted: 13:34 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh Laughing that might raise a problem there then Whistle
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P.addy
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PostPosted: 13:43 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

thepuma wrote:
For someone to ride your bike on their 'riding other bikes' clause, the bike in question MUST be insured in its own right by the owner.


No it doesn't need to be.. depends on policy wording. Thumbs Up
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-Matt-
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PostPosted: 13:45 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not sure on this so i may be wrong, but wouldn't the fact its un-insured mean its SORN'd and therefore un-taxed/un-rideable, to be all official n shit Thinking
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P.addy
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PostPosted: 13:53 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yup, I had a taxed mot'd uninsured bike though.. nothing was said for 3 months.

I'd just whack a plate of a legit bike on there and get it moved, no harm as long as you don't get fucked for speeding again.
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Alpha-9
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PostPosted: 14:24 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

No driving license

Housemate has a small work van, could likely fit it in if I take it apart somewhat, ballache though

Didn't realise that about the riding other bikes thing, don't really get why that's the case but ok Thumbs Up
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 14:30 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

thepuma wrote:
For someone to ride your bike on their 'riding other bikes' clause, the bike in question MUST be insured in its own right by the owner.

Oh, you've read every certificate of insurance and policy in the country, have you?

Pryor vs the Chief Constable of Greater Manchester Police says otherwise, so you'll need to take it up with the Court of Appeal if you know better.

Anyway, we're jumping to the conclusion that it's not insured. Surely Alpha isn't derp enough to have taken the insurance off but not SORNed it... surely? Wink
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LockyUK
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PostPosted: 14:32 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alpha-9 wrote:

Didn't realise that about the riding other bikes thing, don't really get why that's the case but ok Thumbs Up


if such stipulation was not in place it would be mental, i could simply ride a hayabusa (registered in somebody elses name) because my 125 policy says i can ride other bikes...
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P.addy
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PostPosted: 14:37 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

PeteLockwood wrote:
Alpha-9 wrote:

Didn't realise that about the riding other bikes thing, don't really get why that's the case but ok Thumbs Up


if such stipulation was not in place it would be mental, i could simply ride a hayabusa (registered in somebody elses name) because my 125 policy says i can ride other bikes...


Er... as above with Borgster...
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 14:47 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

WALL OF TEXT

I'd always encourage people to read their certificate of insurance and policy document carefully.

The certificate and policy mean what they say, and only what they say, no matter how hard you or Dibble - or even your own insurer, again, see Pryor - believe or assert otherwise.

I'm currently insured with Hastings Direct. Here's the their motorcycle policy document.

I'll cut to the chase:

The Policy Document wrote:
Where cover is provided by the effective Certificate of Insurance, your Insurer will indemnify you while personally riding, with the permission of the owner, any motorcycle not owned by you or hired to you under a hire purchase agreement or leased to you under a leasing agreement or provided to you as a courtesy motorcycle and not owned or hired or lent to you by your employer or partner.


That's it. There is no requirement for the other bike to be insured, and neither is that mentioned on the certificate of insurance.

So I can indeed jump on an uninsured Hayabusa and ride it perfectly legally, although I'd be gagging for a tug, and the issue of whether it's insured once I get off of it is problematic.

There's also the issue that if it's not itself covered by a policy then its keeper is committing an offence by not SORNing it (*cough* Alpha *cough*), but that would be his problem, not mine.

There's no offence of riding a SORNed vehicle on the road. There's an offence of riding without a "vehicle license" but the physical "tax" disc itself is the license. If it's still on the bike, I'm good to ride it.

However, note the sneaky clause about "employer or partner", which I'd not actually noticed, and which isn't mentioned on my Certificate. This is why you should read your policy before making any assumptions.
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J4mes
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PostPosted: 15:12 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've NEVER had a requirement for the vehicle to be insured by it's owner/registered keeper on any of the policies that I have had the "drive other vehicles" allowance on.


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CaNsA
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PostPosted: 15:21 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

thepuma wrote:
Hes banned from driving isnt he?

Is he?
I thought his licence was revoked...
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Joncrete Cungle
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PostPosted: 16:11 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thinking out loud for a moment.......... Embarassed

Say the insurance on my brothers Ninja runs out but it is still taxed for 6 months. He 'permits' me to 'borrow' his bike and I ride it with TPO cover via my own Hastings direct policy on my RVF word for word the same as Borg has quoted.

Fast forard a couple of months and the invitation to pay the CIE bribe lands on my brothers doormat. But the bike is 'insured' TPO by way of my Hastings policy while I 'borrow' it, but the stupid MIB database and DVLA database don't know this and sends out the template invitation to pay a bribe.

Do you think the above would stand up in court should he refuse to pay the CIE bribe and the DVLA take it that far? The insurance cover would meet the minimum third party requirement stipulated in the Road Traffic Act, so the bike would be 'insured' to meet the legal requirement as a simpleton such as I understands it and I can legally ride it on the road. But the ever expanding database the filth, insurance parasites and Black Hole of Swansea put ever more faith in would have no way of knowing?

Question
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thepuma
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PostPosted: 16:18 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
WALL OF TEXT

I'd always encourage people to read their certificate of insurance and policy document carefully.

