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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 15:44 - 19 Mar 2017    Post subject: Urban bike build Reply with quote

I've decided to make my younger brother a bike for his birthday. He's been beating round on £30, second hand bicycle shaped objects (usually second hand Halfords mountain bikes) until they finally fall apart.

He's never had a proper road bike, despite only ever riding on roads so I think he'll get a pleasant surprise.

Design spec. from him is: "Dunno. Wheels shouldn't buckle when you go up kerbs and it needs mudguards. Brakes would be handy.".

So, fairly low expectations. I also know he's got naff-all mechanical sympathy so I've decided on the following:

Steel frame.

Hub gears.

Straight bars.

700c wheels, 36 spoke, double wall rims with reasonably meaty tyres.

Conventional double-acting calliper brakes.

It's going to be a mix of new and second hand parts because while I like him, I don't like him to the tune of a complete new-build bike. I've got some parts lying about, others off ebay etc.

To start with I need a frame. I really like the stuff on-one/planet x make and my folks said they want to get something towards this present too so I said they could buy the frame.

As it turns out, on-one have recently bouight the Holdsworth name and have started making frames in keeping with the heritage of the brand. So, £99 later and I have in my posession a stunning orange and blue Holdsworth La Quelda frame in steel. If he wasn't getting it, I'd have been tempted to keep it for myself. I'm keeping the wrapping on untuil I need access to a bit.

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0359.jpg

It's designed as a single speed frame so fork track ends and a nominal 120mm dropout spacing. This can make some things tricky, others easy.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0360.jpg

As it happens, the spacing is 123mm. This is handy.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0361.jpg
____________________
“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.
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stinkwheel
Bovine Proctologist



Joined: 12 Jul 2004
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PostPosted: 15:52 - 19 Mar 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gears are gong to be the next big thing I need to sort. That gives me the chainline and suchlike.

I've looked all over the shop at hub gears. Shimano do both nexxus and alfine hubs in up to 11 speed. However, both are 130mm+ Over Locknut Diameter(OLD). The OLD and the dropout spacing really want to be about the same. To use a shimano hub, I'd need to bend (cold set) the new frame using a big plank of wood.

As it happens, I came across a new, second hand sturmey archer 8-speed hub on ebay for £90. This one has a disc brake mount which I wont be using but I don't have to use a disc.

This is also too wide. OLD is in the region of 130mm.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0363.jpg

However. My research also revealed it has spacer nuts fitted so the disc is the correct distance from the chainstay. Since I'm not using the disc, I can remove the spacer nut.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0365.jpg

And bingo. Hub fits. OLD is 123.8mm so I'm having the spring the fork-track ends out by less than 1mm. This is acceptable.

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0372.jpg
____________________
“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.
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stinkwheel
Bovine Proctologist



Joined: 12 Jul 2004
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PostPosted: 16:37 - 19 Mar 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Now I've got that. I can work out some gearing. I've used Sheldon Browns gear calculator.

I know the gain ratio on my single speed is 5.1. I can spin that out on the flat so I've opted to make that 5th gear of 8. The hub already has a 23 tooth cog so a 32t front sprocket should do the trick.

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/gainratios.png

I'm using a sugino crank I've had lying about for a while. The bolt circle diameter for the inner ring is 74mm bolt circle diameter so I can safely go smaller than 32t if he finds the gearing too steep. I've also found a bash-ring to fit on the outer ring so he doesn't get his trousers caught in the chain. I could cut the lugs off the crank spider but it would feel like vandalism.

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0377.jpg

So I can order a bottom bracket, I also need to work out the chainline. Something I can do now I have the hub in. I already know the hub cog offset is 40.4mm from the centreline of the bike because it gives me that figure on the Sturmey Archer data sheet.

So I need to fit a bottom bracket. Any old one wil do. I keep a couple lying around for this exact purpose. It'll also clean out the threads for fitting the new one.

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0373.jpg

Now fit the crank with a sprocket on. It's not the right sprocket, I've ordered a nice stronglight one but I just need to get the chainline. So chainring to frame tube is 24.9mm.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0374.jpg

Frame tube diameter is 29.0mm.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0375.jpg

So half the tube diameter and add the chainring to tube distance to give me the chainring offset of 39.4. I need the bottom bracket to be 2mm longer than the one I currently have in. The one that's in would probably do but the actual bearings in it are grumbling. The one I've just tried is a 107mm. So I need a 109mm. The next common size is 110mm which will put me within 0.5mm of the correct chainline. Winner.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0376.jpg
____________________
“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.


Last edited by stinkwheel on 16:54 - 19 Mar 2017; edited 1 time in total
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bamt
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PostPosted: 16:41 - 19 Mar 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nice. I love building up bikes like this, it's always far more satisfying than buying one ready made, and you know every part is correct for your purpose rather than the compromise a manufacturer would make.
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 16:51 - 19 Mar 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

A few of the other bits I've accumulated so far.

Planet-x had some serious discounts. So I've got an FSA headset, a selcof seatpost and a colour co-ordinated selle italia saddle. These were all under a tenner each.

Went to the local bike recycling place and snaffled a Bianchi stem and a set of ridgeback alloy bars for £7.

Also picked up a trigger shifter for the hub gear because I remember him not liking gripshifters. This also allows me to finish it with my trademark bar tape all the way up.

