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most durable allrounder

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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 18:24 - 21 Apr 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

But the OP asked about an all-rounder Confused
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kgm
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PostPosted: 18:40 - 21 Apr 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

chickenstrip wrote:
But the OP asked about an all-rounder Confused


Exactly, and he made no mention of off roading or track days. Given what requirements he did state most of the suggests so far would be ideal.
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almostthere
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PostPosted: 18:41 - 21 Apr 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

zx9r nothing else comes close Thumbs Up
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MarJay
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PostPosted: 09:01 - 23 Apr 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

almostthere wrote:
zx9r nothing else comes close Thumbs Up


Apart from a Z1000SX you mean? It's basically a ZX9R with more CC's and a slightly more upright riding position.
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Stinka
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PostPosted: 19:54 - 30 Apr 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

My tracer 900 was absolutely perfect at everything

I bet the new gt version is unreal
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UncleFester
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PostPosted: 20:16 - 30 Apr 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

As an owner of Z1000SX and having done nothing but use it as an allrounder for the last 7k miles .... they are a great bike.

Sure you can pick up an early one but you miss out on the fancy electronics package including IMU ( go read about if you want to know more ) and factory LED lights. Averages mid 40s to the gallon depending how you ride it .....

Stock seat isn't great but that's easily sorted.

Luggage is handy AND you don't need to have all that exposed bracket shit on show when you take it off as the mounts are built into the grab rails. You can fit a full face helmet in each pannier.

Nice upright riding position. Movable screen. Cornering ABS ( part of the IMU) .

Fast if you want / will merrily pull from 30mph in top if you just want to be lazy. I went from a 47bhp CB500 twin to this and I could not be happier. Zero issues adjusting to the size / weight / power.

Plenty of aftermarket toot available if that's your thing .... mine will be running a full Arrow system by mid next week - got bored with the lack of crackle from the stock CAT'd exhaust.

My only real issues are the lack of a centre stand and the weight but you really don't notice it as it's quite low down.

Oh and if you're short ( < 28" inside leg ) they can be easily lowered to fit.

Stock tyres are shite - fit ANYTHING else.
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MarJay
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PostPosted: 21:08 - 30 Apr 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

UncleBFester wrote:
As an owner of Z1000SX and having done nothing but use it as an allrounder for the last 7k miles .... they are a great bike.

Sure you can pick up an early one but you miss out on the fancy electronics package including IMU ( go read about if you want to know more ) and factory LED lights. Averages mid 40s to the gallon depending how you ride it .....

Stock seat isn't great but that's easily sorted.

Luggage is handy AND you don't need to have all that exposed bracket shit on show when you take it off as the mounts are built into the grab rails. You can fit a full face helmet in each pannier.

Nice upright riding position. Movable screen. Cornering ABS ( part of the IMU) .

Fast if you want / will merrily pull from 30mph in top if you just want to be lazy. I went from a 47bhp CB500 twin to this and I could not be happier. Zero issues adjusting to the size / weight / power.

Plenty of aftermarket toot available if that's your thing .... mine will be running a full Arrow system by mid next week - got bored with the lack of crackle from the stock CAT'd exhaust.

My only real issues are the lack of a centre stand and the weight but you really don't notice it as it's quite low down.

Oh and if you're short ( < 28" inside leg ) they can be easily lowered to fit.

Stock tyres are shite - fit ANYTHING else.


I’m very tempted by one... so anything more you can tell me would be awesome. What is the tank range if you ride it just on motorways? The one I test rode handled ok and the brakes were absolutely ace. What’s the insurance like?
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UncleFester
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PostPosted: 21:20 - 30 Apr 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tank range i'd say about 200 give or take, maybe less depending how careless you are with the throttle. FC Insurance for a 46 year old with a few years NCB is .... £170 inc commuting Very Happy

I don't do a whole lot of motorway stuff though, i use it for B roads and the odd dual carriageways around here. I am no racer but you can throw it around like a much smaller lighter bike once you get it moving.

