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ScaredyCat
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PostPosted: 11:27 - 19 Jun 2017    Post subject: Oil Change Reply with quote

Yes another n00b question, but at least I'm doing my chain without fuss so it's progress.

I'm just about to do my first oil change. In the past I've just had it done as part of a service at dealer / local mech. Going to try myself, just a couple of questions.

I've had a look at the manual which tells me 3 imperial quarts if I'm changing the filter too (which I am) but how often would you change the oil and not change the filter?

Do I need to prime the filter before attaching it? If so, how much should I put in. The manual doesn't say anything about priming - in fact it doesn't say a lot at all.

How tight do you tighten the filter? I have a claw like thing to remove it but it looks like you'd only want to remove the filter with it, not tighten it up. Is hand tight enough? I've seen filters with a nut on the end to tighten the filter with which suggests more force is required.
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.....
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PostPosted: 11:38 - 19 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Always do filter with the oil, for the sake of a few quid it's worth it.

I fill the filter with oil before screwing it on making sure the rubber o ring is smeared with oil.

Do the filter hand tight, only hand tight. The nut on K&N filters is for removing not installing. Once the filter is on, wipe it clean then retighten.
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zark
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PostPosted: 11:46 - 19 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't always change filter, coz I'm lazy. I'll do it every 6 months or so, but change oil more than that because it's cheap and bike seems to like it...

I don't fill the filter up either coz by the time I've wiggled it into position it'll have fallen out. The good book just says put more oil in to compensate when new filter. Usually run it up and check levels before using it properly to make sure there's enough.

Hand tight is plenty. If you use a tool to tighten it, you'll regret it later
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bamt
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PostPosted: 11:50 - 19 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pretty much what Joe says, except whilst you should put oil on the filter's rubber seal, I never try to fill it. On most designs with a horizontal filter it'll just pour out anyway making a mess.

I also only use that quantity in the manual as a guide, filling to fill level/dipstick instead, give it a run for a minute to fill the filter, let it settle due a while then check again. It should use roughly what the manual says, but I'd rather know it is right on the sight glass than that I'd carefully measured an amount that is theoretically right but may not be in practice
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sickpup
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PostPosted: 13:26 - 19 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

bamt wrote:
I never try to fill it. On most designs with a horizontal filter it'll just pour out anyway making a mess.


Have you actually tried this?
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chris-red
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PostPosted: 13:46 - 19 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

The amount the books says should be treated as a guide. Always ensure using the dipstick the level is right.
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bamt
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PostPosted: 13:52 - 19 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

sickpup wrote:
bamt wrote:
I never try to fill it. On most designs with a horizontal filter it'll just pour out anyway making a mess.


Have you actually tried this?


I did say never, as it's pretty self evident! Just as I never fill a drink bottle then put it on its side expecting all the water to stay in - the stuff that's above the level of the holes when on its side will run out - like it does with the old oil when you remove the old filter. You could put some in, but not brim it. There's no point anyway as the engine will do that for you much more cleanly. Or am I missing something?
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sickpup
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PostPosted: 13:54 - 19 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

bamt wrote:
Or am I missing something?


Yep. Try it. Thumbs Up

Pour oil in, let it settle and go from there.
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Fizzer Thou
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PostPosted: 18:51 - 20 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

I always prime the oil filter,which I replace every other oil change.You will be surprised by how much the filter soaks up the oil

https://i666.photobucket.com/albums/vv23/WiNot_Rhencullen/Workshop/20160421_150233_zpsinju5kb3.jpg

On the paper filters on the the Exup and FJ I write the date and the mileage onto the metal part and log the details in the relevant workshop manual Thumbs Up Wink

On the spin-on filter for the R1 I prime the filter until it can take no more,then tip the slight excess that might drop onto the down pipes back into the oil container Thumbs Up

As has been suggested,I always fill the oil into the sump until the level is 2/3 of the way up the window or dipstick,then run the engine for a short while for it to circulate.After topping up to 3/4 of the correct level I leave it at that.I never fill to the upper level as there is no need,unless the engine burns excessively.
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rhys99
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PostPosted: 14:29 - 21 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

bamt wrote:


I did say never, as it's pretty self evident! Just as I never fill a drink bottle then put it on its side expecting all the water to stay in - the stuff that's above the level of the holes when on its side will run out - like it does with the old oil when you remove the old filter. You could put some in, but not brim it. There's no point anyway as the engine will do that for you much more cleanly. Or am I missing something?
As an apprentice i've been taught to always prime the filter. The filter absorbs a fair bit of oil and if you get just the right amount in you dont spill much if any.
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skatefreak
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PostPosted: 15:59 - 21 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Standard proceduder:
Run bike to warm oil.
Remove sum bolt to drain old oil,
Whip the old filter off,
wham the sump nut back in,
flop on another filter,
fill till acceptable fullness reached on sight glass/dippy stick,
run for a minute or two and let settle for another few minutes,
top up to appropriate fullness.

Done more cars/bikes than I care to remember,
never had any dramas Rolling Eyes
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bamt
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PostPosted: 06:42 - 22 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joe wrote:
I fill the filter with oil before screwing it on making sure the rubber o ring is smeared with oil.

bamt wrote:
Pretty much what Joe says, except whilst you should put oil on the filter's rubber seal, I never try to fill it.


rhys99 wrote:
bamt wrote:


I did say never, as it's pretty self evident! Just as I never fill a drink bottle then put it on its side expecting all the water to stay in - the stuff that's above the level of the holes when on its side will run out - like it does with the old oil when you remove the old filter. You could put some in, but not brim it. There's no point anyway as the engine will do that for you much more cleanly. Or am I missing something?
As an apprentice i've been taught to always prime the filter. The filter absorbs a fair bit of oil and if you get just the right amount in you dont spill much if any.


sickpup wrote:
bamt wrote:
Or am I missing something?


Yep. Try it. Thumbs Up

Pour oil in, let it settle and go from there.



Yep, so, as I said, you can put some in, but if you try to fill it you'll likely make a mess Rolling Eyes
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Matt B
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PostPosted: 09:48 - 22 Jun 2017    Post subject: Re: Oil Change Reply with quote

ScaredyCat wrote:
How tight do you tighten the filter?


Just to be pedantic - there is (or should be) a torque setting for the filter and it will be in the service/workshop manual. Somewhere between 20-30 Nm. Saying that, I just do them up hand tight.

Also, just to provide a counter point - I don't change the filter every time I drop the oil. I've got two service manuals here for different bikes that recommend a filter replacement every other oil change. I tend not to go on mileage but time. Oil twice a year and filter once.
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sickpup
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PostPosted: 17:56 - 22 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

bamt wrote:
Yep, so, as I said, you can put some in, but if you try to fill it you'll likely make a mess Rolling Eyes


You really need to try this before commenting.
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V2
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PostPosted: 18:14 - 22 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Or try it on a ZX6-R, If you don't fill the filter then it wont prime itself, you'll end up with more mess as you try various methods of bleeding Laughing
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bamt
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PostPosted: 20:40 - 22 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

sickpup wrote:
bamt wrote:
Yep, so, as I said, you can put some in, but if you try to fill it you'll likely make a mess Rolling Eyes


You really need to try this before commenting.


OK, I'll play. K&N 204 filter, not brimmed (about 1cm below the thread). Tipped onto it's side (note, didn't even take it down to fully horizontal), guess what? Oil runs out of the big hole in the middle and the smaller holes that end up at the bottom. How surprising is that? Rolling Eyes
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Pigeon
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PostPosted: 21:46 - 22 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

bamt wrote:

OK, I'll play. K&N 204 filter, not brimmed (about 1cm below the thread). Tipped onto it's side (note, didn't even take it down to fully horizontal), guess what? Oil runs out of the big hole in the middle and the smaller holes that end up at the bottom. How surprising is that? Rolling Eyes




And yet so many other people manage it. Strange.



Yes K&N204 on horizontal, Striple. + 138 on SV.
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Matt B
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PostPosted: 13:55 - 23 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

V2 wrote:
Or try it on a ZX6-R, If you don't fill the filter then it wont prime itself, you'll end up with more mess as you try various methods of bleeding Laughing


Actually happened to you or just something you read?

I'm calling it an urban myth. Never bothered to fill an oil filter in my life and never had a problem with a ZX6 oil change.
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