total noob with questions

[mrtisme]

Ok so at the tender age of 49 and ten months I have had a rush of blood to the head and decided what my life is lacking is a bike.
I have done my CBT and I am booked in to do my theory test, now this all sounds pretty regular unexciting and been put on here at least a thousand times before, but the company with whom I am doing the DAS course with have given me the DVD set of the theory test and hazard perception test for car drivers. I assume the test for motorcyclists is different, at least the theory side anyway. Could someone clear this up for me don't want to question the instructor and look a knob until I have more info. Thanks

[Evil Hans]

Yep, it is (slightly) different for motorcyclists.

https://www.tsoshop.co.uk/Driver-And-Vehicle-Standards-Agency/Motorcycle-Riders/
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Triumph Sprint ST 1050. And it's Red.

[Evil Hans]

PS - you're not alone, I was 49 when I finally got around to it.
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Triumph Sprint ST 1050. And it's Red.

[mrtisme]

Should I be a bit concerned they gave me the dvds for car drivers, thought a bike school (if thats the right term) would be just bike orientated, nervous enough dont want to be studying the wrong stuff!

[Evil Hans]

I would expect to be given the correct DVD pack. Call them out on it, and don't let them fob you off.
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Triumph Sprint ST 1050. And it's Red.

[mrtisme]

Thanks I will get in touch with them about it, just seems a bit unprofessional to be giving out car drivers test materials when it is exclusively a bike school.

[Kentol750]

When Mrs did test (4yrs ago) the pack included car and bike tests. Dvd had both on it.
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Some bikes.

[Teflon-Mike]

Over half the UK population has a valid driving licence.
Less than 1 in 20 UK Driving licences, have full motorcycle entitlement on them.
There are actually more cars in the UK taxed and available for use on public roads than there are people qualified to drive them!
There are approximate three motorcycle licence holders for every taxed motorcycle available for use on UK roads.... and given that almost half taxed UK motorcycles are 125's, and most of those are ridden on L-Plates, by non licence holders... that means that in the 'big-bike' world, only something like 1 in 7 licence holders have a 'big-bike' to use....
Meanwhile, 60 million folk in the UK, almost 40 million cars, covering around half a UK billion miles a year... ON.. barely ONE million miles or public highway..... and that's just the 'cars' The trucks do more miles on our few roads, and take up more room on'em
BIKES... account for 'less than' 1% of UK road transport, and again, the L-Platers' 125's, oft used as every day commuter's, where the big-bikes are more often sunny day leisure implements, account for more than their fair share of them. Average annual motorcycle mileages, in the last 25 years have fallen from around 10K miles a year, almost on a par with average car miles to around 3000 miles a year, with an awful lot, in the big-bike arena showing less than 1000 miles between MOT's...

THIS is all very interesting stuff, perhaps, but the 'point' is that cars are the mass market. Bikes, are a tiny tiny specialist interest; so when it comes to making a book or DVD for new bike riders.... market for it is going to necessarily be pretty small, especially compared to the market for car drivers..... and IF there is an existing 'product' for car drivers, adapting that for bikes, if viable, is far more likely to be a profitable endevour.

As far as the Theory test goes.... that certainly applies. The Motorcycle Theory test, is actually the car theory test, with an inordinately small number of bike specific questions added to the pick-list. It's actually possible to take a motorcycle theory test and not get a single bike specific question, while obviously car biased questions not parsed out of the pick-list can vex bikers....

Meanwhile... expanding the scope of the theory test from the traditional highway code questions, it used to be based on.. it now incorporated a load of Politically Correct 'environmental' questions, and a whole ruck of 'attitude' conundrums, and a first year doctor's medical exam!

My O/H had to jump through all these hoops five years back, trying to get her licence 'in' under the 'last' pre euro-bollox system on a 125; She's a bit of a game-nerd, and I used to get about forty Face-Book notifications a day, telling me she had bred a goat or grown a sun-flower, or needed some-one to help her fertilize a field in her latest FB game.... so, having to kick her bum quite frequently to get her Theory Test scores up for her motorbike tests.... resulted in a heated argument when I accused her of playing a new Face-Book Doctor game, when all I heard for an afternoon coming from her lap-top, were questions about how many compression per minute to give a heart attack victim, or how to handle some-one with a broken leg!.. No it wasn't as I had presumed "Face Book Accident Ward", it WAS her Theory practice disk!

Anyway... point is, that there are many Theory/Haz-pep test practice discs knocking about; the 'DSA approved' version, is I believe the only one that does (or did) contain the actual questions of the theory and use the same haz-pep vid clips, due to copy-right issues. They may have offered licences to let others use these now, but is a caution, many practice DVD's don't use the actual clips or questions you get on the test, to avoid the copy-right.

I believe the official crown publication, Practice Disc, has had a few revisions of packaging and titling, in which the prominence of titling to show it included motorcycle specific theory questions, if there hasn't been that prominent; whilst 3rd party offerings may or may not include the motorcycle dedicated content, and may not afford it ant prominence in titling.... IF given the tiny number of motorcycle specific questions it matters all that much.

Bigger issue by far on the matter is old dogs and new tricks, and particularly the Hazard-Perception 'game', rather than the multiple choice theory questions.