Apparently there is a fairly notable power jump once you get over 7krpm - can't say i've noticed it primarily because of the way it gets up to speed without using it. If you're used to the power below that then i have no doubt you'll enjoy the higher end range.

2nd and 3rd gear are brutal if you really open it up but with the IMU, you can do that without the front end coming up and yes, you can turn it all off if you want to. I haven't and won't, i bought the later model because it has this stuff.


https://www.visordown.com/reviews/first-ride/first-ride-2017-kawasaki-z1000sx-review isn't a bad read.

I picked mine up for 8k, it was one of the first WHF 2017 Models .... there are plenty of deals for full touring spec bikes.
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 21:46 - 30 Apr 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd love to see a comparison test between mine and the Z1000SX, or better still, ride them back-to-back myself.
Specs-wise, there's not much in it. The FZS1000 is 2kg heavier wet. Quoted as a higher top end. Higher quoted power output. Larger fuel tank.

This is why I never seriously considered switching to the Z. Just not enough in it to make sense to do so.

Unless you know otherwise Question
Handling maybe? (Dealt with that on mine Mr. Green )

Oh, and mine's got a centre stand Smile
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bigdom86
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PostPosted: 10:17 - 01 May 2019    Post subject: re Reply with quote

in your position I would opt for a CBR600F (not-RR) if you want a compromise between looks, comfort, mpg and power - pretty comfortable if you can get out on a run but at low speed like stop start traffic it can be a pain especially if 6ft+.

if you do quite a bit of commuting I would opt for something still a bit "sporty" looking but more upright, Z800 would be by top choice closely followed by street triple as a good all rounder/commuter

if all you care about is comfort and mpg then get a NC750
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MarJay
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PostPosted: 11:08 - 01 May 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

UncleBFester wrote:
Tank range i'd say about 200 give or take, maybe less depending how careless you are with the throttle. FC Insurance for a 46 year old with a few years NCB is .... £170 inc commuting Very Happy

I don't do a whole lot of motorway stuff though, i use it for B roads and the odd dual carriageways around here. I am no racer but you can throw it around like a much smaller lighter bike once you get it moving.

Apparently there is a fairly notable power jump once you get over 7krpm - can't say i've noticed it primarily because of the way it gets up to speed without using it. If you're used to the power below that then i have no doubt you'll enjoy the higher end range.

2nd and 3rd gear are brutal if you really open it up but with the IMU, you can do that without the front end coming up and yes, you can turn it all off if you want to. I haven't and won't, i bought the later model because it has this stuff.


https://www.visordown.com/reviews/first-ride/first-ride-2017-kawasaki-z1000sx-review isn't a bad read.

I picked mine up for 8k, it was one of the first WHF 2017 Models .... there are plenty of deals for full touring spec bikes.


This is exactly what I wanted to hear. My commute is 50 miles each way on about 80% motorway, 20% in town. My VFR is reputed to have a tank range of 180 some odd miles but I do over 200 which means I can fill up once every two days. If I had to fill up every day I'd be pretty annoyed I reckon. a 200 mile range is pretty much perfect for me.

I expect not being a superbike the insurance would be reasonable for me, and the one I test rode was comfortable and handled well. I felt a bit of a disconnect between the front and rear, with the front hardly moving and the rear being fairly soft. I guess with the multi adjustable forks this could be dialled out a bit.

The main reason I want one is the brakes. Wow. Better even than my Street Triple brakes.

There are two issues with my VFR which are kind of related. One is it's 19 years old, so things are bound to go wrong on it. Only yesterday the throttle close cable randomly snapped for no reason. Luckily I was able to ride home but it felt very weird and could well have been dangerous. The other issue is the ULEZ which will cover both of my main places of work from early 2021. I realise that's a fair way off, but it's something else to nudge me into action. I was going to go for a 2014 bike (first facelift) but looking at the prices I can get a 2017 bike (full IMU etc) for only about a grand more, so it's probably worth paying the extra.

It's also been a while since I've owned a 'big' bike, certainly one with over 120bhp let alone 140 so I'm looking forward to it.
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DJP
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PostPosted: 11:09 - 01 May 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bandit 1250 does it for me.

