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Ste
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PostPosted: 22:28 - 25 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lord Percy wrote:
I think the only thing that would unite the entire of humanity is an alien invasion.

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Liberals would welcome them with open arms then compete to be the most rememberingist when the aliens start destroying mankind. Thumbs Up
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Falco
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PostPosted: 22:47 - 25 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:

Being reported five times on anti-snackbar hotlines, including by an imam, then making repeated trips to Libya and Syria: that would be a good clue.

This is a genuine answer. It's not hypothetical. We had chance after chance after chance to stop Abedi. We just chose to keep watching and waiting and seeing.

We can make different choices. Inaction is not inevitable.


Interesting idea. Would the reports have to be corroborated? Maybe just the one by the Imam? Weighting towards trusted Imams?

The Libya and Syria trips are a no brainer...I have no idea why they aren't tagged the moment they return (if we have to let them return).

The problem with Abedi is that despite being reported, they 9as you say) decided to wait and see...only they don't have the man power to watch people continuously. Apparently, their time is better spent on Jihadi poets. The misallocation of resources is astounding,
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Suntan Sid
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PostPosted: 22:50 - 25 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lord Percy wrote:
I think the only thing that would unite the entire of humanity is an alien invasion.


The major religions all believe that man is created in god's image.
Proof of, intelligent, alien life would create utter turmoil amongst religionists, no doubt resulting in even more holy wars, engineered by religionist leaders to deflect attention from the bullshit they've been peddling for thousands of years! Rolling Eyes
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jjdugen
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PostPosted: 22:51 - 25 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd love to think that this is all down to Machiavellian governments with an agendas of control..... but its not. Governments are largely reactive, not proactive. Something happens, they reach for whatever solution appeals to the majority, of voters. It would appear that the majority want to light candles and sing shit Oasis songs.
Its not even big business. They are driven by their stock market valuation, they are too busy maximising profits and mounting take-overs to have any harmonious world plan.
It does seem to me that the algorithms driving the markets are the real cause of societies ills, we have little control over the wealth shifting around the world at light speed.
Whats this got to do with snackbar? Not sure. But nothing happens in isolation.
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Itchy
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PostPosted: 22:53 - 25 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Suntan Sid wrote:


The major religions all believe that man is created in god's image.
Proof of, intelligent, alien life would create utter turmoil amongst religionists, no doubt resulting in even more holy wars, engineered by religionist leaders to deflect attention from the bullshit they've been peddling for thousands of years! Rolling Eyes


Look at how easily humans are conditioned today.

I think a spare fairing civilisation could be easily have tinkered with humans. So that when they come humans will see them as their deities.
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Falco
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PostPosted: 23:04 - 25 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Itchy wrote:
a spare fairing civilisation .


...Whut? Razz
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Ste
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PostPosted: 23:05 - 25 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

jjdugen wrote:
It would appear that the majority want to light candles and sing shit Oasis songs.

Don't ignore all those people those who've changed their bookface profile picture to show solidarity with something they don't usually give a fuck about.

jjdugen wrote:
Whats this got to do with snackbar?

They seem to be the ones doing the exploding in an attempt to get rid of everyone who isn't part of their death cult.

Remove the snackbars and suddenly there'd be no more exploding snackbars, or snackbar stabbings, or snackbars waving guns around or snackbars crashing lorries into people, etc etc etc.

https://i.imgur.com/3AH4c8m.png

If only there was one common factor in all of those events. Sad
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Sload
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PostPosted: 23:25 - 25 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

ScaredyCat wrote:
There's no real defence against suicide bombers.


Apologies Cat, I didn't see that. You are correct of course in the context of some smart person who stays off the radar. What I have seen thus far is this person was known? It is hard to unpack and keep everything spinning in a conversation whilst staying honest.

On a sidenote, anyone watching QT? Pretty charged.

Itchy wrote:
Look at how easily humans are conditioned today.

I think a space fairing civilisation could easily have tinkered with humans. So that when they come humans will see them as their deities.


Are you on the sauce a bit tonight, not like you to mess up your spelling like that Mr. Green Going off on an extreme tangent as you suggest, the more I try to learn, the less I am surprised.
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M.C
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PostPosted: 00:19 - 26 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:

Being reported five times on anti-snackbar hotlines, including by an imam, then making repeated trips to Libya and Syria: that would be a good clue.

This is a genuine answer. It's not hypothetical. We had chance after chance after chance to stop Abedi. We just chose to keep watching and waiting and seeing.

We can make different choices. Inaction is not inevitable.

