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Bike upgrades/modifications re Insurance.

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St George
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Joined: 19 Feb 2019
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PostPosted: 17:35 - 15 Apr 2019    Post subject: Bike upgrades/modifications re Insurance. Reply with quote

Would an insurance company be bothered about upgraded brakes fitted to an older bike, as in bigger drums for better braking.
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 18:50 - 15 Apr 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nope, not usually, so long as they are declared. IF you didn't declare them you'd have to play ignorant about them being non-standard, if you ever got questioned. Id would be difficult to argue if for instance they were stamped up Suzuki and fitted to a Honda.
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MCN
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PostPosted: 21:48 - 15 Apr 2019    Post subject: Re: Bike upgrades/modifications re Insurance. Reply with quote

St George wrote:
Would an insurance company be bothered about upgraded brakes fitted to an older bike, as in bigger drums for better braking.


All you can do, to cover your arse, is get it in writing from your insurer.

Some companies have different underwriting rules, policy and interpretation.

If I was in any doubt I would check it out.

Ignorance is no defence.

In the event of a accident engineer's reports are/may be considered.

I have a policy with Bemoto.

Definition of Modification(s)
Modifications are any changes made to your motorcycle since it left the production line. These include any changes
made by a motorcycle dealership, you or any previous owner.
You need to tell us of any modifications to your motorcycle, irrespective of the insurance cover you buy. You must
tell us during the period of cover if your motorcycle is modified after your policy has started.
We do not need to know about:
• like-for-like replacement parts, whether Original Equipment Manufacturer (OEM), genuine or pattern parts; or
• consumable parts (such as fuel filters, tyres, oil, oil filters, bulbs etc.);
unless they increase the performance of your motorcycle, enhance its value or increase its theft appeal.
IT’S IMPORTANT TO DISCLOSE MODIFICATIONS
If you do not tell us about a modification, you risk having your policy cancelled or the insurer may not pay you for any claims.
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Disclaimer: The comments above may be predicted text and not necessarily the opinion of MCN.
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ThunderGuts
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Joined: 13 Nov 2018
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PostPosted: 08:07 - 16 Apr 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd also point out that as far as insurance companies are concerned, anything that alters your risk profile will need to be taken into account. I would hazard a guess that a "modified bike" (any modification at all) is more likely to be crashed than an unmodified one as you include any folk who do stupid stuff to them, therefore you immediately become more of a risk. Some insurance companies will refine their definitions into performance and non-performance stuff and sometimes even more granular than that.

The other thing, if you start tampering with stuff like brakes (not to say that you or your mechanic don't know what you're doing), there's an obvious need to ensure these safety critical systems are working correctly and the insurance company may even want a fresh MOT post-modifications to demonstrate this.

At the end of the day, insurance companies very carefully write their T&Cs of cover; if you can even begin to question whether to declare something, you can bet in the event of a claim that the insurance company will use it to their full advantage.
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Teflon-Mike
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Joined: 01 Jun 2010
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PostPosted: 08:38 - 16 Apr 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

YES!!!!
Insurers are squiffy about RISK.
They assume any mods you make will likely increase the risk they carry, hence they dont like them.
Add a super-charger.... pretty obvious that is a performance enhancing mod, and you are going to ride faster and take more risks.
BRAKES.... hmmm... well, why would you want 'better' brakes? Most likely 'cos you ride too fast and take more risks.... hence they carry more risk on insuring you.... but worse still... brakes is a safety critical system.... these have to undergo some pretty rigerouse testing in design and prototype to be 'approved' ...... in multi-million dollar developmentr programs by the manufacturer, so that the have the answers in any liability suit they may get the blame for....
So YOU modify the brakes... they aren't developed or tested in probably any, way, let alone such rigerouse type testing as an OEM would.....
Whats's the risk, that these better brakes wont work? Whats the risk that the torque reaction arm you have to make or bend to brace the drum plate to the fork, will not be strong enough and break.. resulting in either no brakes or a locked wheel or any other carnage?
Its all 'risk' and worse uncertain risk.. cos its a sample size of one, and they dont know whether the mod is actually well effected, or sound, ALL they know, is that any mod is an added risk; fact you want the mod, probably means you are putting them at more risk, and the fact that the mod is home-brewed and unproven, even more so.
So... NO, they DONT particularly 'like' any mods to brakes!
They even get twitchy and expect you to declare fitment of after-market braided brake hose on discs!
Home engineered drum-conversion?
Yeah.... you better declare it!
You MIGHT be lucky and if its a classic on a low miles classic policy, they may deem it to be not too much added risk compared to the rest they are underwriting, on a vintage vehicle liable to fail for any number of reasons, and unlikely to be ridden by an utter loon, like a five year old 600 crotch rocket... and they may even by some-what sympathetic that on old bikes, a certain amount of component 'substitution' in order to keep the things running, is inevitable...
BUT... as a rule.... insurers DO NOT like to be told you have fcuked about with the brakes from the standard tested and approved by the OEM!
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weasley
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Joined: 16 Oct 2010
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PostPosted: 13:54 - 16 Apr 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think that most of this "insurers think THIS because you did THAT" is largely conjecture and assumption. In reality all you can really do is declare stuff and let the insurer decide the risk factors involved. I have always declared stuff - double-bubble screen, topbox, crash bungs etc and have never found any significant loading because of them.

TOPBOX
Assumption: means I will travel further and more often - high risk.
Reality: keeps my stuff drier and safer than a bungeed-on rucksack, which I used before the topbox and wouldn't have to declare - lower risk

CRASH BUNGS
Assumption: is a track-day, MotoGP wannabe so will ride everywhere knee-down and at maximum lean - high risk
Reality: insurance against diesel or gravel slips; likely to help save the fairing - lower risk

DOUBLE-BUBBLE SCREEN
Assumption: will be tucked behind the bubble for Vmax on every opportunity - high risk
Reality: reduces buffeting on longer rides, reducing fatigue and increasing comfort - lower risk.

Let's not play Fantasy Insurance Underwriter. I'm no fan of the insurance companies, having had mega-inflated renewal quotes two years running but I am a conservative little snowflake when it comes to declarations and would rather face the possibility of a small premium hike than the likelihood of cancelled insurance should it go that way.
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MCN
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PostPosted: 17:05 - 16 Apr 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

weasley wrote:
Fantasy Insurance Underwriter.


That sounds like it's screaming for an App.
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stinkwheel
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Joined: 12 Jul 2004
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PostPosted: 20:06 - 16 Apr 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

I recently insured my enfield special and it made no mention whatsoever of the extensive modifications I declared on any of the policy documentation.

I had to get a bit shirty with them to get something in writing (frankly, a smart-arse copper could well take it upon himself to seize the bike, it's clearly heavily modified and makes no mention of it on my insurance cert). I also didn't trust them not to deny all knowledge in the case of a claim.

Now got the following list off them on headed paper:

Engine Tuned
Non Standard Paint Work
Custom Seat
Custom Tank
Uprated Brakes
Exhaust System Changes - Cosmetic And Performance
Electronic Ignition
Custom Handle Bars
Custom Lights/Indicators
Custom Mirrors
Mudguards / Huggers
Tail Tidy
Air Filter
Braided Brake Hoses
Carburettor Changed
Custom Forks
Frame Modified

Although the frame hasn't actually been modified, nor does it have a tail tidy but I suppose it means I can if I want to. I guess he just ticked all the boxes.
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