There is nothing else currently made that comes close to it's all round abilities.
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UncleFester
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PostPosted: 12:19 - 01 May 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rear suspension is tweakable on the Z1000 via a hand turn adjuster.

Lights and brakes are very very good. As is the fuelling / drive train and slip assist clutch. Very easy to shift without clutch even for a relative noob ( me).

edit @ Chickenstrip

I never looked at the Fazer .... my eye was drawn to this first and i knew i fitted on it. It was about as scientific as that until i found out about the lights / IMU stuff. It's about as safe as you can make having fun Smile
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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha
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PostPosted: 21:34 - 01 May 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

almostthere wrote:
zx9r nothing else comes close Thumbs Up

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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha
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PostPosted: 21:37 - 01 May 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

MarJay wrote:
almostthere wrote:
zx9r nothing else comes close Thumbs Up


Apart from a Z1000SX you mean? It's basically a ZX9R with more CC's and a slightly more upright riding position.


And an extra 40 (count 'em and week) kg on top.
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Howling Terror
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PostPosted: 22:04 - 01 May 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

From what I've read there are better bikes than the Z1000SX. Bikes that don't require coercing into corners. Fazer thou would be a better bike.
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MarJay
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PostPosted: 22:19 - 01 May 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

trevor saxe-coburg-gotha wrote:

And an extra 40 (count 'em and week) kg on top.


Err... That would account for the wet versus dry weight. Nowadays weights are quoted wet, and apparently adds somewhere in the region of 35-40kg to the equivalent dry weight.

Dry weights were ALWAYS quoted back in the '90s when the big 4 used to put bikes without batteries and fuel and oil in a drying room to completely get rid of any moisture.

I've ridden a Z1000SX, and did not have to coerce it into corners.
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 22:28 - 01 May 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Howling Terror wrote:
From what I've read there are better bikes than the Z1000SX. Bikes that don't require coercing into corners. Fazer thou would be a better bike.


I don't know that a standard Fazer is better than the Z. There just isn't enough in it, I think, to swap from one to the other (I always thought this was telling about the Yam, considering how much later a bike the Z is). But obviously, the Z has more modern styling and equipment, and as MarJay's requirement is for ULEZ compatibility, the Z would make more sense for him. Do you know that a standard Fazer handles better? Maybe after you've changed out the rear shock on it.

The Fazer deserved having some money thrown at it to make it even better. No reason why the Z shouldn't, I suppose. Standard suspension on anything other than top sports bikes always seems to leave something to be desired.

But I do like having nearly 140bhp at the rear wheel. Ivans ftw Mr. Green
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Kawasaki Jimbo
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PostPosted: 23:55 - 01 May 2019    Post subject: Re: most durable allrounder Reply with quote

leolion wrote:
Whats the best do it all bike guys?
Able to laugh off winter crud, decent on a motorway, bearable summer b road scratcher, able to do the commute or your weekly shop,easy to handle at 15mph or 90mph,can manage a summer holiday tour, light enough to push round but heavy enough to not get blown around in gales,pleasing to the eye but not top of the thieves list.
Any reasonable budget acceptable.

I was going to point to my '99 ZX6R but then I thought I do all that on my R1, and did the same on my 56bhp Yamaha XJR400. I'll say any medium-weight road bike will do as long as it isn't made of Chineseum and has more than 50bhp.
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 00:03 - 02 May 2019    Post subject: Re: most durable allrounder Reply with quote

Kawasaki Jimbo wrote:
leolion wrote:
Whats the best do it all bike guys?
Able to laugh off winter crud, decent on a motorway, bearable summer b road scratcher, able to do the commute or your weekly shop,easy to handle at 15mph or 90mph,can manage a summer holiday tour, light enough to push round but heavy enough to not get blown around in gales,pleasing to the eye but not top of the thieves list.
Any reasonable budget acceptable.

I was going to point to my '99 ZX6R but then I thought I do all that on my R1, and did the same on my 56bhp Yamaha XJR400. I'll say any medium-weight road bike will do as long as it isn't made of Chineseum and has more than 50bhp.


