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Are helmet cams legal in the UK? (side mount)

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arry
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PostPosted: 22:39 - 31 Jan 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

SDFarsight wrote:

As long as the engine is off and you don't do anything stupid (pulling your Hayabusa down aisle 4 of Sainsbury's), walking with your bike is 100% legal.


Did you look at the case law quoted above?
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Commuter_Tim
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PostPosted: 00:38 - 01 Feb 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

SDFarsight wrote:
As long as the engine is off and you don't do anything stupid (pulling your Hayabusa down aisle 4 of Sainsbury's), walking with your bike is 100% legal.


Deviating from the topic slightly, but Sainsburies is a private building.
I'm fairly sure traffic law doesn't apply inside, although the store manager might take issue with it.
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The above post is most likely nonsensical.

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SDFarsight
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PostPosted: 01:26 - 01 Feb 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Commuter_Tim wrote:
SDFarsight wrote:
As long as the engine is off and you don't do anything stupid (pulling your Hayabusa down aisle 4 of Sainsbury's), walking with your bike is 100% legal.


Deviating from the topic slightly, but Sainsburies is a private building.
I'm fairly sure traffic law doesn't apply inside, although the store manager might take issue with it.


Yes, if the law did get involved it would be something like an ASBO or 'Breach of the peace' rather than licence points. More likely, the security guard will talk about his own bike, then politely but firmly tell you where the door is.

I agree this is deviating from the topic, infact it's looking like it's going to turn into yet another one of those 'how many Hayabusas can I fit in a supermarket' threads, almost as common as the 'nodding' threads. Wink
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Last edited by SDFarsight on 12:34 - 01 Feb 2018; edited 1 time in total
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 09:04 - 01 Feb 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

SDFarsight wrote:
walking with your bike is 100% legal.

Oh, phew, glad to hear it. Sorry, something's up with my internets though, I can't see the 100% clear case law that you cited.
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SDFarsight
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PostPosted: 12:30 - 01 Feb 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
SDFarsight wrote:
walking with your bike is 100% legal.

Oh, phew, glad to hear it. Sorry, something's up with my internets though, I can't see the 100% clear case law that you cited.


I actualy started a thread on this subject when I first joined BCF, and a certain Rogerborg Esquire replied:

Rogerborg wrote:
Oh, herro.

DRZ4Hunned wrote:
Technically illegal to push it on public footpath unless accessing property.

And what offence are you committing? Can you find one that doesn't feature the words "driving" or "riding"?

Get off it. Selby (Justin) v Director of Public Prosecutions: QBD 1994 held that "riding is being carried out if a person is being carried on a motor cycle as it moves on its wheels, whether propelled by the engine, by his feet or by gravity."

Pushing a bike on a pavement, footway or footpath is absolutely fine, whether it forms part of a road or otherwise.

I regularly push bikes along the pavement against the direction of a one-way road and then across the carriageway to bypass a no-entry sign, and have done so with Dibble passing with no worries at all. You do not have to wear a helmet when doing so, which forms another clear distinction between "propelling it on foot" and riding/driving.

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Aceslock
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PostPosted: 12:59 - 01 Feb 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pass the popcorn Dance!
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 13:58 - 01 Feb 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

SDFarsight wrote:
a certain Rogerborg Esquire replied

That FPOS clearly hadn't read Regina v MacDonagh though, which held that pushing (of a car) could count as driving.

Nor Ames v MacLeod 1969 which came to the same conclusion, that pushing could suffice. Likewise Burgoyne v Phillips 1983.

The most salient case though looks to be McKeon vs Ellis 1987 in which it was held, somewhat bizarrely, that "controlling the movement and direction of a motor cycle by pushing and steering with the ignition and lights on constituted 'driving', as long as the defendant was wearing motor cyclist's clothing and a crash helmet".

Thus where I do agree with that Esquire chap's jibba jabba is that you should take your lid off. To be safe, you might want to peel your leather chaps off and push it naked.
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Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
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Commuter_Tim
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PostPosted: 21:21 - 01 Feb 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
SDFarsight wrote:
a certain Rogerborg Esquire replied

That FPOS clearly hadn't read Regina v MacDonagh though, which held that pushing (of a car) could count as driving.

Nor Ames v MacLeod 1969 which came to the same conclusion, that pushing could suffice. Likewise Burgoyne v Phillips 1983.

The most salient case though looks to be McKeon vs Ellis 1987 in which it was held, somewhat bizarrely, that "controlling the movement and direction of a motor cycle by pushing and steering with the ignition and lights on constituted 'driving', as long as the defendant was wearing motor cyclist's clothing and a crash helmet".

Thus where I do agree with that Esquire chap's jibba jabba is that you should take your lid off. To be safe, you might want to peel your leather chaps off and push it naked.


...and now we await the outcome of Rogerborg v Rogerborg 2018. Whistle
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The above post is most likely nonsensical.

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SDFarsight
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PostPosted: 00:00 - 02 Feb 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
SDFarsight wrote:
a certain Rogerborg Esquire replied

That FPOS clearly hadn't read Regina v MacDonagh though, which held that pushing (of a car) could count as driving.

Nor Ames v MacLeod 1969 which came to the same conclusion, that pushing could suffice. Likewise Burgoyne v Phillips 1983.

The most salient case though looks to be McKeon vs Ellis 1987 in which it was held, somewhat bizarrely, that "controlling the movement and direction of a motor cycle by pushing and steering with the ignition and lights on constituted 'driving', as long as the defendant was wearing motor cyclist's clothing and a crash helmet".


Nor Ames v MacLeod, Burgoyne v Phillips and McKeon vs Ellis all happend in ye oldie days when you could probably still find Wehrmacht BMW R75s hanging around Autotrader, MG42 still attached. With the exception of the Highway Act 1835, all the examples given by Rogerborg 2017 happend at a later date. I'm no lawyer, but I'd expect that later examples have the stronger legal precident.

Quote:

Thus where I do agree with that Esquire chap's jibba jabba is that you should take your lid off. To be safe, you might want to peel your leather chaps off and push it naked.


I wouldn't want to go entirely naked, but I think I'll compromise and wear assless chaps instead. Thumbs Up
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V2
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Joined: 06 Feb 2006
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PostPosted: 08:05 - 09 Feb 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Do you nod while pushing a bike though?
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Old Thread Alert!

The last post was made 6 years, 49 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful?
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