Hmm I'd heard his local mosque didn't report him even though they were in jihadi central and found him to be batshit mental.
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Itchy
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PostPosted: 00:28 - 26 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sload wrote:
Are you on the sauce a bit tonight, not like you to mess up your spelling like that Mr. Green Going off on an extreme tangent as you suggest, the more I try to learn, the less I am surprised.



Nah it's actually a plot point in an old Sci Fi called Babylon 5. Here is the clip.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HVSlKqOXf2k

The Vorlons (an ancient race) have been tinkering with the younger races genetic code for millennia. To hide this they move around inside environment suits so nobody sees their true forms.

So when they reveal themselves the races they have tinkered with. These races see angels in their dominant home world religions.
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Sload
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PostPosted: 08:35 - 26 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is pretty grim really.

https://cdn.bcf.44bytes.net/files/18664316_10213018984339674_6079140137560529793_n.jpg
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 08:40 - 26 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Falco wrote:
Rogerborg wrote:
Being reported five times on anti-snackbar hotlines, including by an imam, then making repeated trips to Libya and Syria: that would be a good clue.

Interesting idea. Would the reports have to be corroborated? Maybe just the one by the Imam? Weighting towards trusted Imams?

The Libya and Syria trips are a no brainer...I have no idea why they aren't tagged the moment they return (if we have to let them return).

[Tefsplanation follows]

It's not trivial to tie together disparate pieces of information into a whole pictures. The first issue is: who are they talking about?

Reports from different people in different places at different times with just a name to go by aren't obviously attributable to the same individual - particularly one from a culture where the names people go by can change more often than the weather.

However, it is possible. Some very clever people work on resolving information into things. They certainly resolved it quickly enough after he went kersplode, to the point where it's been leaked to the media.

The problem, I believe, is that once you give intelligence agencies tools that create pretty network diagrams, they like looking at them more than disrupting them.

It's all gather and analyse and find connections and build bigger and bigger networks, and sort entities into core and edge actors. Digital thumb-tacks and string, OCD heaven.

When it comes to actually kicking in doors, not so keen. It's hot or wet or cold out there, and some of those beastly rotters don't just give up and surrender, the cads.

That's just not good enough when even the most peripheral actor can take centre stage at any moment. Decapitation strategies work against hierarchical organisations, but Salafi jihadism is a writhing mass of tentacles.

[/Tefsplanation]


Falco wrote:
The misallocation of resources is astounding,

100% agree. We need fewer size 11 hats in our security services and more size 11 boots.

If you stay in monitoring mode until you intercept a communication that clearly says "Bombbad the crusaders on Monday" then you're going to miss the Abedis who get their training and orders by word of mouth.

Beyond reasonable doubt is the standard for conviction in a court. It's a piss poor metric for action when Salafi jihadists are deliberately targeting children.
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stevo as b4
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PostPosted: 12:07 - 26 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

What does your big rambling post of many different issues all at the same time actually mean in simple English?

I lost you after you stated that the IS scum want to take over the UK, Europe maybe the world? And that we'd all be Muslim if they did.
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ScaredyCat
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PostPosted: 12:16 - 26 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ste wrote:
Lord Percy wrote:
I think the only thing that would unite the entire of humanity is an alien invasion.

Hand

Liberals would welcome them with open arms then compete to be the most rememberingist when the aliens start destroying mankind. Thumbs Up



If your answer is to immediately attack creatures who've managed to master intergalactic travel before trying to talk to them, it's probably best you wouldn't be that involved. Laughing
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Itchy
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PostPosted: 12:27 - 26 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Valerian95 wrote:
war isn't the answer- are these people deaf and blind?


It's because you don't read history oh and you're willing to become exactly like the monsters you vilify. While you can play mental gymnastics all day with definitions like genocide you're advocating mass murder. Mass murder from ANY side is bad m'kay. In terms of reading I suggest the Vietnam war and the Punic wars.

Run with this. There is outrage at a bombing. There are calls for a large response. How different is this from some guy in a sandy country somewhere?

So the actions are taken. Yet the actions actually make it worse.

So you kill one legitimate bad guy. But in doing so you hurt or kill others. Each person who was killed combatant or not had family members and friends. So killing one caused 10-30 more to join up.

This is precisely why Vietnam was lost. So your kill them all mentality will likely make it even worse.




Valerian95 wrote:
stop shooting down valid attempts to propose a solution with these bollocks examples please.


Secondly who says you're going to win? It is impossible to win against a determined enemy force even with a gigantic technological gap. This was proven at Imjin river in 1951 Korea.