Headset next.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0378.jpg

I've got lots more bits on their way. Particularly pleased with the front hub, found a NOS early 90's 105 hub which will look a treat.
____________________
“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.
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chris-red
Have you considered a TDM?



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PostPosted: 13:37 - 23 Mar 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

How different is that hub to the old fashioned SA 3 speed? Do you still have to stop pedalling to change gear?

That frame is Great Value Thumbs Up
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UnknownStuntm...
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PostPosted: 14:35 - 23 Mar 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Awesome, approval pending final orangeness.
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stinkwheel
Bovine Proctologist



Joined: 12 Jul 2004
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PostPosted: 15:52 - 23 Mar 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

chris-red wrote:
How different is that hub to the old fashioned SA 3 speed? Do you still have to stop pedalling to change gear?

That frame is Great Value Thumbs Up


I don't think it likes being loaded up while you do the shift. But neither does a deralieur.

It has a rotary selector rather than a chain which will hopefully be less prone to going off-kilter.

Progress.

FSA headset. I like these because they are very well sealed.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0379.jpg

Hnadlebars and stem. Cool bell. Needs the steerer cutting down but I'll want to look at the geometry before going ahead with that.

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0381.jpg

Bog standard shimano BB.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0382.jpg

Crankset stuff. Bash ring to stop it nomming his trousers.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0383.jpg

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0384.jpg

Standard wellgo pedals with half-length toeclips.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0386.jpg

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0387.jpg
____________________
“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.
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stinkwheel
Bovine Proctologist



Joined: 12 Jul 2004
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PostPosted: 11:09 - 27 Mar 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Still waiting for spokes. I can't really build much more until I have the wheels in. Then I can see roughly where to position the levers and handlebars so I can cable it up. It's easy to do cabling wrong and you can land up with a real dogs breakfast.

I generally spring for a set of brand new shimano levers on a bike build. They come in a kit with everything you need to fit them, including the cabling and fittings. It was tempting to get some orange or blue cable outers but since I have the black stuff in the kit, I may as well use it. The Tiagra levers were reduced in chain reaction cycles to the same price as the deore.

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0414.jpg

Tektro double acting long reach callipers are relatively inexpensive, strong and effective. However, in common with any calliper I've used to-date, the pads they come with are utter bilge. Straight in the bin with them and in witha set of clarks triple compound ones, effective in all conditions and have replaceable pad material (one of which is supplied with each set).

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0416.jpg

Just a loose fit onto the bike for now. I'll set the final position once it's sat on its wheels.

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0418.jpg

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0419.jpg

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0420.jpg

Next job will be wheelbuilding.
____________________
“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.
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stinkwheel
Bovine Proctologist



Joined: 12 Jul 2004
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PostPosted: 00:24 - 28 Mar 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Man. Just built two wheels. Not even CLOSE on the spoke length. So much for spoke length calculators and published hub and rim dimensions.
____________________
“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.
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bamt
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PostPosted: 05:37 - 28 Mar 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

I always measure my own because of that, then use the calculator based on my own measurements. A bit of a pain as it means waiting for the rim and hub to arrive before ordering the spokes.

I enjoy building wheels though, quite a relaxing way to spend some time in front of the telly, playing it like a harp whilst getting it evenly tensioned and dead true.
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recman
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PostPosted: 06:20 - 28 Mar 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just done a bit of genealogy and it turns out that stink is also my older brother.
I feel a birthday coming on.
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stinkwheel
Bovine Proctologist



Joined: 12 Jul 2004
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PostPosted: 18:39 - 30 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok, spoke length debacle sorted out. Measure the bits yourselves people, it might look like it'll save time by ordering the spokes at the same time as the wheel componants but then you're relying on someone elses measurements.

Been epic busy at work due to staff problems so haven't made much progress for a bit. Having a relatively quiet weekend on call so time to make progress.

Had to chop a bit off the end of the rear axle because I've thrown away a spacer and the nuts are blind ones. The axle is EPIC hard. Used two bimetal hacksaw blades cooled/lubed with antifreeze.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0421.jpg

Hub, spokes, nipples.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0422.jpg

Sputnik rims are the poor mans open-pros. Fully eyeletted double wall.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0424.jpg

Trailing spokes:
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0430.jpg

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0431.jpg

Leading spokes.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0432.jpg

Then it's all over but the tensioning and trueing.

Old-school 105 front hub.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0433.jpg

I've fitted chunky tyres, Michelin cities because he's not getting mountain marathons.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0527.jpg

Slight concern they're too chunky but this is with the wheel fully into the fork-end. Can always drop down to 28 from 35 if needs be though.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0528.jpg

So lets see where the wheel ends up before messign with the brakes and gear cabling. Single speed chain, much toughness.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0529.jpg

Lovely, starting to look like a bicycle. The cable ties on the seat stays are for trueing the rims.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0530.jpg

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0532.jpg

Final wheel position is ok, enough clearance for the tyre. Mudguards are going to be tricky but there are ones that are designed for such a situation.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0534.jpg

Home straight. Needs the gears cabling up and setting up for the rider, mudguards fitting, a road test and a fettle up. I'll do the bar tape once we decide where the controls are going to go. I've cut a bit off the steerer so it fits with the bell and a full set of spacers, I can always take more off later.

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f216/stinkwheel/Holdsworth/DSCN0535.jpg
____________________
“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.
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