|
Author |
Message |
Andy_Pagin |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Andy_Pagin World Chat Champion
Joined: 08 Nov 2010 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
stinkwheel |
This post is not being displayed .
|
stinkwheel Bovine Proctologist
Joined: 12 Jul 2004 Karma :
|
Posted: 14:25 - 26 Nov 2019 Post subject: |
|
|
Last chance to see. Fuel-thirsty, performance motorcycles are a dying breed. We are the last generation that will be able to enjoy them as they were designed to be enjoyed. I'm making the most of it.
If increasing environmental levies and decreasing fuel availability don't get them, the speeding Nazis will. (hell, I'm having to use additives in my VFR for it to cope with E5 fuel as it is, I'm not sure it'll cope with E10 at all). I'll still be able to run it but I'll land up buying canned fuel. They'll have black boxes in all vehicles that kill the engine and call the police if you go over the speed limit within my driving lifetime
Upcoming autonomous vehicles will see legislation put in place that doesn't allow me that degree of total personal control of my vehicle, perhaps not on all roads but certainly on major thoroughfares.
I suppose using my bikes as hard and frequently as I can is changing my habits because it's an acknowledgement that this is unsustainable. ____________________ “Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.”
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles. |
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
SirFallalot |
This post is not being displayed .
|
SirFallalot Trackday Trickster
Joined: 25 Oct 2018 Karma :
|
Posted: 14:30 - 26 Nov 2019 Post subject: |
|
|
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
WimbleHJR |
This post is not being displayed .
|
WimbleHJR Renault 5 Driver
Joined: 27 Oct 2012 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
stinkwheel |
This post is not being displayed .
|
stinkwheel Bovine Proctologist
Joined: 12 Jul 2004 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
SirFallalot |
This post is not being displayed .
|
SirFallalot Trackday Trickster
Joined: 25 Oct 2018 Karma :
|
Posted: 14:58 - 26 Nov 2019 Post subject: |
|
|
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
Polarbear |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Polarbear Super Spammer
Joined: 24 Feb 2007 Karma :
|
Posted: 15:09 - 26 Nov 2019 Post subject: |
|
|
I have a coal fired boiler and steam engine sitting in may garage. If they ban my diesel engine out of my boat that is going in and I will be blowing soot all up and down the Grand Union canal.
As far a bikes go, I won't change to electric, I'll give up biking. Only because it seems like a good cut off point as I'm getting on anyway.
I already have an electric cripple cart for going to the shops because it is so much fun to run over twats in Asda and push to the front of queues and it means I don't have to leave my Jaguar in the car park .
Life is going to be sh1t. ____________________ Triumph Trophy Launch Edition |
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
weasley |
This post is not being displayed .
|
weasley World Chat Champion
Joined: 16 Oct 2010 Karma :
|
Posted: 15:17 - 26 Nov 2019 Post subject: |
|
|
Like most, I usually see the poster's name, maybe read the opening line or two then scroll on past. But I felt compelled to read this one as it was (1) relatively short and (2) about a relatively up-to-date topic about which i know a little. I hope the other diatribes on Benleys and A1 licences are more accurate than this one?
Teflon-Mike wrote: | Less than 1% of UK vehicular travel is by motorbike... hmmmm.... we could take every damn one off the road tomorrow... and it would make less difference to our national carbon 'footprint' as oooh... I don't know.... giving my mother cooking lessons to stop her burning salad! (yes seriously! She managed it!) |
Regardless of the size of the impact, reducing it is always reducing it. That's like saying that less than 1% of the population die by murder, so may as well just leave it alone.
Teflon-Mike wrote: | Meanwhile... the whole Kyoto debate on the presumed connection between climate change and CO2 emissions, remains at best, borrox… |
No, it is not "at best, borrox". It is, at best, scientifically agreed consensus.
Teflon-Mike wrote: | It's NOT a scientifically 'proven' fact, that CO2 and green-house gas emissions are causing climate change. It is a THEORY. |
Aaaah, the classic "theory not fact" argument, which is beloved of the flat Earthers and creationists and serves only to highlight your misunderstanding of both terms and the scientific process. Here's a test for you: gravity is only a theory - how would you like to find a high place and test it?
Teflon-Mike wrote: | ...how many tons of green-house gasses, alleged to cause this climate change, come from human activity, compared to 'natural' emissions... like sheep... |
And there we have it. The shot in the foot that exposes what a ridiculous position you hold. Yes, there is a substantial carbon footprint from farm animals.... PUT THERE BY HUMANS. Farming is a man-made activity and its emissions are entirely man-made.
