Help & FAQs    Search BCF    Members    Groups    Events Calendar
Resend my activation email : Register : Log in 
BCF: Bike Chat Forums


ANPR- private car parks

 Reply to topic
Bike Chat Forums Index -> Random Banter
View previous topic : View next topic  
Author Message

Wobbling Dog
Nitrous Nuisance



Joined: 12 Mar 2013
Karma :
PostPosted: 18:43 - 04 Nov 2013    Post subject: ANPR- private car parks Reply with quote
Earlier this week at my local Tescos an uninsured car was seized and taken away from the car park. https://www.facebook.com/pages/Leeds-Police-Garforth-Kippax-Swillington-Methley-NPT/214919235301233 (2nd November)
So what's going on ? are private ANPR equipped car parks checking valid insurance now ? I can only hope the owner was being followed by the police into the car park at the time. Notice that Liverpool Airport are up to this sort of thing- https://www.liverpoolairport.com/car-parking/automatic-number-plate-recognition-anpr.html
Every Little Helps !
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

iooi
Super Spammer



Joined: 14 Jan 2007
Karma :
PostPosted: 18:54 - 04 Nov 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Should see the roads round Bradford quiet soon then.. Laughing

Great idea, anything that gets uninsured twats off the road.
____________________
Just because my bike was A DIVVY, does not mean i am......
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

pepperami
Super Spammer



Joined: 17 Jan 2010
Karma :
PostPosted: 18:55 - 04 Nov 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Yet again, I say welcome to 1984 Sad
____________________
I am the sum total of my own existence, what went before makes me who I am now!
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Monkeypony
World Chat Champion



Joined: 21 Sep 2011
Karma :
PostPosted: 19:28 - 04 Nov 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Why worry? If you're taxed and insured then no problem. If not, you're just a cunt anyway...
____________________
Current bike - 2018 H2-SX, 2004 SV1000s, 2016 Aprilia RSV4 RF, 2017 Sherco SERF 300, 2003 Suzuki DRZ400 (stolen - AY53 JUU)
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

dransy
World Chat Champion



Joined: 04 May 2005
Karma :
PostPosted: 19:31 - 04 Nov 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
I'm surprised it even had wheels in kippax/swilli Very Happy never mind insurance
____________________
Being shot out of a cannon will always be better than being squeezed out of a tube. That is why God made fast motorcycles
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail You must be logged in to rate posts

Monkeypony
World Chat Champion



Joined: 21 Sep 2011
Karma :
PostPosted: 19:34 - 04 Nov 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Why worry? If you're taxed and insured then no problem. If not, you're just a cunt anyway...
____________________
Current bike - 2018 H2-SX, 2004 SV1000s, 2016 Aprilia RSV4 RF, 2017 Sherco SERF 300, 2003 Suzuki DRZ400 (stolen - AY53 JUU)
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Benson_JV
World Chat Champion



Joined: 04 May 2010
Karma :
PostPosted: 19:46 - 04 Nov 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Monkeypony wrote:
Why worry? If you're taxed and insured then no problem. If not, you're just a cunt anyway...


If I drove to tesco, did my shopping then fell over and had to stay in hospital for a few days, during which time my car insurance lapsed, I would be a cunt?
____________________
Willson - "If you go out on that CBR600 in the winter, you're going to do more miles on your side than on your wheels."
Riding: CBR600FW Driving: Audi A6
Previous Bikes: '96 Bandit 600, '96 GPz305
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website You must be logged in to rate posts

Rogerborg
nimbA



Joined: 26 Oct 2010
Karma :
PostPosted: 19:48 - 04 Nov 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Coppers wrote:
There was also a car seized at approx 15:15 on the 1/11/13 which was being driven with no insurance and no license etc.The car was seized from Tesco's car park and the driver will be attending court for his actions.

I wouldn't read anything more than that into it.

Car park ANPR is used purely for revenue raising. Why would the operators even want to get access to the MID, when there's no money in it for them?
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

FretGrinder
World Chat Champion



Joined: 29 Jul 2010
Karma :
PostPosted: 19:49 - 04 Nov 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Benson_JV wrote:
Monkeypony wrote:
Why worry? If you're taxed and insured then no problem. If not, you're just a cunt anyway...


