Counter-steering

yambabe · World Chat Champion Joined: 12 Jul 2004 Karma :

I learned counter-steering by going out and trying it, although I had it described to me by many people.

Try to find a long, straight quiet bit of road (there's a few round here) with long broken white lines on the middle. Ride along just to the left of the line til you're doing about 40. Now without turning the bars at all, push down very gently on your left bar. You are now on the right of the line! Push down gently on the right bar - back you go to the left. Continue to do this til it feels natural (or something comes the other way Rolling Eyes

).

Once you've got the knack of it, it will come naturally to you as you ride.
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MADDOG · Borekit Bruiser Joined: 26 Jan 2005 Karma :

mrchips · World Chat Champion Joined: 05 Mar 2004 Karma :

The easiest way to prove it to yourself is go along a straight about 40mph and push the right bar. After discovering it I couldnt live without it (you do it anyway subconciously).
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Gazdaman · I did a trackday!!! Joined: 12 Aug 2004 Karma :

I tend to do it when I'm bored, just go along a straight bit of road, loosen your grip on the bars, gently pushing each way feeling the bike pitch about.

It's not something you can really explain, get out there and do it.

Gaz

stryker · Brolly Dolly Joined: 30 Aug 2004 Karma :

Guys, I'm not being funny here (I've only been riding since last erm nov or was it sept?).... anyways. Going at 25-30mph plus I don't know of any way to make the bike turn other than counter steering.....

Are those who "discover" counter steering been going round corners at 30mph or less all this time???? OR is there another way of turning a bike at 40mph?

I'm confused now.
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G · The Voice of Reason Joined: 02 Feb 2002 Karma :

People use counter steering, they just don't realise it.
As I mentioned above, the body position of leaning slightly to one side does turn the bars slightly the opposite way. Thus why people get the false impression that they lean a bike by leaning their body that way.

It's also this that gives bikes a very 'natural' feeling I suspect; as they can give the impression of great 'connectedness' that you don't get between yourself and a car.

Note my comments about trukes; I'll bet you never thought you did it on a push bike, but ride a push trike and you'll find that you do.

Dom_ · Points Mean Prizes Joined: 02 Aug 2004 Karma :

Yeah as said above, people do it without realising, but once they have learnt how to do it deliberately it can be used a lot more effectivly from flicking from one corner to the next.

he he i love going round large roundabouts quickly, then exiting flicking the bike from leaning one way to the other, makes me feel like rossi Laughing

meyrick · Scooby Slapper Joined: 05 Dec 2004 Karma :

meyrick · Scooby Slapper Joined: 05 Dec 2004 Karma :

I decided to move this topic to this thread because it sort of died out there on its own. I don't know why I started a new thread for it Rolling Eyes

MarJay · But it's British! Joined: 15 Sep 2003 Karma :

Counter steering is just a nudge in the wrong direction. Wink

Its just cos bikes are stubborn! (Technically that is kind of true! )

Give it a go if you don't believe me! Smile

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loply · World Chat Champion Joined: 24 Mar 2004 Karma :

Ride along in a straight line and then give the right hand bar a little "jab" forward by about 3cm or so, you will feel the bike very quickly lean to the right (as if you were going around a right hand bend).

If you think about it obvious why it happens (front wheel goes left, bike falls over sideways).

Then try doing it in a roundabout for tightening your line or standing the bike up again as you leave the roundabout.

But careful not to get confused and do the wrong way.
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loply · World Chat Champion Joined: 24 Mar 2004 Karma :

One thing I have always wondered, does the front tire remain pointed in the "wrong" direction once you have achieved your desired line and are just riding along it, leant over?

Ive never had the guts to look at my yoke and figure it out whilst leant over enough for it to be visible.
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PsychoHippy · Jammy Git Joined: 02 Jul 2002 Karma :

fuzz · World Chat Champion Joined: 24 Mar 2004 Karma :

There are basically four ways to turn the bike. Countersteering, hanging off the bike, weighting the footpegs and leg pressure.

Countersteering has the greatest effect - try any of the others with your hands off the bar and you won't really go anywhere. But having said that, they all play a part in steering.

By hanging off the bike you are shifting the centre of gravity to the inside. This basically pushes the bike away from your body without upsetting the balance, meaning the bike remains more settled in the turn.

By placing your weight on the footpeg on the inside i.e. right if you're turning right, you can aid in turning. Try it while riding straight. If you put pressure on the right peg you will feel the bike start moving to the right.

By pressing your leg against the tank, you can help initiate the turn. By bracing your weight with your legs/abdomen, you take the weight off the bars and becoming more relaxed through your arms. This allows you to have better control over the steering as you can feel the input through the bars easier.
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The Tot · World Chat Champion Joined: 11 Jun 2004 Karma :

Countersteering around an adverse camber corner today, i felt the pegs deck out on my XR - i could have sworn my toe decked out on the tarmac Shocked

. I wouldn't suggest you crank you bike over to the point you feel you're going to deck out especially when the tyre's haven't warmed up fully and the roads are treacherously icy. Still great fun and a good way of getting rid of em chicken-strips. It comes instinctively, but utilise it to maximise corner speed (also - don't do it behind a car, as you will underestimate your angular velocity and might end up being confronted by a fiesta bumper)
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Adam_P · World Chat Champion Joined: 23 Jan 2004 Karma :

I can't believe that some instructors don't teach about counter steering.

My instructor taught me that it was the way a bike turned from the beginning. From my CBT on day one right through my two days of DAS (kept telling us over the radio as we practised) and even after I passed he was explaining little bits of it at his office afterwards.

I reckon I had a damn good instructor from what I've read about others throughout the forum.

The key to it is to try it, although, probably best not to just give the bars a huge shove at the first coner you come to!

Just ride around an industrial estate (a quiet one) to begin with and see what happens when you give the bars a gentle push at each end.
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pieman · L Plate Warrior Joined: 31 Jan 2005 Karma :

I agree they really should teach this even in the CBT.

When I did mine I had no clue how to turn and halfway through the road ride I started wandering wide on a bend all I got was the instructor shouting in my ear saying "lean the bike!!"

Thats great I thought but HOW!!

Had a go at counter steering last night and OMFG how much easier it makes it to be aware of what your doing and how to lean.

I managed to take corners around 40 % faster than I had done before and it's greatly improved my riding and safety.

Very Happy

loply · World Chat Champion Joined: 24 Mar 2004 Karma :

Yeah once or twice in my learner days (not that im much beyond a learner now) I found myself on a sweeping bend gradually running wide...

...And not knowing how to tighten up!

Infact on my CBT something very similar to this sent me to hospital with broken ribs, a broken hand and a bleeding shin Razz

but that was panic as much as a not knowing how to counter-steer.
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Zoffo · Brolly Dolly Joined: 01 Feb 2005 Karma :

The only time you should ever have to think about counter-steering is if the corner tightens on you. You go in a bit hot. Suddenly find your line isn't tight enough!
DONT hit the breaks. This is where you need some pretty forceful counter-steering to lay the bike further over and sharpen your line so that you tighten your turn with the corner. Gentle throttle to keep the bike upright and your through the corner.
First time I ever got my knee down happened like this, totally unintentionally but probably saved my life coz there was a bloody great truck coming the other way.