I work in the oil and gas industry - it's a tough place to admit to working at the moment, but I know that most of what I am doing these days is in service of improving efficiency of existing machines and seeking alternatives for future ones.
Teflon-Mike wrote: | SO NO basically, is the answer, I am NOT planning on giving up my motorbikes for any notional suggestion that it might save the planet! |
Here we agree - I have made some interventions to reduce the carbon footprint of my lifestyle but the bike stays. So I am possibly the worst kind of person - someone who understands and acknowledges the impact of ICEs on the climate but doesn't do everything I can to reduce it. But I am doing something, which includes being open-minded and brutally honest about the reality of the situation. ____________________
Yamaha XJ600 | Yamaha YZF600R Thundercat | KTM 990 SMT | BMW F900XR TE |
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
Freddyfruitba... |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Freddyfruitba... World Chat Champion
Joined: 20 May 2016 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
Ayrton |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Ayrton World Chat Champion
Joined: 02 Sep 2010 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
SirFallalot |
This post is not being displayed .
|
SirFallalot Trackday Trickster
Joined: 25 Oct 2018 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
Freddyfruitba... |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Freddyfruitba... World Chat Champion
Joined: 20 May 2016 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
JackButler |
This post is not being displayed .
|
JackButler Traffic Copper
Joined: 11 Nov 2019 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
trevor saxe-coburg-gotha |
This post is not being displayed .
|
trevor saxe-coburg-gotha World Chat Champion
Joined: 22 Nov 2012 Karma :
|
Posted: 19:48 - 26 Nov 2019 Post subject: |
|
|
weasley wrote: |
Teflon-Mike wrote: | Meanwhile... the whole Kyoto debate on the presumed connection between climate change and CO2 emissions, remains at best, borrox… |
No, it is not "at best, borrox". It is, at best, scientifically agreed consensus.
Teflon-Mike wrote: | It's NOT a scientifically 'proven' fact, that CO2 and green-house gas emissions are causing climate change. It is a THEORY. |
Aaaah, the classic "theory not fact" argument, which is beloved of the flat Earthers and creationists and serves only to highlight your misunderstanding of both terms and the scientific process. Here's a test for you: gravity is only a theory - how would you like to find a high place and test it? |
Interesting points. I'm very ignorant of both the debate around global warming / climate change etc., and of the epistemological conditions that must be satisfied to separate a theory from a fact (for instance I thought there was a vast amount of empirical evidence to demonstrate gravitational pull, sufficient to regard it as factual). For these and related reasons it's difficult for me to even formulate a cogent question never mind attempt to offer any answers on the OP's topic. That never stopped me before though lol.
Firstly, I wonder how theories of climate change account for e.g. the Thames freezing annually, and people attending a fair there. Things like that. It's as though global warming - or change, at least - preceded industrialisation on any meaningful worldwide scale. I imagine there are numerous other examples from around the globe - some that suggest one thing, others another.
It makes me ponder the extent to which we're conflating correlation and causation in these debates. E.g. - yes, climate change is occurring. And, okay yes, it is changing in an epoch that has seen industrialisation on several continents. But - the inevitable and predictable observation - we know that massive changes in global temperatures have occurred in times when no industrialisation was present...
Fwiw, currently my own view is that climate change is happening but that there is less compelling evidence to demonstrate that it is as a consequence of industrial activity etc. etc. That said, I've resisted drilling down into the data and debates because it quickly feels pretty fucking overwhelming tbqh. It's great that the www exists as a resource to research such stuff - but it often feels like there's such an immense amount of data weighing on each side. I accept however that it is happening - but don't feel that there is similar weight for how. ____________________ "Life is a sexually transmitted disease and the mortality rate is one hundred percent."
Mobylette Type 50 ---> Raleigh Grifter ---> Neval Minsk 125 |
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
DJP |
This post is not being displayed .
|
DJP Crazy Courier
Joined: 11 Dec 2011 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
Ste |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Ste Not Work Safe
Joined: 01 Sep 2002 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
Easy-X |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Easy-X Super Spammer
Joined: 08 Mar 2019 Karma :
|
Posted: 23:41 - 26 Nov 2019 Post subject: |
|
|
Oh shit... I stopped driving to work in a car as I thought it was a bit of a waste: 5 seats, just me in the car. And then I went to work on an ebike... can I get my tree-hugger badge pls?
