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YorkshireGrom
Two Stroke Sniffer



Joined: 03 Apr 2016
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PostPosted: 20:07 - 21 Sep 2016    Post subject: New to gears Reply with quote
Hello guys I've just done the impossible I purchased a brand new Honda msx 2017 model the only issue am haveing is randomly stalling it when am stopping there's been 2 occasions I've stalled dead centre of the road at a junction the nerves kick in and I panick can some expericed bikers give me some pointers please
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Howling Terror
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PostPosted: 20:13 - 21 Sep 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
It's as simple as ABC.

Accelerate
Brake
Clutch

or BCA, CAB, BBC, AAA, ABA may be used.
BBB is boring as it CCC.
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YorkshireGrom
Two Stroke Sniffer



Joined: 03 Apr 2016
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PostPosted: 20:14 - 21 Sep 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
So keep revs up and let clutch out slowly or doesn't it matter speed wise
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Howling Terror
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PostPosted: 20:19 - 21 Sep 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Stalling coming to a stop as per your first post or stalling when setting off?

Or is it both. Twisted Evil
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B0ndy
Spanner Monkey



Joined: 25 May 2015
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PostPosted: 20:23 - 21 Sep 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
If you're stalling when stopping you need to pull in the clutch earlier, and change down the gears so you're in a gear you can pull away with if necessary.

If you're stalling while moving you need to go down a gear before this happens, you should feel the bike struggling when the revs get too low and the engine is about conk out - that's the indication you need to change down or pull in the clutch.

At the end of the day practice is king, so take your bike out whenever you can and it will become second nature in no time.

BONUS TIP - use sentences and punctuation when posting. Thumbs Up
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Last edited by B0ndy on 20:25 - 21 Sep 2016; edited 1 time in total
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YorkshireGrom
Two Stroke Sniffer



Joined: 03 Apr 2016
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PostPosted: 20:25 - 21 Sep 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Stalling when setting off from a stop not all the time just when the roads are busy am fine going to work 10miles just when I leave work I struggle
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Howling Terror
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PostPosted: 20:28 - 21 Sep 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Cars stall....everyone stalls now n again so take the stress off yourself and fuck them.

Prior to ^^^ that please have a practice in a quiet spot. Do it now. Won't take long before muscle memory learns and takes over.
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YorkshireGrom
Two Stroke Sniffer



Joined: 03 Apr 2016
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PostPosted: 20:31 - 21 Sep 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Howling Terror wrote:
Cars stall....everyone stalls now n again so take the stress off yourself and fuck them.

Prior to ^^^ that please have a practice in a quiet spot. Do it now. Won't take long before muscle memory learns and takes over.



I went to the most quietest car park last weekend and praticed for 3 hours was perfect weather was nice and I didn't have my gloves of which are winter ones so am unsure if there to thick or might just be nerves kicking in on the road
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dydey90
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Joined: 01 Oct 2013
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PostPosted: 20:32 - 21 Sep 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Rough with the throttle, gentle with the clutch. Try going somewhere quiet and practice finding the bite point on the clutch, doing a few slow set offs and stops.

Just keep on with it and don't think about it too much, everything will become habit in time.
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Howling Terror
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PostPosted: 20:36 - 21 Sep 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Moar practice then...wearing those bastard stalling gloves.
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YorkshireGrom
Two Stroke Sniffer



Joined: 03 Apr 2016
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PostPosted: 20:38 - 21 Sep 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Howling Terror wrote:
Moar practice then...wearing those bastard stalling gloves.


Dam those bastard stalling gloves haha
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Howling Terror
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PostPosted: 20:40 - 21 Sep 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
I once had a bastard stalling pillion....got used to it if only to stop them laughing at me.
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YorkshireGrom
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Joined: 03 Apr 2016
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PostPosted: 20:42 - 21 Sep 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Howling Terror wrote:
I once had a bastard stalling pillion....got used to it if only to stop them laughing at me.


My mate does when his on his bike and I stall it all I hear is him
Laughing lol
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Howling Terror
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PostPosted: 20:50 - 21 Sep 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
They laugh louder when it's a kickstart. I learnt fast.
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Holdawayt
Trackday Trickster



Joined: 27 Jul 2015
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PostPosted: 08:41 - 22 Sep 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
I'm going to suggest something a little bit different, just because I get the impression you're not very confident on the bike.

Why not speak to your local bike school and ask for a lesson on a geared bike? That way you're going to be in the perfect environment if something does go tits up. They'll teach you far more than just using the gears too.

I don't know if this is what you did... but I never understand when people pass their CBT then go out on the road without any more lessons. A blind monkey could pass a CBT, it teaches you nothing.
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Rogerborg
nimbA



Joined: 26 Oct 2010
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PostPosted: 10:22 - 22 Sep 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
I can only echo and re-enforce the above. You are going to stall. Everybody does it, and it's a small engine.