I used an RG500 as an all-rounder for a time, but it wasn't the best choice for that use Wink (might well have been the worst Rolling Eyes ).
Don't forget the old Fazer 600. Proper do-it-all bike.
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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha
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PostPosted: 07:09 - 02 May 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

MarJay wrote:
trevor saxe-coburg-gotha wrote:

And an extra 40 (count 'em and week) kg on top.


Err... That would account for the wet versus dry weight. Nowadays weights are quoted wet, and apparently adds somewhere in the region of 35-40kg to the equivalent dry weight.



You are wrong if you think there is not a significant difference i.e. of some 30kg between the wet weights of the zx9r (C1 and C2) and the Z1000SX.
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Howling Terror
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PostPosted: 16:20 - 02 May 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Re the zx1000sx, my source was from Simon Hargreaves the bike journo FWIW.
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MarJay
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PostPosted: 16:27 - 02 May 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Howling Terror wrote:
Re the zx1000sx, my source was from Simon Hargreaves the bike journo FWIW.

Hmm... I might ask him about that!

A lot of people say that a slightly larger profile rear tyre transforms the bike, and also bike journos always test new bikes on OEM tyres, which on the Zed are known to be absolutely awful.

The one I rode felt fine. The forks felt hard and the back end soft, but certainly nothing that could not be dialled out. Remember it's set up for people who want to cruise to the south of France, but I could definitely feel a lot of potential there.

When I buy one, I'll get it all set up with a decent set of tyres and then I'll see if cornering on it can ever be described as coercing. If it's good enough, I might even do a trackday on it just for sh*ts and giggles.
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MarJay
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PostPosted: 16:30 - 02 May 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

MarJay wrote:
Howling Terror wrote:
Re the zx1000sx, my source was from Simon Hargreaves the bike journo FWIW.

Hmm... I might ask him about that!

A lot of people say that a slightly larger profile rear tyre transforms the bike, and also bike journos always test new bikes on OEM tyres, which on the Zed are known to be absolutely awful.

The one I rode felt fine. The forks felt hard and the back end soft, but certainly nothing that could not be dialled out. Remember it's set up for people who want to cruise to the south of France, but I could definitely feel a lot of potential there.

When I buy one, I'll get it all set up with a decent set of tyres and then I'll see if cornering on it can ever be described as coercing. If it's good enough, I might even do a trackday on it just for sh*ts and giggles.


Also are you sure you're not confusing the H2SX which is his current long termer? There is a test between a VFR800F and a Z1000SX in the south of France in next months RiDE mag, so we'll see what that says too.
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MarJay
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PostPosted: 16:39 - 02 May 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

trevor saxe-coburg-gotha wrote:


You are wrong if you think there is not a significant difference i.e. of some 30kg between the wet weights of the zx9r (C1 and C2) and the Z1000SX.


So I did a bit of digging on this. Bikespecs quotes the C1 ZX9R as 183kg dry, and 202kg wet. Which on it's own doesn't make any sense, because by and large there is an approx 30-35kg difference between 'dry' and 'wet' weights on big bore bikes according to various sources.

However, manufacturers also have recently changed how they measure wet weights too, with many measuring with oil, fork oil, shock oil, battery fluid, coolant etc, but NOT fuel until recently.

When we take 202kg, and we add 19 litres of fuel (in the Z1000SX tank) we get approximately 220kg (as petrol is fractionally less dense than water). With the claimed wet weight of the Z1000SX as 235kg, you're only looking at a 15kg difference which probably comes from the USD forks, the radial brakes, the ABS and IMU stuff, and the beefed up subframe for the hard luggage etc, and things like the remote preload adjuster etc. That's not even mentioning the large catalytic converter, and twin exhaust silencers that meet Euro 4 spec.

It also has an extra 10bhp or so at the wheel... So the difference is probably not as big as you make out. Plus the ZX9R won't pass the ULEZ, doesn't have 3 stage traction control, cornering ABS USD forks, radial brakes, 2 power modes, LED headlamps etc.

A Z1000SX might even be lighter than a ZX9R with a full exhaust system fitted....
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