No wait, I swapped the ebike for a motorbike, best keep that badge ____________________ Husqvarna Vitpilen 401, Yamaha XSR700, Honda Rebel, Yamaha DT175, Suzuki SV650 (loan) Fazer 600, Keeway Superlight 125, 50cc turd scooter |
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
Undinist |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Undinist Nearly there...
Joined: 08 Oct 2013 Karma :
|
Posted: 00:32 - 27 Nov 2019 Post subject: |
|
|
trevor saxe-coburg-gotha wrote: | I wonder how theories of climate change account for e.g. the Thames freezing annually, and people attending a fair there. |
The answer was published in January this year. In the 15th century about 56 million North American natives died, mostly because of diseases imported by Europeans. The dead natives' farmland, which was about the size of France, reverted to forest. The new trees caused global cooling and a mini Ice Age in Europe.
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/jan/31/european-colonization-of-americas-helped-cause-climate-change
Quote: | European colonization of the Americas resulted in the killing of so many native people that it transformed the environment and caused the Earth’s climate to cool down, new research has found.
Settlers killed off huge numbers of people in conflicts and also by spreading disease, which reduced the indigenous population by 90% in the century following Christopher Columbus’s initial journey to the Americas and Caribbean in 1492.
This “large-scale depopulation” resulted in vast tracts of agricultural land being left untended, researchers say, allowing the land to become overgrown with trees and other new vegetation.
The regrowth soaked up enough carbon dioxide from the atmosphere to actually cool the planet, with the average temperature dropping by 0.15C in the late 1500s and early 1600s, the study by scientists at University College London found.
“The great dying of the indigenous peoples of the Americas resulted in a human-driven global impact on the Earth system in the two centuries prior to the Industrial Revolution,” wrote the UCL team of Alexander Koch, Chris Brierley, Mark Maslin and Simon Lewis.
The drop in temperature during this period is known as the “Little Ice Age”, a time when the River Thames in London would regularly freeze over, snowstorms were common in Portugal and disrupted agriculture caused famines in several European countries.
The UCL researchers found that the European colonization of the Americas indirectly contributed to this colder period by causing the deaths of about 56 million people by 1600. The study attributes the deaths to factors including introduced disease, such as smallpox and measles, as well as warfare and societal collapse.
Researchers then calculated how much land indigenous people required and then subsequently fell into disuse, finding that around 55m hectares, an area roughly equivalent to France, became vacant and was reclaimed by carbon dioxide-absorbing vegetation.
The study sketches out a past where humans were influencing the climate long before the industrial revolution, where the use of fossil fuels for the manufacturing of goods, generation of electricity and transportation has allowed tens of billions of tons of carbon dioxide to be released into the atmosphere.
Widespread deforestation for agriculture and urban development has also spurred the release of greenhouse gases, causing the planet to warm by around 1C over the past century. Scientists have warned that the world has little over a decade to drastically reduce emissions or face increasingly severe storms, drought, heatwaves, coastal flooding and food insecurity.
The revegetation of the Americas after European arrival aided declines of global carbon content in the air, dropping by around seven to 10 parts of carbon dioxide for every million molecules of air in the atmosphere. This compares to the 3ppm of carbon dioxide that humanity is currently adding to the atmosphere every year through the burning of fossil fuels.
“There is a lot of talk around ‘negative emissions’ approaching and using tree-planting to take carbon dioxide out of the atmosphere to mitigate climate change,” study co-author Chris Brierley told the BBC.
“And what we see from this study is the scale of what’s required, because the great dying resulted in an area the size of France being reforested and that gave us only a few parts per million.
“This is useful; it shows us what reforestation can do. But at the same, that kind of reduction is worth perhaps just two years of fossil fuel emissions at the present rate.” |
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
AldridgePrior |
This post is not being displayed because the poster is banned. Unhide this post / all posts.
|
AldridgePrior Banned
Joined: 19 Oct 2017 Karma :
|
Posted: 01:30 - 27 Nov 2019 Post subject: |
|
|
Make sure and do your bit for the environment and turn out the little red light on your telly.