The way to deal with it is to be bold with the throttle and control your take off with the clutch. Even on my Ninja 250, if I want to win the traffic light GP I have to rev the nuts off it and slip the clutch.

Really, give it a try on a quiet road. Clutch right in, knock it into first, hold the clutch in and red line it. Notice that you are not dead.

Then practice just riding around using 3 - 4000 revs (or more), and controlling your speed using the clutch alone. When I did my CBT we spend ages doing this. I though it was a waste of time, but have since realised that it was great preparation.
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Derivative
World Chat Champion



Joined: 03 Aug 2010
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PostPosted: 10:32 - 22 Sep 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
I never really had issues with stalling on the bike, but I have in the car (having moved to petrol from diesel).

This is probably going to seem really bloody obvious, but oh well. There are basically two ways to 'fix' stalling problems.

You can learn the frankly insane 'sixth sense' of knowing exactly where the minimum is, whether you can let the clutch out more, develop the reaction to hearing the engine slow down a bit, etc (basically, the stuff that comes with time, that you can do nothing about anyway)...

Or you can just give it more revs. The only reason not to do this is basically to avoid clutch wear. Unless you're absolutely taking the piss and starting on the red line I wouldn't worry about it too much.
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Aceslock
Spanner Monkey



Joined: 12 Dec 2014
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PostPosted: 13:45 - 22 Sep 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
A good tip i heard when learning, which helped me on DAS for hillstarts as the bike is a lot heavier, but it still applies. Keep your foot on the back brake, rev the engine up to a couple of thou & release the clutch gently until you feel the bike go down in the back. Repeat this for as long as it takes so you get the biting point, then you wont stall as often...... Thumbs Up
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Teflon-Mike
tl;dr



Joined: 01 Jun 2010
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PostPosted: 14:47 - 22 Sep 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
YorkshireGrom wrote:
Stalling when setting off from a stop not all the time just when the roads are busy am fine going to work 10miles just when I leave work I struggle


THAT is a worry... one has to presume you are a Learner on CBT... nothing more than the first lesson to validate your 'learner licence'... and you are trying to daily commute on the thing like you were a fully qualified rider!

If my 17 year old daughter had just had her first driving lesson in a car.... she would NOT be allowed to drive, unsupervised on her own until she had passed her driving test, after probably at least a dozen driving lessons. And even THEN, I for one would not be letting her borrow my car to brave the brummie rush-hour to get to college every day, rather than take the bus, until she had gained a decent amount of road experience and could handle the quieter traffic off-peak.

WHY do you think that trying to brave the daily commute, after no more than a first lesson, on a powered two wheeler, you are umpety times more likely to come to grief on, even as a qualified rider, let alone a learner, is in any way shape or form a 'good idea'? CBT & L's is a Learner-Licence to go learn on, NOT go to work on!!!

Stalling at junctions. Very common problem, and back to basics lesson one of CBT finding the biting point. If you haven't sussed it, you need to go back and do so! Back to school, or a queit car-park.

Next; more often caused by 'panic' as anything, and once stalled panic takes over and amplifies the problem, likely to make matters worse, not better.

You say that it happens more in busier traffic... suggesting that a) you are concerned about holding up traffic behind; b) worried about getting into a gap in oncoming traffic...

You are then, letting other drivers adversely influence your decisions.... you are doing what you think they want you to, NOT what you necessarily think is 'prudent'....

Fuck-em or get off the road.

YOU are the one with the controls in your grasp, and its YOUR ass on the line if you fuckit up kimosabbi!

IF you feel that intimidated you HAVE to jump into a gap you dont really think you have time to make.... even MORE fucking reason to quit the commute and NOT put yourself under that sort of pressure.

Back to school, or back to the car-park... NOT back to work you are NOT ready for it!!!

And good chance you WONT be ready for it, until you have got enough practice and enough lessons and learning to be able to pass the bludy tests and do it on a full licence, not fucking L-Plates. So, if you don't think you could pass tests, dont commute. Or if you think you are up to commuting, prove it... go take tests.

Like I say, they are NOT a 125 only licence; CBT does not a qualified competant rider make you; it is nothing more than the first lesson, so that you may PRACTICE... not dodge the tests and the busfares trying to get to and from work in busy traffic, on a bike where you are the one most likely to get hurt.

I wouldn't let my daughter do that in a car after having the lessons and passing her car test; I CERTAINLY dont recomend it to any-one on a bludy bike after no more than scant prep offered by CBT. You have a learner Licence, use it to LEARN.. not try getting to work.