If I drove to Tesco, did my shopping then fell over and had to stay in hospital for a few days, during which time my car insurance lapsed, I would be a cunt?


Not necessarily, but anyone with any common sense would have been in the process of sorting it out before it lapsed.

But, you'd also be a tad unlucky for that to happen Laughing
____________________
Yamaha MT-09

ಠ_ಠ
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Benno
World Chat Champion



Joined: 06 May 2012
Karma :
PostPosted: 20:09 - 04 Nov 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Monkeypony wrote:
[If you've got nothing to hide you've got nothing to fear]


*hem hem*
Quote:

I live in a country generally assumed to be a dictatorship. One of the Arab spring countries. I have lived through curfews and have seen the outcomes of the sort of surveillance now being revealed in the US. People here talking about curfews aren't realizing what that actually FEELS like. It isn't about having to go inside, and the practicality of that. It's about creating the feeling that everyone, everything is watching. A few points:

1) the purpose of this surveillance from the governments point of view is to control enemies of the state. Not terrorists. People who are coalescing around ideas that would destabilize the status quo. These could be religious ideas. These could be groups like anon who are too good with tech for the governments liking. It makes it very easy to know who these people are. It also makes it very simple to control these people.

Lets say you are a college student and you get in with some people who want to stop farming practices that hurt animals. So you make a plan and go to protest these practices. You get there, and wow, the protest is huge. You never expected this, you were just goofing off. Well now everyone who was there is suspect. Even though you technically had the right to protest, you're now considered a dangerous person.

With this tech in place, the government doesn't have to put you in jail. They can do something more sinister. They can just email you a sexy picture you took with a girlfriend. Or they can email you a note saying that they can prove your dad is cheating on his taxes. Or they can threaten to get your dad fired. All you have to do, the email says, is help them catch your friends in the group. You have to report back every week, or you dad might lose his job. So you do. You turn in your friends and even though they try to keep meetings off grid, you're reporting on them to protect your dad.

2) Let's say number one goes on. The country is a weird place now. Really weird. Pretty soon, a movement springs up like occupy, except its bigger this time. People are really serious, and they are saying they want a government without this power. I guess people are realizing that it is a serious deal. You see on the news that tear gas was fired. Your friend calls you, frantic. They're shooting people. Oh my god. you never signed up for this. You say, fuck it. My dad might lose his job but I won't be responsible for anyone dying. That's going too far. You refuse to report anymore. You just stop going to meetings. You stay at home, and try not to watch the news. Three days later, police come to your door and arrest you. They confiscate your computer and phones, and they beat you up a bit. No one can help you so they all just sit quietly. They know if they say anything they're next. This happened in the country I live in. It is not a joke.

3) Its hard to say how long you were in there. What you saw was horrible. Most of the time, you only heard screams. People begging to be killed. Noises you've never heard before. You, you were lucky. You got kicked every day when they threw your moldy food at you, but no one shocked you. No one used sexual violence on you, at least that you remember. There were some times they gave you pills, and you can't say for sure what happened then. To be honest, sometimes the pills were the best part of your day, because at least then you didn't feel anything. You have scars on you from the way you were treated. You learn in prison that torture is now common. But everyone who uploads videos or pictures of this torture is labeled a leaker. Its considered a threat to national security. Pretty soon, a cut you got on your leg is looking really bad. You think it's infected. There were no doctors in prison, and it was so overcrowded, who knows what got in the cut. You go to the doctor, but he refuses to see you. He knows if he does the government can see the records that he treated you. Even you calling his office prompts a visit from the local police.

You decide to go home and see your parents. Maybe they can help. This leg is getting really bad. You get to their house. They aren't home. You can't reach them no matter how hard you try. A neighbor pulls you aside, and he quickly tells you they were arrested three weeks ago and haven't been seen since. You vaguely remember mentioning to them on the phone you were going to that protest. Even your little brother isn't there.

4) Is this even really happening? You look at the news. Sports scores. Celebrity news. It's like nothing is wrong. What the hell is going on? A stranger smirks at you reading the paper. You lose it. You shout at him "fuck you dude what are you laughing at can't you see I've got a fucking wound on my leg?"

"Sorry," he says. "I just didn't know anyone read the news anymore." There haven't been any real journalists for months. They're all in jail.

