Seating Tubeless tyres

[Riejufixing]

[Riejufixing]

[Riejufixing]

[G]

I don't believe it's dangerous, as you claim it is.
I think you have misunderstood the physics of air movement in this situation and there's not the danger you claim.

However, if there is evidence to prove your assertion, then I'd be interested to see it.

With tyres that have a reasonable seal, flow is less of an issue in my experience.

With a tyre that's had a heavy box sitting on it in a courier van, deforming it a bit; flow rate even for tanked air compressors does make a difference.

[TigerWax]

[Riejufixing]

[sickpup]

So just because it can't be proved it is dangerous you have decided it is safe.

Its very simple and easy to fit a tyre where the bead doesn't want to seat, you just use a bead seating ring on one side and in extreme cases both sides. This video shows how they work but I would never stand on the wheel while doing it, I would use a cage or at the very least a very long airline so I was no where near it.

Clicky for video.

[G]

[sickpup]

[MCN]

This is tyre-ing.

One must tread carefully lest someone's ego gets deflated.
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Disclaimer: The comments above may be predicted text and not necessarily the opinion of MCN.

[G]

I don't plan on measuring every tyre and wheel combination. Though if really bothered, once the equations were understood, it'd be pretty easy to produce a model that considered the reasonable bounds of the ranges available.

However; I think it's a moot point for all combinations due to how I believe the fluid mechanics work in this situation.

Being pedantic, I didn't explicitly recommend it as a solution. I stated that a bead blaster device was available. However, I appreciate people may take that as a recommendation.

I did however suggest a small explosion had worked for me in the past. A solution that I did not claim nor prove was safe and would hope was self-evident is not entirely safe, yet still offered it as a solution I myself had successfully used to solve the problem at hand.
It turns out I don't need to prove something is safe before "recommending it" and can indeed mention things that are not safe.

This 12 litre version explicitly states it can be used on motorcycles:
https://www.tyre-equipment.co.uk/acatalog/Gaither-Bead-BAZOOKA-9-litre--BB09L-GTC_BB09L.html
(The reason I got a 40 litre one is I also wished to use it as a portable air tank to top up bikes away from a compressor.)

This bigger one doesn't mention motorcycles, but does say it will work with 'small lawn mowers'.
https://www.hawktools.co.uk/10-gallon-bead-blaster.html


I'm not bothered by the safety of your solution; but you have not offered proof of this and the only link you've provided shows the device being used on a different sort of vehicle's wheel in a manner you state you would not use it. Having not seen them before, I did try and find more information about their use on motorcycles, but couldn't find any.

[Riejufixing]

[TigerWax]

Not looking to stoke the fire any further but before I took it to an actual bike shop I went round some of the car tyre places near my work and the only one who didn't tell me to do one did actually say I needed a shooter but he didn't have one: I believe he was referring to a bead blaster. From my perspective (someone with no experience in changing tyres) that guy is a professional (I'm guessing a lot of you would probably label him as something else) since he gets paid to change tyres so rightly (or wrongly) I would have looked to follow his advice prior to this thread: obviously now I think fuck it life is to short for this shit so I'm just going to pay someone else in future for the easy life.

Moving on to what I actually want to know more about:

[Riejufixing]

Never seen them. I just use an ordinary small 25l compressor like those than can be had off eBay for less than £50. First, I thought the "bead blaster" (an USAian term?) was for cleaning metal, etc., & thort "Whut?".

[bikenut]

Yep there are all sorts of tricks to make the tyre bead rise the safety bead of the wheel, but over pressure is not really one of them as tyres have been known to "explode" or jump over the beads KILLING the fitter in the proccess, which is why a safety cage is used.

If you have fitted a tyre and then hear a sort of "tearing" sort of noise, RETREAT immediately as the cords in the tyre are breaking !!!

Most people would go closer to the tyre to try and see/find the noise, which is of course completely the wrong thing to do.

To seat a soaped bead the bouncing method may work for you, along with a compressor of sorts to try and force the beads to seat even slightly, so more air goes in than escapes, using a rachet strap or similar, and even seating one side of the tyres bead to the wheel by human force, hands gripping the tyre and a well placed foot on the wheel.

If this works then all you have to deal with is the unseated/sealed side. Setting up the wheel so a slight push to seat the unseated side, along with a good supply of compressed air. Valve core removal helps with good air flow.

Once the tyre has seated on both beads then "normal pressure " and the soaped beads should be enough for the tyres bead to slide over the safety bead and seal properly and completely, but sometimes this does not happen, with an area of bead not rising/riding/slipping over the safety bead.

This is a dangerous condition, walking into casualty with a wheel hanging off your hand with you screaming the house down must be quite a sight, one i have never seen mind.

My alloy kawasaki wheels can sometimes be problematic with the tyres bead not completely rising over the safety bead of the wheel. I tend to inflate to the max pressure stated on the tyre and leave the wheel well out of the way in the sunshine, or have even placed the wheel/tyre relatively close to a heat source, and it eventually "pops" into place all by its self.

Then check that the tyre has seated evenly on the wheel using the tyres guide "lip" edge.

Tyres stored in a stack can be problematic.
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nuts about bikes

[bikenut]

The op originally titled his thread "tyre seating"

Fitting the new tyre ( never mind taking the old one off ! ) should not be a struggle, in fact if you are fighting it you are doing it wrong.

I use short levers for the bigger bikes, both on and off, with small bits of the cherry, but for smaller bikes I can get the smaller more supple tyres on with hands only, mainly thumbs.

Its all about technique and porrage for breakfast.

If you hear a tearing/ripping noise whilst fitting a tyre, you have just fucked it!!!
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nuts about bikes

[TigerWax]

So just to complete the story I now have an inflated rear tyre. I asked what the issue was and he said that the tyre side walls had been compressed from being stacked badly. He asked if I was offered a chance to inspect the tyre prior to purchase: i brought the tyre from oponeo so I guess that I could have inspected during delivery and refused to accept it at that point? I assume after that point to get it exchanged I would be liable for postage so going to chalk this up as a risk of ordering online and this time I have been unlucky.

I asked what they did to get it to seat but he didn't really answer the question: I've noticed that the tyre valve I put in has been replaced with one that has a securing nut so I'm guessing I have an inner tube in there now.

I do wonder if maybe something to deal with this issue in future is to inflate an appropiate inner tube in the tyre and leave in the sun prior to installation to give it a chance to push the side walls out?

Anyway I will be installing the rear tyre so I can take off the front and take both the old and new front tyres to the shop so I can finally get my bike back on the road.

Thanks for everyone's help.

[MCN]

[Riejufixing]

[doggone]

Keeping tyres in the house maybe against a radiator would help though.
Or warm gently with a hair dryer or hot air blower

[MCN]