The entire computer simulation s pretty much designed around a 17 year old play-station generation new driver, who has gone through the Blair infected PC indoctrinated school system in the naughtiest... and has absolutely NO concept of real 'hazard' used to wandering out into the road after school with a smart phone lighting their chin, expecting to see a red screen and be returned to the school gates to 'try again', if they get ht by a truck, like they would in Grand Theft Auto, rather than the real world!

When the computerized theory test was introduced, what, around the millennium? I recall, doing some of the pre-release tests; most existing drivers off the street struggled to pass them, but I ad most of the instructors who also had a mess with it usually passed most times....

When the Hazard Pep was introduced.... NO bugga could pass it! Certainly not first time! Ironically, those most likely to at the school WERE the students, and the fresh faced teenagers amongst them! They really knew no better.

Existing drivers, and old lag riders?! It's just an anathema. What the vidio game considers a hazard, existing driver/rider, just wont! It's something that is so mundane, its spotted and dealt with long before and we never consciously register any 'alarm' over... My first time, on the practice DVD ad I think I went through something like 8 or of fifteen clips, complainig they had ended before showing me an actual hazard... then, when I 'got it' and dumbed down to 11+ standards, and applied DSA definition of anything that makes you alter speed or direction.. and not much... I spotted the hazards they wanted, but failed the test for clicking too early or too often, seeing them so far ahead of the click-window i the game!!!!

It IS a bludy nightmare and a complete lottery!

As far as the Theory goes.... it IS a lot more involved than the old Highway-code questions and common sense, of old, you could blag your way through pretty much all but the stopping distance questions. Now, there are so many more you know them or you don't questions, like 'tucan' crossings, or obscure tram signals! AND all those PC environmental questions, the rise-able 'attitude' ones, and the damn medical exam! You DO need to thoroughly bone up for that it, AND on more than just signs and stopping distances!

Haz-Pep, is the one likely to be your down-fall, and that IS pretty much a lottry, and a video game, it REALLY isn't a 'virtual reality'... and the trick is to learn the game, like GTA or Sega-Super-Rally, and NOT let existing real road knowledge influence how you try play it, and practice practice practice. Learn the clips if you can, get a feel for when those click-windows come up, and just how mundane DSA deem a 'hazard' in it.

As such, actual practice disc, whether official DSA one or 3rd party; whether dedicated bike Theory or the regular car, matters not very much...

BUT, good news is, get that test cert in your pocket, and the tricky bits over and done, and you have clear shot for the DAS.
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My Webby'Tef's-tQ, loads of stuff about my bikes, my Land-Rovers, and the stuff I do with them!
Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?'

[Rogerborg]

Er... OK.

There are a handful of bike specific questions in the bike theory test. You can fail them all and still pass, which makes a complete mockery of it being a separate test. But yes, you should be cramming for the bike test rather than the generic one.

The hazard perception is identical for both, and a bit of a joke. You'll find yourself clicking too early to score - it's aimed at barely avoiding a crash. Just get in the habit of doing: click-elephant-click-elephant-click.

Don't fret about it, it's an easy enough test to pass.
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Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[M.C]

[kgm]

I also came close to failing the hazard part the last time I did one. Trouble is when you're an experienced driver you see a potential hazard and click. This isn't what they want. They want you to click for developing hazards only, not all potential ones. It's silly, the more observant you are the higher the chance of failure.

[mrtisme]

Thanks for the replies people.
I have been finding the hazard perception a real pain. Scan ahead for hazards as you do when driving/riding click 0 points.
Click as hazard is right on top of you with no time to react in a real world situation 5 points. Need to unlearn established driving habits and play civil servant pleasing video games. I have tried screaming, swearing and throwing things to improve my scores sadly to no avail, will try doing some practice with my mobile in my hand to see if this will distract me enough to not spot the hazards too early.

[Evil Hans]

You're allowed a few mis-clicks. Best way is to see the Hazard, click, count to two, click again. Makes sure you at least get some points
____________________
Triumph Sprint ST 1050. And it's Red.

[Rogerborg]

[MahatmaAndhi]

I sat through one and a half videos waiting for a cursor to appear. Rather than just clicking.
I still passed it though.
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2008 Aprilia Sportcity 250

[mrtisme]

right so thats the theory/hazerd perception test passed, despite assurances from my instructors, the test was more bike than car focused. I shall be advising them to throw away the study materials they provided me with.
I think if I had not been a car driver already and studied some bike focused test questions I would have failed.

[Rogerborg]

Hmm, that wasn't my experience long about 2010 or so. How much of it was bike specific?

Also, 'gratz, ding, level up.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[MahatmaAndhi]

I remember some stuff about pillions and towing which were specific to a motorbike. I guess it's luck of the draw. You could get a really general one, or a very bike centric version depending on the pool of random questions.
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2008 Aprilia Sportcity 250

[TheInternet]

Did my bike theory not long ago. Got about half way through before I noticed the bikey slant to the questions; there were perhaps up to 20% which were bike specific. Didn't bother with any revision, the test is laughable.

[Rogerborg]

Good, I guess. That's long overdue.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[mrtisme]

[quote="Rogerborg"]Hmm, that wasn't my experience long about 2010 or so. How much of it was bike specific?

I would say 1/4 of the questions I had were bike specfic, pillion riders, towing with a motorcycle, braking on loose surfaces are some of the general bits I remember. I do feel a bit let down by the bike school on this front, though it has to be said the instructors I have had have been great.