Everyone walking around is scared. They can't talk to anyone else because they don't know who is reporting for the government. Hell, at one time YOU were reporting for the government. Maybe they just want their kid to get through school. Maybe they want to keep their job. Maybe they're sick and want to be able to visit the doctor. It's always a simple reason. Good people always do bad things for simple reasons.

You want to protest. You want your family back. You need help for your leg. This is way beyond anything you ever wanted. It started because you just wanted to see fair treatment in farms. Now you're basically considered a terrorist, and everyone around you might be reporting on you. You definitely can't use a phone or email. You can't get a job. You can't even trust people face to face anymore. On every corner, there are people with guns. They are as scared as you are. They just don't want to lose their jobs. They don't want to be labeled as traitors.

This all happened in the country where I live.

You want to know why revolutions happen? Because little by little by little things get worse and worse. But this thing that is happening now is big. This is the key ingredient. This allows them to know everything they need to know to accomplish the above. The fact that they are doing it is proof that they are the sort of people who might use it in the way I described. In the country I live in, they also claimed it was for the safety of the people. Same in Soviet Russia. Same in East Germany. In fact, that is always the excuse that is used to surveil everyone. But it has never ONCE proven to be the reality.

Maybe Obama won't do it. Maybe the next guy won't, or the one after him. Maybe this story isn't about you. Maybe it happens 10 or 20 years from now, when a big war is happening, or after another big attack. Maybe it's about your daughter or your son. We just don't know yet. But what we do know is that right now, in this moment we have a choice. Are we okay with this, or not? Do we want this power to exist, or not?

You know for me, the reason I'm upset is that I grew up in school saying the pledge of allegiance. I was taught that the United States meant "liberty and justice for all." You get older, you learn that in this country we define that phrase based on the constitution. That's what tells us what liberty is and what justice is. Well, the government just violated that ideal. So if they aren't standing for liberty and justice anymore, what are they standing for? Safety?

Ask yourself a question. In the story I told above, does anyone sound safe?

I didn't make anything up. These things happened to people I know. We used to think it couldn't happen in America. But guess what? It's starting to happen.

I actually get really upset when people say "I don't have anything to hide. Let them read everything." People saying that have no idea what they are bringing down on their own heads. They are naive, and we need to listen to people in other countries who are clearly telling us that this is a horrible horrible sign and it is time to stand up and say no.

____________________
I'm autistic. That means I'm smarter than you.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

andys675
World Chat Champion



Joined: 08 Feb 2007
Karma :
PostPosted: 22:09 - 04 Nov 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
the new tesco at west brom charges 80p for two hours minimum even if you're only using the clothing bank for 5 minutes

I make sure everyone I know who uses it pays by debit card, as the bank charges are at least 30p for them
____________________
Some people feel the rain, others just get wet.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Walloper
Super Spammer



Joined: 24 Feb 2005
Karma :
PostPosted: 23:08 - 04 Nov 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
andys675 wrote:
the new tesco at west brom charges 80p for two hours minimum even if you're only using the clothing bank for 5 minutes

I make sure everyone I know who uses it pays by debit card, as the bank charges are at least 30p for them


Asda (Kingswood, Hull.) had a 3 for two on French sticks yesterday.
____________________
W-ireless A-rtificial L-ifeform L-imited to O-bservation P-eacekeeping and E-fficient R-epair
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Rogerborg
nimbA



Joined: 26 Oct 2010
Karma :
PostPosted: 23:12 - 04 Nov 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Walloper wrote:
Asda (Kingswood, Hull.) had a 3 for two on French sticks yesterday.

Full length ones? Who's going to get through 3 in one day - those things go stale as soon as you look at them. When will the madness end? Sad
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

supZ
World Chat Champion



Joined: 03 Feb 2009
Karma :
PostPosted: 10:32 - 05 Nov 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Monkeypony wrote:
Why worry? If you're taxed and insured then no problem. If not, you're just a cunt anyway...

pretty much this.
____________________
CBR954RR - Daily toy
CBR600RR - Trackbike
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

doggone
World Chat Champion



Joined: 20 May 2004
Karma :
PostPosted: 13:23 - 05 Nov 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Rogerborg wrote:
When will the madness end? Sad


Good question Laughing
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Wobbling Dog
Nitrous Nuisance



Joined: 12 Mar 2013
Karma :
PostPosted: 15:28 - 05 Nov 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
doggone wrote:
Rogerborg wrote:
When will the madness end? Sad


Good question Laughing


I often wondered that.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

covent.gardens
World Clap Champion



Joined: 09 Jun 2012
Karma :
PostPosted: 16:08 - 05 Nov 2013    Post subject: Re: ANPR- private car parks Reply with quote
Wobbling Dog wrote:
So what's going on ? are private ANPR equipped car parks checking valid insurance now ?