Nuclear weapons? Sure go ahead. Except studies conducted that aside from the fireball, shockwave and black rain there are significant (non political although these are serious) or using nuclear weapons

https://www.popsci.com/article/science/computer-models-show-what-exactly-would-happen-earth-after-nuclear-war
https://www.livescience.com/44380-small-nuclear-war-could-trigger-catastrophic-cooling.html



Nutshell the dust sucked up would cool the planet reduce rainfall and cause global famine.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 13:56 - 26 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

ScaredyCat wrote:
If your answer is to immediately attack creatures who've managed to master intergalactic travel before trying to talk to them, it's probably best you wouldn't be that involved. Laughing

Well, if you battle me I feel reviled
People always sayin' my style is wild.

Any group turning up en masse at your doorstep is there to take your resources by force, whether it's wearing a pith helmet, a niqab, or an intergalactic space helmet.
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grr666
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PostPosted: 14:31 - 26 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Valerian95 wrote:
Lots of heartfelt stuff

So in short, muslims are wrong uns and ideally we should shove them off the cliffs of Dover to their deserved deaths?
I prefer the idea of using them as fuel. To run the coal fired powerstations, since we have more of them than we do coal.
And it would see a return for all the taxpayers money they have soaked up since they've been here essentially making
most of them public property anyway. Time to Prakash in our investment, In my model they are kind of like a self
charging battery as they seem to self multiply like a cousinfucking bastard. Meaning unlimited supply Thumbs Up
Free heat for pensioners!! Massive reduction in public spending, I really don't see a downside.
(Unless you're.. You know... A muslim... but hey ho. They've somehow completely worn out their own welcome in a country run by hand wringing idiots who seemingly can't do enough for them. So powerful is their general multi faceted upleasantness. Quite impressively achieved in under 30 years too, nice work moohammeed...)
Alternatively a free one way flight from the RAF parachuting* them directly into to Saudi Arabia. Their choice. I'm not a Monster.

*Free Parachute Thumbs Up
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Itchy
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PostPosted: 14:52 - 26 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Valerian95 wrote:
would murder a Westerner given the opportunity of no backlash.


Hyperbole much?

That's like pretty much like saying he's a terrorist if he isn't he was going to become one anyway.

What sort of twisted logic is that?

Lets use this backwards then.


Oh one person did something bad. We therefore must apply this to the entire group fine...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Huckle

That's not fair? I just did exactly what you just did. If you stand by what you just said then you must equally support my all X are Y.

Else your position is untenable.

While you may try the individualism route. If you give individualism to one group then you must give it to another.


Valerian95 wrote:
Hypocrisy


So wait you interfered in their lands for the last 200 years murdered millions of them... and this is totally OK.

Yet when they do a fraction of this back to you not even 0.000001% the death rate then you cry about it?

So essentially you're saying you can dish it out or you have permission to murder and bomb others yet you cry when somebody does it back to you?


Valerian95 wrote:
Yeah yeah whatever... I choose that world over the alternative world under sharia law which is quite a serious possibility in my lifetime.


Hyperbole much?

Valerian95 wrote:


As for the history remark most of the history I learnt was from reading books and the internet at home.


Obviously not enough. The last massive movement of religious groups was the partition of India in 1947. 15 or so million died.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 15:16 - 26 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Itchy wrote:
Oh one person did something bad. We therefore must apply this to the entire group fine...

If that group is Salafi jihadists, then, OK, sure. The tl;dr for that particular ideology is "bad things".

I'm going to keep pushing the distinction betweek Salafi jihadists and the other 5 million flavours of islam, as generalising doesn't help them to help us.

Mind, I don't think that Bambi Burnham giving it "Abedi weren't no muslim, bruv," is particularly helpful either. Regardless of his background (see also Andy Choudary) he absolutely was being a devout muslim and following the teachings of the quran at the point where he checked out, and lying about it fools nobody.
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Itchy
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PostPosted: 15:20 - 26 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
I'm going to keep pushing the distinction betweek Salafi jihadists and the other 5 million flavours of islam, as generalising doesn't help them to help us.


Problem is a lot of people don't and will happily associate all of group X even tangentially related.


I mean look at when nonces get mentioned in the news doctors that specialise in the treatment of children quake in their boots.
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Monkeywrenche...
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PostPosted: 17:00 - 26 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Itchy wrote:

Oh one person did something bad. We therefore must apply this to the entire group fine...


It wasn't one person though was/is it, there have been multiple attacks and more are ready to either do or support ,literally or ideologically, the same kind of attack. While we tolerate the support and protect the ideology behind a wall of screaming snowflakes denouncing "Islamophobia" the attacks will not abate.

Also nothing about your example is relevant, he is an outlier from his culture not an example of it. you just picked it because it's white on Asian crime, Racist
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The last post was made 6 years, 329 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful?
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