Costs vs Car??

[orangepeeleo]

Hi Guys,

Probs the zillionth time this threads been started but I've done some googling and can't get a solid answer.

My wife is about to start driving lessons and will have the car once passed, this means that I now have the choice of a bike or car for commuting to work (200-250 miles per week, approx 12k per year). I've been looking at getting a Lexmoto ZSX 125 financed at £70p/m (poss even less depending on how much I can save while my wifes learning to drive). Or a new YBR/CBF, but given the state of the cbf bought in glasgae recently I'm starting to pay a little less attention to the jap rules/chinky shite argument, and the ZSX looks like a nice piece of kit imo

The costs of my car at the minute, a Hyundai i30 1.6, are as follows, getting 49mpg on the trip computer at the minute after 3k miles of ownership.

Fuel = £200 p/m
Insurance = £430 per year
Servicing = £130~ per year
MOT = £40
Tyres = £240 per year (for 4 tyres, changing each set once basically)
Brake Pads = £100-200 per year (1 change on each wheel)
Tax = £35 per year

What I would like your advice on if possible is similar costs for a bike, the bits I don't know myself.

Fuel = £60 p/m (Going on a rough 100mpg)
Insurance = £176 per year TPFT (Ran comparison on thebikeinsurer.co.uk)
Servicing/Maintenance = ????
MOT = £30?? (No MOT for 3 years ofc)
Tyres = ?????
Tax = £17 per year??

Obviously on top of this I'd need a CBT/Gear/Security stuff, but can't include that in costs as I'll prob get a bike for pleasure either way eventually tbh.

The roads I travel on are NSL and a little bit of dual carriageway so not bothered about doing it on a 125 forever tbh, hence why I don't mind buying new on finance as I will run it for long enough for it to pay for itself and pass my tests on it to get rid of L-plates.

Any advice would be hugely appreciated

Thanks

[bamt]

One thing you haven't mentioned is depreciation.

If you are thinking of buying a new-ish car (rather than a 10 year old beater), then it is likely to depreciate more than the Lexmoto cost in the first year, which could swing you towards the bike.

[bren_9311]

Tires for a 125 between £20-£60 each.

Tax is £17.

Lowest I've paid for a mot is £25, Around £30 is the norm.

Maintenance - You can pick up a Haynes manual and do the basic stuff yourself depending on how tool savvy you are. Services from garages vary from £80 - £250 for a major service.

The bike will definatly be cheaper, the lexmoto will lose over 50% of its value as soon as you turn the key in it.

Your better off saving and getting a Jap bike, YBR is a good choice so it the CG.

If its finance you want you can get a second hand YBR for the same monthly cost as the lexmoto (You just have to shop around for finance deals) . And you'll be able to sell if for more than you bought it for it you look after it, and sell it at the right time.

Sure they'll do fiance being a large company. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Yamaha-YBR-125-60-Reg-/251400406682?pt=UK_Motorcycles&hash=item3a88a1c69a
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My opinion is neither copyrighted nor trademarked. If you like, I'll trade for one of yours.
Currently bikeless.
Ps4- bren_9311

[Pigeon]

Servicing/Maintenance = If you buy new and want the 12mths warranty, then you could find 2 services from your dealer in 12mths cost around £120, then its around £15 per 2.5k miles if doing it yourself.
Tyres = Roughly 4k miles, £35-£60 per tyre.

If you are not planning on keeping the bike for a few years, I'd get a 2nd hand jap 125. Do the servicing yourself, sell the bike after 18mth for basically what you paid for it.
Chinese bikes lose circa 30-40% in 1yr based on local prices here.

If you buy a new Chinese bike, you have to accept a significant loss in percentage terms at least or hang on to the thing for 3 years and then break it for parts on ebay.

[Easter Bunny]

I can't see parking, can you park the car at work?
____________________
The light at the end of the tunnel is an oncoming train!

[wr6133]

I'd factor in more on Fuel not a lot more but you will find yourself taking the long route home or riding for fun also you won't manage 100Mpg all the time unless you ride like a Granny on clear roads.