I don't know about that (doubt it), but in our supermarket we get coppers in on a daily basis, including traffic, whether they're dealing with shoplifters (yep, they send traffic cars for that sometimes) or picking up a quick lunch... if it pings their ANPR they'll have a looksie.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Walloper
Super Spammer



Joined: 24 Feb 2005
Karma :
PostPosted: 16:39 - 05 Nov 2013    Post subject: Re: ANPR- private car parks Reply with quote
covent.gardens wrote:
Wobbling Dog wrote:
So what's going on ? are private ANPR equipped car parks checking valid insurance now ?

I don't know about that (doubt it), but in our supermarket we get coppers in on a daily basis, including traffic, whether they're dealing with shoplifters (yep, they send traffic cars for that sometimes) or picking up a quick lunch... if it pings their ANPR they'll have a looksie.


Their APNR cannot be 100% accurate as it relies on a database that is sometimes not updated.

The vehicle is on private land so doesn't need tax or MoT. So long as it is SORNed.

They may pick up a plate on APNR but whether they can tow is a different issue.
Unless the land owner/operator responsible for such requests a tow.
A private company could legally/illegally tow and then the vehicle owner would have to fetch the vehicle from some pound.
There are a lot of companies authorised to search DVLA data to find the registered keepers.
The main beef I have is with DVLA selling the info to profiteering organisations. It is 100% immoral and would be dangerous for anyone who tried to tow my car. I tend to see reason after the fact/handcuffs have been fitted. Evil or Very Mad
____________________
W-ireless A-rtificial L-ifeform L-imited to O-bservation P-eacekeeping and E-fficient R-epair
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

covent.gardens
World Clap Champion



Joined: 09 Jun 2012
Karma :
PostPosted: 18:39 - 05 Nov 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
No, supermarket car parks when open (ie not barriered off at closing time) are public places and fall under the RTA, vehicles using them need to have insurance etc.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

G
The Voice of Reason



Joined: 02 Feb 2002
Karma :
PostPosted: 19:28 - 05 Nov 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Wonder if the police might start giving them backhanders for any 'leads'.

I suspect this case may have been either the police following, or just driving around with their own ANPR on.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Walloper
Super Spammer



Joined: 24 Feb 2005
Karma :
PostPosted: 19:46 - 05 Nov 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
covent.gardens wrote:
No, supermarket car parks when open (ie not barriered off at closing time) are public places and fall under the RTA, vehicles using them need to have insurance etc.


I think that is not true.
If they fall under RTA then the owner would be responsible for maintaining the car park and therefore responsible for damage to vehicles caused by their negligence in maintaining the car park.

The Police have no business on private land unless invited by a the owner/operator or a crime is in progress.
So since having a vehicle on private land, that complies with the current rules of SORN, is not in fact a crime then the police can not do anything as the vehicle is not on a public road.

Since not all supermarkets have barriers your theory is flawed but you are at liberty to show me the document which indicates when private land comes under public jurisdiction.
____________________
W-ireless A-rtificial L-ifeform L-imited to O-bservation P-eacekeeping and E-fficient R-epair
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

covent.gardens
World Clap Champion



Joined: 09 Jun 2012
Karma :
PostPosted: 20:20 - 05 Nov 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Walloper wrote:
Since not all supermarkets have barriers your theory is flawed

Whaaaat?

If they don't have barriers, then the land is regarded as open to the public all the time. If they have barriers and they're closed, then it ceases to be public access and the RTA does not apply. What is flawed about that?

Walloper wrote:
but you are at liberty to show me the document which indicates when private land comes under public jurisdiction.

