|
Author |
Message |
Pjay |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Pjay World Chat Champion
Joined: 18 Jan 2016 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
Teflon-Mike |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Teflon-Mike tl;dr
Joined: 01 Jun 2010 Karma :
|
Posted: 00:25 - 09 Dec 2016 Post subject: |
|
|
Pjay wrote: | I know what you were trying to say |
No, no you don't.
Pneumatic tyres, even advanced compound profile ones, are still pneumatic; filled with air; supported by AIR PRESSURE, defined as force per unit area.
So no matter what the profile, the the area of rubber pressed against the tarmac, MUST maintain the ratio of force per unit area of Tyre air pressure needed to support the weight.
You CANNOT get more rubber pressed against the road, UNLESS you take air pressure out of the tyre or increase the weight on it.
A varying radius profile tyre, no matter how smart the geometry CANNOT defy that fundemental bit of basic physics to increase the cotact patch area as a bike leans.
AND, the contact patch area STILL does not come into the fundamental equation of 'grip', the latteral force a tyre can transmit, before slipping, which is the co-efficent of friction between tyre and surface, times the clamping force pressing the tyre vertically against that surface.
So even if the complex profile tyre DID manage to defy Newton, and Pascal, and probably a few other eminent physicists immutable 'laws', that extra contact area wouldn't automatically mean more grip!
The notion that more rubber = more grip, is at best an inordinate over simplification, tending to utter fallacy; which IF it has any seed of truth, and that in some circumstances wider tyres, or ones with apparently greater contact areas may have more 'effective' grip, must be explained by something OTHER than the contact patch area, more rubber = more grip. It simply isn't true or that simple. ____________________ My Webby'Tef's-tQ, loads of stuff about my bikes, my Land-Rovers, and the stuff I do with them!
Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?' |
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
Pjay |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Pjay World Chat Champion
Joined: 18 Jan 2016 Karma :
|
Posted: 00:34 - 09 Dec 2016 Post subject: |
|
|
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
ThatDippyTwat |
This post is not being displayed .
|
ThatDippyTwat World Chat Champion
Joined: 07 Aug 2016 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
andyscooter |
This post is not being displayed .
|
andyscooter World Chat Champion
Joined: 30 May 2009 Karma :
|
Posted: 08:33 - 09 Dec 2016 Post subject: |
|
|
not sure if this has been added but couldn't see it
if your bike makes horrible noises and has sparks followed by pain and a sudden stop you lent over too far
hth ____________________ gilera runner vxr200 (chavped)
if its spelt wrong its my fat fingers and daft auto correct on my tablet |
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
Ribenapigeon |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Ribenapigeon Super Spammer
Joined: 20 Feb 2012 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
onlyJaz |
This post is not being displayed .
|
onlyJaz Scooby Slapper
Joined: 24 Sep 2016 Karma :
|
Posted: 13:11 - 12 Dec 2016 Post subject: |
|
|
Thanks for all the advice guys
Another question, and I figure it's on the similar topic of "rear-wheel" worries so I didn't see a point starting a new topic...
On the dual carriageway, I sh*t myself every time I change a lane in the rain because of the white painted lines between each lane. I know these are slippery especially when wet, so when I need to change a lane I try to do it as confidently as I can whilst being reasonably cautious but inside I have the fear of slipping and being at the mercy of the headlights of the car behind me! (Dramatic much)
Now obviously I will be buying new tyres seeing as the advice above has told me how crap YBR originals are but will my bike be feeling more stable in the dual carriageway situation after that or is this a normal part of riding and I should just get used to it?
Or am I overthinking it, that it's unlikely to slip easing into another lane at 50mph? ____________________ Yamaha YBR 125 |
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
Pjay |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Pjay World Chat Champion
Joined: 18 Jan 2016 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
Hawkeye1250FA |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Hawkeye1250FA World Chat Champion
Joined: 14 Oct 2016 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
Teflon-Mike |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Teflon-Mike tl;dr
Joined: 01 Jun 2010 Karma :
|
Posted: 14:15 - 12 Dec 2016 Post subject: |
|
|
In the UK, road markings are made of 'gritted' bitumen; I believe they use ground glass in the 'paint' strategically to give them 'grip'; thy are NO-WHERE near as 'slippery' as so many suggest or make out.
Was suggestion that in some continental countries, they used plastic based 'gloss' paint like you'd use on your wainscoting decorating the living room, that may be a little lethal... but in this country, road markings are often more grippy than some of the more polished bits of tarmac they use!
More dangrouse bits are actually the 'black' bits of 'over banding' they stick along tarmac patches or over the gaps between sections, which are 'un gritted bitumin'...
ANYWAY... the nadgery bt is that the lane markings are so often so over painted, that they get built up into a ridge, that can sometimes be half an inch taller in the middle then the surface!