If needs go get some more learning from lessons; and save the commute until you have the competance and competance to handle it.... which probably means you are test ready or have passed the tests. THAT is why we have'em! And L-Plates and CBT are so you can work towards them, NOT dodge them.

OK... now, that's nub of the problem; and the solution to it.

But brand new bike, straight out the crate; PDI'd and handed to you with half a tank of petrol to go do what you will with.

Not helping the problem, but far from causing it; you are almost certainly loath to 'thrash' your new pride and joy any; BUT these little bikes need a certain amount of 'comitment' to make them move; the engines are small, they don't have any great capability and almost no 'reserve' to make them comfortable or flexible; you HAVE to thrash'em a bit to get'em to do what they should.

Sat on top, with no box around the engine or you, and no other added insulation like water-cooling jacket, noise baffling radiator or sound deadening fire-wall; you hear that engine 'direct' and all its apparent pains.. and compared to other engine's even little lawn mower ones, that rarely rev much over 3,ooo rpm, anything much over tick-over sounds like you are reving the nuts off it. BUT 'peak' power, which isn't a lot, wont be made by that engine until something like 9,ooo rpm; you HAVE to get them revs up, and it aint gonna sound great... but.... they are designed to do it, and they shouldn't explode in the trying.....

Dealer 'guidelines' on running in, probably suggested you should be trying to keep the revs to about half and throttle opening to about half, until its run in, maybe 1000 miles, or the first service...

This wont help... but back to top; if so and if you are concerned with that 'running in' DON'T try doing it on the fucking daily commute!!!

But either way, you do need to be fairly 'confident' on the controls, and not holding it back on the throttle or the revs to make it move.

Next; bike should also be adjusted properly for you... you adjust the seat and mirrors when you get into a car; few do so much when they clamber onto a motorbike.

The handlebars, can be adjusted in their clamps and moved forwards and backwards to the comfiest position; the levers on the end of the bars can be slackened off, and similarly rotated about the bars to where they most comfortably fall to hand; AND clutch lever particularly, can be adjusted on the cable to put the biting point where it's most comfy for you to find it... usually about 1/3 travel from the rest position, not as soon as you touch the lever, not all the way back to the grip.

An afternoon spent with the bikes underseat tool kit twiddling and trying and setting the controls to the most comfy positions can REALLY make a big difference to how easy it is to operate and how well you can then ride it.

Again, suggests a Sunday afternoon, tweeking levers on the drive and pottering about the block, NOT battling with half awake or half knackered commuters on the way to or from the daily grind.

And more time away from them pootling round the houses or dawdling down country lanes 'gently' getting the first service miles on the thing, to get it 'run in' not making it work hard hammering everything in commuter conditions, of stop start, reactive riding.

It will get the bike run in, it will get YOU 'run in', and you might stand better chance in that commuter snarl.

All it takes is patience; rushing be quick way to hurt on two wheels, and expectation that one day in a playground wobbling round some cones is enough to prepare you for it, is frankly hugely optimistic.

If you want to learn to ride; go learn to ride. If you want to get to work, find another way, until you have learned to ride!
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YorkshireGrom
Two Stroke Sniffer



Joined: 03 Apr 2016
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PostPosted: 18:06 - 22 Sep 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
So from all the tips I was given last night I haven't stalled it once at all today even when I was coming home from work not even once I thought I'd jump in the deep end and travel on the busiest roads at that time to boost my confidence and it seems to have paid off touch wood lol
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Rogerborg
nimbA



Joined: 26 Oct 2010
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PostPosted: 18:17 - 22 Sep 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Cheer up, worse things happen at sea.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike
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YorkshireGrom
Two Stroke Sniffer



Joined: 03 Apr 2016
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PostPosted: 18:42 - 22 Sep 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
So from all the tips I was given last night I haven't stalled it once at all today even when I was coming home from work not even once I thought I'd jump in the deep end and travel on the busiest roads at that time to boost my confidence and it seems to have paid off touch wood lol
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Holdawayt
Trackday Trickster



Joined: 27 Jul 2015
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PostPosted: 09:55 - 23 Sep 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Even though you're doing better, I urge you to book a lesson. You'll be far, far safer then.

Tom.
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Hong Kong Phooey
World Chat Champion



Joined: 30 Apr 2016
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PostPosted: 10:44 - 26 Sep 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
I swapped gloves this morning, was using summer type before which have better feel. Consequentially I'm faster off the line with thicker gloves, as I'm not able to feather the clutch with as much feel. Not a problem until it rains.

I commuted for ages on a CBT and as far as I know I'm not yet dead. However I'd had many years of car driving experience behind me. That was my justification for not having L plates on the 125, not that I ever got stopped.
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