Mate, it has been discussed here before and practically everywhere else. I'd respectfully ask for you to spend a little time Googling first and then come back to me if you still don't agree...
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Walloper
Super Spammer



Joined: 24 Feb 2005
Karma :
PostPosted: 20:29 - 05 Nov 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
covent.gardens wrote:
Walloper wrote:
Since not all supermarkets have barriers your theory is flawed

Whaaaat?

If they don't have barriers, then the land is regarded as open to the public all the time. If they have barriers and they're closed, then it ceases to be public access and the RTA does not apply. What is flawed about that?

Walloper wrote:
but you are at liberty to show me the document which indicates when private land comes under public jurisdiction.

Mate, it has been discussed here before and practically everywhere else. I'd respectfully ask for you to spend a little time Googling first and then come back to me if you still don't agree...


You quoted RTA. You furnish the RTA governing Private Land and the Road Traffic Act.

FYI A supermarket Car Park is Private Land (unless of course it is land owned by a council and part of some property deal but would still most probably come under private land legislation). It is Not 'policed' by the local Plod. They are at liberty to visit any time they wish and if they see a vehicle or person/s committing a crime they can, if they want, proceed with a report to magistrate/procurator fiscal.

Not everything you read on bcf is the Law matey my boi.

A lot of it is rubbish.
____________________
W-ireless A-rtificial L-ifeform L-imited to O-bservation P-eacekeeping and E-fficient R-epair
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

covent.gardens
World Clap Champion



Joined: 09 Jun 2012
Karma :
PostPosted: 20:52 - 05 Nov 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Quote:
Amendment of the Road Traffic Act 1988 in respect of motor insurance requirements

2. (1) The Road Traffic Act 1988(1) is amended in accordance with paragraphs (2) to (6) below.

(2) In section 143 (users of motor vehicles to be insured or secured against third party risks)–

(a)in subsection (1)(a), after “road” there shall be inserted “or other public place”;
(b)in subsection (1)(b), after “road” there shall be inserted “or other public place”.
(3) In section 145(3)(a) (requirements in respect of policies of insurance), after “road” there shall be inserted “or other public place”.

(4) In section 146(4) (requirements in respect of securities), after “road ” there shall be inserted “or other public place”.

(5) In section 165(1)(b) (obligation to provide name and address and produce documents to constable), after “road” there shall be inserted “or other public place”.

(6) In section 170 (duty to stop and report accident)–

(a)in subsection (1), after “on a road” there shall be inserted “ or other public place”,
(b)in subsection (1)(b)(iii), after “the road” there shall be inserted “ or place”.

Specifically amended so that it includes public places like car parks.

A public place isn't necessarily a place owned by the public, it is a place to which the public has access; plenty of case law to prove that.

Google.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

JP7
World Chat Champion



Joined: 22 Dec 2008
Karma :
PostPosted: 20:54 - 05 Nov 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Walloper wrote:
covent.gardens wrote:
No, supermarket car parks when open (ie not barriered off at closing time) are public places and fall under the RTA, vehicles using them need to have insurance etc.


I think that is not true.
If they fall under RTA then the owner would be responsible for maintaining the car park and therefore responsible for damage to vehicles caused by their negligence in maintaining the car park.

The Police have no business on private land unless invited by a the owner/operator or a crime is in progress.
So since having a vehicle on private land, that complies with the current rules of SORN, is not in fact a crime then the police can not do anything as the vehicle is not on a public road.

Since not all supermarkets have barriers your theory is flawed but you are at liberty to show me the document which indicates when private land comes under public jurisdiction.

This is wrong I'm afraid. Under the Road Traffic Act supermarket car parks are a public place (a place to which the public have access on payment or otherwise). A vehicle needs to be insured "on a road or other public place."

It's the same for drink driving, or if a crash happens.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts
Old Thread Alert!

The last post was made 12 years, 118 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful?
  Display posts from previous:   
This page may contain affiliate links, which means we may earn a small commission if a visitor clicks through and makes a purchase. By clicking on an affiliate link, you accept that third-party cookies will be set.

Post new topic   Reply to topic    Bike Chat Forums Index -> Random Banter All times are GMT
Page 1 of 1

 
 You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum

Read the Terms of Use! - Powered by phpBB © phpBB Group
 
Debug Mode: ON - Server: birks (www) - Page Generation Time: 0.10 Sec - Server Load: 0.67 - MySQL Queries: 13 - Page Size: 143.37 Kb