It's that discontinuity n the surface that's more often to blame for a 'wibble' when you go over them, the tyres tryng to shift to the angle of the 'hump', than any actual loss of traction from the being 'slippery'.
Relax; loose grip on the bars, TRUST THE BIKE, it will find its own way over, you don't need to wrestle it! You are more likely to do more harm than good trying to force it to go where you think it should than letting it sort itself out.
Just don't be 'daft' and try crossing them whilst accelerating or braking... but even then TBH, on a little YBR you probably don't need to be too concerned....
I've had big bikes get a bit 'skittery' and 'maybe' break traction when nailing it to make an over take, crossing the white line; but that's not really because the lines 'slippery', but because the 'bump' has lifted the wheel and unloaded it whilst applying excessive torque the tyre.. but even then.... little 'skit' as the bike sorts itself out, and back on track soon as its over the hump and sorting itself out.
You are VERY unlikely to encounter that sort of situation on a YBR
Like everything else; just relax, keep calm, be 'smooth', and trust the bike.
White lines AREN'T the evil zero friction snakes of death they are so often made out to be. ____________________ My Webby'Tef's-tQ, loads of stuff about my bikes, my Land-Rovers, and the stuff I do with them!
Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?' |
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
Pjay |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Pjay World Chat Champion
Joined: 18 Jan 2016 Karma :
|
Posted: 14:25 - 12 Dec 2016 Post subject: |
|
|
Tef mate, you do talk some shit.
The white lines are never more grippy than the tarmac ffs.
Infact, go out and pull your front brake on one in the wet.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EDsMIXhgGPw |
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
Yorkshire Geek |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Yorkshire Geek Scooby Slapper
Joined: 02 Jun 2015 Karma :
|
Posted: 20:50 - 12 Dec 2016 Post subject: |
|
|
Actually Tef is not really wrong. They do use glass beads to increase skid resistance in road marking paint where high SRV values are needed and they're nowhere near as slippy as people think. That's not to say NO white lines (especially outside the UK where BSEN 1436 doesn't apply) can be slippy, but well specced ones are definitely a lot grippier than you'd expect.
Disclaimer: I'm not a polymer chemist who designs paint but my fiancee is. |
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
ThatDippyTwat |
This post is not being displayed .
|
ThatDippyTwat World Chat Champion
Joined: 07 Aug 2016 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
Pjay |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Pjay World Chat Champion
Joined: 18 Jan 2016 Karma :
|
Posted: 21:35 - 12 Dec 2016 Post subject: |
|
|
Yorkshire Geek wrote: |
Actually Tef is not really wrong. They do use glass beads to increase skid resistance in road marking paint where high SRV values are needed and they're nowhere near as slippy as people think. That's not to say NO white lines (especially outside the UK where BSEN 1436 doesn't apply) can be slippy, but well specced ones are definitely a lot grippier than you'd expect.
Disclaimer: I'm not a polymer chemist who designs paint but my fiancee is. |
Of course they are supposed to put glass in them to make them a bit more grippy, but they are not more grippy than tarmac.
Aside from that, I've slipped a few times on them when coming to a stop at lights, so know first hand that in North London at least, they dont add enough of it, the video I posted also shows how slippery they are. |
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
M.C |
This post is not being displayed .
|
M.C Super Spammer
Joined: 29 Sep 2015 Karma :
|
Posted: 01:27 - 13 Dec 2016 Post subject: |
|
|
onlyJaz wrote: | Thanks for all the advice guys
Another question, and I figure it's on the similar topic of "rear-wheel" worries so I didn't see a point starting a new topic...
On the dual carriageway, I sh*t myself every time I change a lane in the rain because of the white painted lines between each lane. I know these are slippery especially when wet, so when I need to change a lane I try to do it as confidently as I can whilst being reasonably cautious but inside I have the fear of slipping and being at the mercy of the headlights of the car behind me! (Dramatic much)
Now obviously I will be buying new tyres seeing as the advice above has told me how crap YBR originals are but will my bike be feeling more stable in the dual carriageway situation after that or is this a normal part of riding and I should just get used to it?
Or am I overthinking it, that it's unlikely to slip easing into another lane at 50mph? |
No problem going over them (no one post the video of alpha coming off on a tar snake ). However watch out for bus lane lines, they always seem to be painted on really thick and can be slippy. Same with direction arrows on roundabouts etc. |
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
mas101 |
This post is not being displayed .
|
mas101 Borekit Bruiser
Joined: 26 Sep 2016 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
Pjay |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Pjay World Chat Champion
Joined: 18 Jan 2016 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
mas101 |
This post is not being displayed .
|
mas101 Borekit Bruiser
Joined: 26 Sep 2016 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
Pjay |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Pjay World Chat Champion
Joined: 18 Jan 2016 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
Old Thread Alert!
The last post was made 7 years, 129 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful? |
|
|
|