The certificate and policy mean what they say, and only what they say, no matter how hard you or Dibble - or even your own insurer, again, see Pryor - believe or assert otherwise.

I'm currently insured with Hastings Direct. Here's the their motorcycle policy document.

I'll cut to the chase:

The Policy Document wrote:
Where cover is provided by the effective Certificate of Insurance, your Insurer will indemnify you while personally riding, with the permission of the owner, any motorcycle not owned by you or hired to you under a hire purchase agreement or leased to you under a leasing agreement or provided to you as a courtesy motorcycle and not owned or hired or lent to you by your employer or partner.


That's it. There is no requirement for the other bike to be insured, and neither is that mentioned on the certificate of insurance.

So I can indeed jump on an uninsured Hayabusa and ride it perfectly legally, although I'd be gagging for a tug, and the issue of whether it's insured once I get off of it is problematic.

There's also the issue that if it's not itself covered by a policy then its keeper is committing an offence by not SORNing it (*cough* Alpha *cough*), but that would be his problem, not mine.

There's no offence of riding a SORNed vehicle on the road. There's an offence of riding without a "vehicle license" but the physical "tax" disc itself is the license. If it's still on the bike, I'm good to ride it.

However, note the sneaky clause about "employer or partner", which I'd not actually noticed, and which isn't mentioned on my Certificate. This is why you should read your policy before making any assumptions.


Well....I worked in motor insurance for 15 years in my younger days, so youre right...I havent a clue what im talking about. I was young then and regularly pissed so my memory isnt the greatest.

The reason why the other vehicle has to be insured is this....when youve borrowed this bike/car and then go and kill 4 kids..12 kittens and dent some poor old boys ferrari when you love control of this borrower vehicle. ..whos insurance will the Ferrari, kids and kittens be claiming off if the vehicle is not insured?

If the vehicle didnt need to be insured then you would have all and sundry insuring a 700cc citroen c1 cheaply but actually driving around in sports cars on their 'driving other vehicles' policy extention.

Maybe things have changed recently though? I havent worked in insurance for 10 years or so.
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Alpha-9
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PostPosted: 16:29 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Probably depends on the insurer, not like there's actual legislation about if so there'd be a source

Is SORN'd Thumbs Up
Problem is probably as Rogerborg says, if it's SORN'd you can't ride it on 'other bikes' policy as it's declared off the road, otherwise it would have to be insured anyway.

Interesting thing though, don't know what would happen if you were actually pulled driving a SORN'd vehicle on 'other bikes' policy
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J4mes
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PostPosted: 16:51 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

thepuma wrote:
]

The reason why the other vehicle has to be insured is this....when youve borrowed this bike/car and then go and kill 4 kids..12 kittens and dent some poor old boys ferrari when you love control of this borrower vehicle. ..whos insurance will the Ferrari, kids and kittens be claiming off if the vehicle is not insured?

If the vehicle didnt need to be insured then you would have all and sundry insuring a 700cc citroen c1 cheaply but actually driving around in sports cars on their 'driving other vehicles' policy extention.

Maybe things have changed recently though? I havent worked in insurance for 10 years or so.


1. The third party insurance which is afforded by the policy of the person riding the bike at the time.

So if I borrow my dads bike under my 3rd party extension and then crash it in to someone else my policy will pay for the 3rd party damage but not for the damage to my dads bike.

2. If the vehicle is not owned, leased or hired to them then there is nothing to stop people doing it. But again, if you stack it then you won't get anything back. I guess it's like a lot of people insure nice cars and bikes fully comp compared to insuring ratters/ runabouts TPFT or TPO. Sure, you could insure a C1 and then have your mate buy/register a 911 Turbo, but if you stack it or it gets nicked then you are well out of pocket!

I think the only place where people may come unstuck is if the vehicle is left on the roadside at the shops/work or wherever when there isn't a policy in place on it - is it still in your possession when it's parked up and you're not with it? does the third party insurance cover the vehicle when you are only riding it, or when you are in possession of it? What counts as possession? Does your third party cover end as soon as you get out/off of it?

Confused
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G
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PostPosted: 17:00 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

thepuma wrote:

If the vehicle didnt need to be insured then you would have all and sundry insuring a 700cc citroen c1 cheaply but actually driving around in sports cars on their 'driving other vehicles' policy extention.

Exactly the same insurance as if the vehicle was insured by other people too.

The insurance which covers the person riding/driving it.
So if someone is insured to drive other vehicles and they are using it, it is that insurance that covers it.

If I'm passing you when it's convenient, I can do it Thumbs Up.
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thepuma
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PostPosted: 17:29 - 06 Sep 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

G wrote:
thepuma wrote:

If the vehicle didnt need to be insured then you would have all and sundry insuring a 700cc citroen c1 cheaply but actually driving around in sports cars on their 'driving other vehicles' policy extention.

Exactly the same insurance as if the vehicle was insured by other people too.

The insurance which covers the person riding/driving it.
So if someone is insured to drive other vehicles and they are using it, it is that insurance that covers it.

If I'm passing you when it's convenient, I can do it Thumbs Up.


But the vehicle not owned by you has to be insured by law to be on a public road does it not?
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