Watch this guy. I kinda like him.
https://youtu.be/NjlC02NsIt0 |
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
Tdibs |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Tdibs Traffic Copper
Joined: 16 Jan 2015 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
trevor saxe-coburg-gotha |
This post is not being displayed .
|
trevor saxe-coburg-gotha World Chat Champion
Joined: 22 Nov 2012 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
Sister Sledge |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Sister Sledge World Chat Champion
Joined: 17 Aug 2018 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
chris_hu_cheng |
This post is not being displayed .
|
chris_hu_cheng Renault 5 Driver
Joined: 06 Jul 2018 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
trevor saxe-coburg-gotha |
This post is not being displayed .
|
trevor saxe-coburg-gotha World Chat Champion
Joined: 22 Nov 2012 Karma :
|
Posted: 09:57 - 27 Nov 2019 Post subject: |
|
|
Undinist wrote: | trevor saxe-coburg-gotha wrote: | I wonder how theories of climate change account for e.g. the Thames freezing annually, and people attending a fair there. |
The answer was published in January this year. In the 15th century about 56 million North American natives died, mostly because of diseases imported by Europeans. The dead natives' farmland, which was about the size of France, reverted to forest. The new trees caused global cooling and a mini Ice Age in Europe.
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/jan/31/european-colonization-of-americas-helped-cause-climate-change
Quote: | European colonization of the Americas resulted in the killing of so many native people that it transformed the environment and caused the Earth’s climate to cool down, new research has found.
Settlers killed off huge numbers of people in conflicts and also by spreading disease, which reduced the indigenous population by 90% in the century following Christopher Columbus’s initial journey to the Americas and Caribbean in 1492.
This “large-scale depopulation” resulted in vast tracts of agricultural land being left untended, researchers say, allowing the land to become overgrown with trees and other new vegetation.
The regrowth soaked up enough carbon dioxide from the atmosphere to actually cool the planet, with the average temperature dropping by 0.15C in the late 1500s and early 1600s, the study by scientists at University College London found.
“The great dying of the indigenous peoples of the Americas resulted in a human-driven global impact on the Earth system in the two centuries prior to the Industrial Revolution,” wrote the UCL team of Alexander Koch, Chris Brierley, Mark Maslin and Simon Lewis.
The drop in temperature during this period is known as the “Little Ice Age”, a time when the River Thames in London would regularly freeze over, snowstorms were common in Portugal and disrupted agriculture caused famines in several European countries.
The UCL researchers found that the European colonization of the Americas indirectly contributed to this colder period by causing the deaths of about 56 million people by 1600. The study attributes the deaths to factors including introduced disease, such as smallpox and measles, as well as warfare and societal collapse.
Researchers then calculated how much land indigenous people required and then subsequently fell into disuse, finding that around 55m hectares, an area roughly equivalent to France, became vacant and was reclaimed by carbon dioxide-absorbing vegetation.
The study sketches out a past where humans were influencing the climate long before the industrial revolution, where the use of fossil fuels for the manufacturing of goods, generation of electricity and transportation has allowed tens of billions of tons of carbon dioxide to be released into the atmosphere.
Widespread deforestation for agriculture and urban development has also spurred the release of greenhouse gases, causing the planet to warm by around 1C over the past century. Scientists have warned that the world has little over a decade to drastically reduce emissions or face increasingly severe storms, drought, heatwaves, coastal flooding and food insecurity.
The revegetation of the Americas after European arrival aided declines of global carbon content in the air, dropping by around seven to 10 parts of carbon dioxide for every million molecules of air in the atmosphere. This compares to the 3ppm of carbon dioxide that humanity is currently adding to the atmosphere every year through the burning of fossil fuels.
“There is a lot of talk around ‘negative emissions’ approaching and using tree-planting to take carbon dioxide out of the atmosphere to mitigate climate change,” study co-author Chris Brierley told the BBC.
“And what we see from this study is the scale of what’s required, because the great dying resulted in an area the size of France being reforested and that gave us only a few parts per million.
“This is useful; it shows us what reforestation can do. But at the same, that kind of reduction is worth perhaps just two years of fossil fuel emissions at the present rate.” |
|
I find *all* of that very, very difficult to believe. However, reading it and reading around it - I did have to revise some previous thoughts I'd held, i.e. that Thames "frost fairs" were an annual thing. Apparently they were more sporadic than that. ____________________ "Life is a sexually transmitted disease and the mortality rate is one hundred percent."
Mobylette Type 50 ---> Raleigh Grifter ---> Neval Minsk 125 |
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
Undinist |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Undinist Nearly there...
Joined: 08 Oct 2013 Karma :
|
|
Back to top |
|
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
Old Thread Alert!
The last post was made 4 years, 161 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful? |
|
|
|