Maintenance will cost less than the car as long as you DIY but factor in time, not masses of time but you will spend more time tinkering with things than with a newish car.

If you want a lexmoto and it's mostly to commute just get the cheapest they offer the Vixen. It's sold by other importers too and is fairly well regarded.

If you want to do this long term just do a DAS course and buy a cheap commuter bike like an ER5, running costs on that as a whole will be similar (or a little less) than a car. It'll give you more flexibility (and grins) than a 125.

Oh and the lexmoto won't lose 50% of value soon as you turn the key, it will depreciate but as a % that depreciation won't be much worse than a brand new Jap bike.

To dispel the other myths people mumble before they lick the nearest window.

Parts are commonplace and easy to find for most Chinese bikes, in particular Lexmoto branded bikes as the parent company lexeter are the UK's biggest parts importer and supplier.

It doesn't turn up in a box in 36 million parts

It's not made of metal coloured cardboard

Insurers do not frown on them and inflate premiums/not cover them

They last more than 3 years my past 2 have both been registered first in 2007

[bren_9311]

[Az]

Based on a CBF125

Fuel = £60 p/m (Going on a rough 100mpg), sounds about right my CBF ran at around 100mpg and was ragged about everywhere.

Insurance = £176 per year TPFT

Servicing/Maintenance = £100 (if u do it yourself, it's very easy to do yourself especially on a 125)
Service intervals on a CBF125 were every 2,500 miles iirc. Service at the dealer was £100 and maintained its warranty and the same service at home would cost about £25.

Then you have to consider all the other consumables, such as chain/sprockets, any problems that may occur, tools you'd buy to fix problems with bike or labour you'd pay, wether you'd buy expensive parts or cheap parts, maintenance supplies such as chain lube and bike cleaning products and then there's the possibility you're going to drop the bike if it's your first bike, which could equate to a lot depending on drop and bike.

MOT = £30
Depends on where you go, but it's generally £30.
My MOT on my current bike was £30.

Tyres = £135 : £80 for rear (average, if i did the math right) & £55 for front.
Rear tyre on my CBF 125 lasted 9,000 miles and it cost £60 fitted for ContiGo's (4 rear tyres for ever 3 years). Front tyre would need replacing around 12,000 miles and I believe the front tyre is around £55 fitted.

Tax = £17 per year

Bike Total: £1178 per year excluding any tools, maintenance materials, repairs and replacement parts you may buy.

Car Total: £3375-3475, the bike's cheaper… a lot cheaper.

[Pigeon]

[Polarbear]

[iooi]

[barrkel]

[bren_9311]

[wr6133]

[nowhere.elysium]

[wr6133]

[orangepeeleo]

[Rogerborg]

I would note that the ZSX is as yet an unknown quantity. The Lexmoto Vixen (and its Dihao sister, the Arrow) are a bit more basic, but have a decent owners group and are (IME) reasonably robust if you look after them.

They also have the merit of being the cheapest bikes to buy, which means that you'll likely lose less on them.
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Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[orangepeeleo]

[Mark65]

I have been commuting on my CG since last March, before that a YBR for 2.5 years, my Cg has already paid for itself in what I have saved in fuel alone compared to the car and now the CG is an asset. When I get my test done I will look for something similar but bigger to commute on and maybe something nicer to enjoy in the good weather. Fuel alone in the car was £28-30 a week for 200 miles on the bike its about £8-9 a week for 150 miles, 50 miles shorter over the week using country roads. Once you adapt to the shit weather its great.
Mark
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07 Yamaha YBR125, 07 Honda CG125 , 15 CBR300R (Chocolate Crank, Deaded), 16 CB500FA, 19 Honda Forza 300, 70 Suzuki SV650

[orangepeeleo]

[Ribenapigeon]

Against a small family car a 125 is going to be cheaper. A big litre sporsbike not so much.

