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KnuckleShot
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PostPosted: 16:11 - 10 Feb 2015    Post subject: How far? Reply with quote

Hi guys,

I'm going to come straight out, how far can you lean on a bike?
Can I lean further than I think? I feel like the bike will come underneath me sometimes especially on a roundabout. I don't want to be stupid an end up coming off.
If someone can help a noob out Smile
By the way I'm on a tablet as well so grammar isn't exactly on point.

Cheers
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CaNsA
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PostPosted: 16:16 - 10 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

There are so many variables to consider.
Tyre model.
Tyre temp
Road temp
Road condition
Speed
Type of bend
Body position

But generally, if you are on your face then you've gone too far.
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c_dug
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PostPosted: 16:25 - 10 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Probably further than you think but there isn't a definitive answer.

From experience if you low side from leaning too far it doesn't actually hurt that much anyway, so long as you manage to avoid the road furniture.

p.s. don't practice with a pillion!
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KnuckleShot
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PostPosted: 16:32 - 10 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well I've come off a bike before, not from leaning though, it bloody hurt so don't fancy it haha. I just feel that bike may come from underneath now I'm not sure if that my mind playing tricks on me or the bike is actually going.
Thanks Cansa, quite a lot of things to take into account.
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Northern Monkey
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PostPosted: 16:39 - 10 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

If its a warm day, and the road is dry, and your tyres are warm. If the footpegs aren't rubbing against the tarmac, you can probably lean further
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arry
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PostPosted: 16:53 - 10 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

KnuckleShot wrote:
I'm not sure if that my mind playing tricks on me or the bike is actually going.


This time of year isn't the best time to test the hypothesis. Too much scope for surface variation for starters.
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RhynoCZ
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PostPosted: 17:00 - 10 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

The goal is to keep the bike as upright as you can. Thumbs Up

When I touch the tar with the peg, I usually go feck fast. Razz
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pinkyfloyd
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PostPosted: 17:02 - 10 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lean over until the bike falls over.

Next time don't lean that far over.

Result. Found out how far you can lean the bike over.
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monkeybiker
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PostPosted: 17:09 - 10 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

There are so many factor involved. A moto gp will lean more than a road bike with the same rider.

Road conditions,temperature,tyres,suspension,riders throttle control and other factors all play a part.

Ride at a pace that 'you' are comfortable with and don't worry about chicken strips and all that nonsence.

If you keep focusing on how fast you can go and how far you can lean it over you will end up having a nasty crash.
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KnuckleShot
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PostPosted: 17:25 - 10 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the replies Thumbs Up guess it's something I wil know over time, with the bike I have with certain conditions and all the above mentioned
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 18:02 - 10 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Watch some moto gymkhana.
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Matt B
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PostPosted: 18:09 - 10 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

60 degrees lean angle, but only if you are Marquez/Rossi/Lorenzo on a factory GP bike.
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c_dug
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PostPosted: 18:32 - 10 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

KnuckleShot wrote:
Well I've come off a bike before, not from leaning though, it bloody hurt so don't fancy it haha. I just feel that bike may come from underneath now I'm not sure if that my mind playing tricks on me or the bike is actually going.
Thanks Cansa, quite a lot of things to take into account.


I never said coming off doesn't hurt! Though the pain killers certainly put a smile on your face Mr. Green

https://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee81/paddy2007dug/altAi8mw8PiU5NUSTxRl3-mZy8atptOsOh-RncF_ONm-fzj_zps654836cd.jpg

More that once you're low enough to lose grip (*in favourable conditions*) you've basically only got a foot or two to fall at most, if you avoid sliding into anything solid and you're wearing decent enough gear to bear the abrasion then you're likely to be ok. It's a theory I've tested.
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Dave70
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PostPosted: 22:11 - 10 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

c_dug wrote:
Probably further than you think


Or not as far as you think Embarassed

All good and sound advice here. Especially the "don't try to find out at this time of year" bit.

Wait until it's warm and dry. Sticky road surfaces are your friend, if you want to try it out.

Oh, and while lowsiding while trying probably won't do you much in the way of physical injury, if your bike's covered in nice shiny plastic, it will no doubt hurt your wallet a great deal.
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RhynoCZ
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PostPosted: 23:04 - 10 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is what you are trying to do, it is pointless and dangerous...

https://www.kawiforums.com/attachments/two-wheeled-discussion/3075d1201825180-pic-biker-leaning-wrong-way-counterlean.jpg
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talkToTheHat
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PostPosted: 00:08 - 11 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fit crash bungs, bar end sliders, ablatative givi boxes, engine guards and suchlike before you find out? And a leather onesie? Perhaps try on a closed course somewhere? With professional coaching not us lot?

I take it the photo above intentionally has a potato-to-be leaning the wrong way to illustrate much stupidity?
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 08:03 - 11 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

talkToTheHat wrote:
I take it the photo above intentionally has a potato-to-be leaning the wrong way to illustrate much stupidity?