It sounds like you like to buy new and it can be the right choice if your prepared for the depreciation. But those cheap chinese bikes have a pretty poor rep so for the cost of one of those new you could get a YBR or CBF with a years warranty left and finance through a dealer. Just hop on and go then trade in after you've got the licence.

Security was my suprise cost. £500 on a shed. £300 on reenforcing it and solid locks plus £100 on video security add to that £200 insurance and £300 on a tracker/alarm and another £100 on a decent chain and disc lock. A lot of cash almost as much as a decent second hand 125.

Once youvbought into owning a bike though the costs drop. I really can't see myself going back to a car.

[Baffler186]

You have to decide what you want the bike for. If it is purely commuting then you'll probably see a saving with a 125 versus a car, but if you intend getting into biking (using it at weekends, buying better gear/upgrades for your bike, big bike test etc etc) then the costs soon mount up. I had this discussion with my Dad the other day who said "why don't you get a car". I just said "because I love bikes".

Also if you've always got wet gear, you'll probably find yourself like me buying more than one set of gloves so you have dry ones to use when the others are wet. And if you're not that interested in bikes you probably won't want to service the bike yourself and you'll end up paying the garage to do it.

[Teflon-Mike]

See I just want a bike because its cheaper than a car. Cars is cars, bikes is bikes; they are apples and oranges, both fruits; but of a totally different nature; and comparisons, particularly economic comparisons are only valid within strict limits.

Bike; at best can carry two people and a limited amount and range of baggage. They work well IF they are only carrying one person and little luggage; and on a daily commute; a small or lower capacity 'commuter-bike' can be very efficient for THAT one transport need, but ONLY that one transport need.

Car: generic utilty transport, that can carry typically four people and a much greater quantity and variety of everyday luggage/baggage. It has its compromises; but convenience and versatility usually outweighs the economic efficiency for... oooh... well at last count, bikes only accounted for 1% of all UK road-miles... and I would lay odds on that well over half of that 1% is cranked up by enthusiastic leisure bikers... not folk getting to and from work each day... so 99.9% of the population DONT find any 'worth while' saving from a motorbike.

So before we begin, lets just say that you are gambling HEAVILY that you are going to be in that half a percent of folk who MIGHT make a bike pay for itself..... odds ent good is they?

Its a matter of Entropy; Work expands to fill the time available; Clutter expands to fill the space available; Expenditure increases to consume the funds available.

Natural balance comes into play, and basically, 'savings' just mean you have extra pennies in your pocket... so you spent them...

However, on this question, its trifficult; the 'ecconomy' numbers look favourable. Car, 50mpg, bike 100mpg, gonna cost half the money, right?

Well... rarely works that way, and even if it did; there's small matter of the 'start up overhead'.

You have to buy a bike; insure it, tax it, and get a licence for it; but before even that; you need to do a CBT course to validate your LEARNERS licence, so you can ride on L's... and you are going to need some kit to go with it; Law says at the least a crash hat, but unless you like getting wet cold and miserable; water-proof riding gear is a good idea; as well... and that's JUST the start... L-Plates mean 'LEARNER'.. idea is you use provisional entitlement to practice for tests, NOT to ride around forever, pretending to be a learner.
Of course, you CAN, but pretty stupid, and the only excuse for it is lazyness or stupidity, and neither the lazy nor the stupid are likely to last long on two wheels, where hazards abound and consequences of being stupid or lazy, tend to be rather painful.

CBT lasts two years; if you dont get a full licence in that time. you have to re-do your CBT... dead money that; paying to be taught something you have already been taught.. even more stupid when the tests only cost £120 give or take a couple of quid, about what a repeat CBT course costs..... and if you cant pass-em after two years 'practice'... well pretty poor show really.... is any more practice going to get you up to scratch?

Ah? But courses cost hundreds.... you have to Do-DAS duntyu?

Well, no, you dont... but if old enough and if you want to ride more than a 125, probably what you will want to do... and yes they do cost hundreds.... PLUS the £120 test fees....

SO! L-Plating on a 125 is NOT the be all and end all... its JUST where you start.

And having got yourself started... and spent whatever its taken to get started... you can almost garantee that ANY 'plan' you might have had is going to go out the window....

You will either get all enthused by your new interest.... and then the idea that its 'only' for the petrol savings will go out the window, as you rationalise the idea that if you are going to carry on biking, you are either going to have to do them tests or keep paying for repeat CBT's... and trying to rationalise that there's 'no point' doing the £121.50's worth of tests on the 125 you have 'just' to keep riding a 125... because it is cheaper than first repeat CBT... if you are going to take them tests, you want to do it on a big boy bike and get the full fat, ride what you like licence for it, and spending a fair few hundred in one go, instead of a hundred and a bit, spread over three stages, suddenly makes SO MUCH 'economic sense'

Of course, if you do that course, and pass them tests, then seems pointless to have spent ALL that money to carry on riding a 'tiddler', and a 500 is SO much more comfortable, so much more capable, and its 'hardly' any more expensive to run, dear, honest

And after doing the 'My-First Big-Bike' bit on something that could, by a judicious bit of cost analysis be shown to be cheaper than a car..... well... you WILL want something a bit more... err... well, 'more'..... expensive! probably about the only thing I can grantee it WILL be more! And THAT, is likely to NOT be cheaper to run mile for mile than an ecconomy car... before, you get to the little matter of the fact that this new 'interest' is actually taking you off on more miles than you would have commuted by car, as you are using it as a toy.... and REALLY trying to justify that toy, because you use it to get two and from work.

And you are back to opening statement; Expenditure increases to consume the funds available and when we have an enthusiasm, worse a NEW enthusiasm, its incredible how much we suddenly never even new we could buy, that suddenly we for some reason just cant live without..... and any 'saving' we find will be spent ten times over on these new 'essentials' to our new found 'life-style'.

OR... plan B - The harsh reality of riding; every day, in all weathers, on a lightweight, low powered motorcycle; with a big red 'L' on the back; that does strange things to normally dozy and docile myopic drivers; who wouldn't SEE a bike unless it came through their windscreen... and get SEEN by them, and turn them into steering wheel gnashing crazed road-hogs that HAVE to be doing at least 3mph more than you, and HAVE to be in that gap in front of you, that is far to big for a mere LEARNER..... in the freezing cold, with numb fingers, stinging eyes, a fogged up visor, and and an ever increasing sense of vulnerability...... as they cut you up, pull out on you, over take so close if you turned your head, your knee would probably clobber thier mirror, etc etc etc. And you give up...

At which point, you might, of course recover the value of the bike.. provided the last straw wasn't when you wobbled into a ditch and wrecked it... but there's little else you might recover; few will buy a second hand crash hat; and unless you bought top-draw gear at the outset, you will unlikely get much if anything for that; you might get a few quid back off the insurance, if you are lucky; if not, cashing it in with penalty fees could end up costing you! And you cant go back to your CBT school and say you don't need it any more and try and cash in your DL196 form!

So in that case; probably quite likely that any 'savings' you might have made compared to running a car, will be negligible in comparison to the unrecoverable portion of your start-up-overheads.

In short... this is NOT something you should consider purely on economic reasoning; as you are gambling on uncertainty, in which the most likely outcome is... It's Gonna cost-Ya-Mate!

IF you really want to ride bikes... THAT should be reason enough to go for it.

You ought not need to try and find economic intensive... do it for the love, not the money. Do it for the money, and chances are you will NOT save money, you will only make yourself suffer, emotionally, physically, and financially... ESPECIALLY if you are trying to sell your 'want' to ride a bike, on a cost analysis to a woman.....

Good news is, running a bike, MAY in some circumstances work out economically favourable; IF you find them circumstances... treat it as bonus; enjoy it along with the rest of the pursuit. But DO NOT bank on finding those cash savings, 'cos chances are you never will.
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My Webby'Tef's-tQ, loads of stuff about my bikes, my Land-Rovers, and the stuff I do with them!
Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?'

[Rogerborg]