Like every picture of a moving motorcycle in every motoring press article or advert or trackday picture?

It is a little silly.
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pinkyfloyd
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PostPosted: 08:26 - 11 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

I see this the same as I see knee down's. Some think you are a rubbish rider because you do not get your knee down "innit blud". I was criticised for my "chicken strips" the other day on semi new tyres. Personally I do not care. I ride within my abilities. I know there are faster riders, I know there are better riders. I do not try and out do them. I do not try and keep up. Thats how accidents happen.

How far can you lean a bike over? As far as you lean it over. Chances are, and its a very good chance, the bike can go over further as the bike will always have more ability than the rider.
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illuminateTHEmind wrote: I am just more evolved than most of you guys... this allows me to pick of things quickly which would have normally taken the common man years to master
Hockeystorm65:.well there are childish arguments...there are very childish arguments.....there are really stupid childish arguments and now there are......Pinkfloyd arguments!
Teflon-Mike:I think I agree with just about all Pinky has said.
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talkToTheHat
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PostPosted: 05:04 - 13 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think its possible to get to the edge of my 140/90-15 rear before the pegs touch. That said I got in today and tyres were showing white banding from salt-transfer. I had a 9 year old take the piss out of what he determined were the the three centimetre chicken strips. Such is life.
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Eddie Hitler
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PostPosted: 22:42 - 13 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

pinkyfloyd wrote:
I see this the same as I see knee down's. Some think you are a rubbish rider because you do not get your knee down "innit blud". I was criticised for my "chicken strips" the other day on semi new tyres.


Would love to have been there as they said that to you.

Chicken strips tell nothing of the rider. All they're revealing, like you said, is how insecure they are of their own riding abilities.
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pinkyfloyd
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PostPosted: 06:45 - 14 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Eddie Hitler wrote:
pinkyfloyd wrote:
I see this the same as I see knee down's. Some think you are a rubbish rider because you do not get your knee down "innit blud". I was criticised for my "chicken strips" the other day on semi new tyres.


Would love to have been there as they said that to you.

Chicken strips tell nothing of the rider. All they're revealing, like you said, is how insecure they are of their own riding abilities.


When he caught up at Loomies he avoided me. Wink
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illuminateTHEmind wrote: I am just more evolved than most of you guys... this allows me to pick of things quickly which would have normally taken the common man years to master
Hockeystorm65:.well there are childish arguments...there are very childish arguments.....there are really stupid childish arguments and now there are......Pinkfloyd arguments!
Teflon-Mike:I think I agree with just about all Pinky has said.
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ScaredyCat
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PostPosted: 11:01 - 14 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

talkToTheHat wrote:
I take it the photo above intentionally has a potato-to-be leaning the wrong way to illustrate much stupidity?


Is he leaning the wrong way, or just not leaning?

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/188253/_bcf/counterleanpotato.jpg

I say this because I tend to move the bike under me, with me staying upright, rather than trying to get my knee down...
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talkToTheHat
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PostPosted: 01:14 - 16 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

ScaredyCat wrote:
I say this because I tend to move the bike under me, with me staying upright, rather than trying to get my knee down...


Leaning the bike whilst moving the body to the outside of the corner as pictured moves the centre of gravity closer to the wheel tracks, requiring more lean and reducing available ground clearance. Its not a good idea. Exceptions to this include some off-road techniques and deliberately going out to scrape pegs. I can't see the rider's right foot, but if it's like his left, bearing load on the instep and splayed outwards, the boot will touch before the peg giving an unsuspecting rider a nasty surprise. He's also sticking his right knee out rather than gripping the tank for control, somewhat uselessly as in that position the exhaust will scrape before the knee.

If the rider here kept his ass central on the seat and did not move his upper body beyond control inputs, he'd make that corner with less lean and less risk of unintentional control inputs from moving on the bike. Less lean on the same corner means less chance of touching a peg or you can take the same corner faster. This is how roadcraft would have you ride, and the least fatiguing.

Leaning the body further into the turn further decreases the lean angle of the bike, further increasing sustainable cornering forces before the under carriage of the bike touches down. The tradeoff is control for corner speed as the rider risks making unintentional control inputs by inexpertly changing position and further commits to the corner by the change in body position. It must therefore be done well. There is plenty of coaching on how to do this correctly, and is the current favoured technique for racing on paved roads and circuits.

On a big tourer or awkward cruiser movement side to side in the seat may not be practicable. Personally I'm over the moon my new exhaust gives me more room on the right so I can put the ball of my foot on the peg whilst keeping my foot in line with the bike, rather than on the instep splayed out or ball of foot on the peg with my heal pushed out by the curve of the rear header. This gives much easier ground clearance.
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 08:27 - 16 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

This https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KVWLIfChUwg

Helped me.
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talkToTheHat
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PostPosted: 10:17 - 16 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yep, keith code knows his stuff.
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