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Which bike for dodgy knees

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barryd
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PostPosted: 12:37 - 13 Sep 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shaft wrote:


This.

BMW c600 Sport is supposed to be great too.

I'll third that.

My 600 Silverwing is a hoot - will do 3 figure speeds easily (on the private runway of your choice) handles better than it has any right to and the bonus is, for those of us with aches and pains, the maxi scooters tend to have plenty of room to move about, so leg/bum positioning can be varied to suit.


Thanks. Whats it like for pushing about either when you are sat on it or wheeling it?

i know it sounds like a daft question but what I will have to do at home is wheel it backwards down our drive into the garage. I think it will be too wide to turn around on the drive if I go in forwards. So I am thinking ill have to reverse it. Just with my dodgy knees I dont want to drop it!

I have some concerns about the weight limit which I think is just 169KG. I weigh about 18st+ but my wife is less than 8 stone. I hardly even notice her on the little Vision to be honest but I have heard the Silverwing can be a bit crashy for the pillion if close to the payload limit.

This one is just up the road from me. Private sale and one owner from new.

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/bike-details/202008222800999?cc-from=300&body-type=Scooter&price-to=3500&postcode=dl117hh&radius=1500&advertising-location=at_bikes&sort=distance&page=1
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Shaft
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PostPosted: 14:42 - 13 Sep 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

barryd wrote:

Thanks. Whats it like for pushing about either when you are sat on it or wheeling it?

i know it sounds like a daft question but what I will have to do at home is wheel it backwards down our drive into the garage. I think it will be too wide to turn around on the drive if I go in forwards. So I am thinking ill have to reverse it. Just with my dodgy knees I dont want to drop it!

I have some concerns about the weight limit which I think is just 169KG. I weigh about 18st+ but my wife is less than 8 stone. I hardly even notice her on the little Vision to be honest but I have heard the Silverwing can be a bit crashy for the pillion if close to the payload limit.

This one is just up the road from me. Private sale and one owner from new.

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/bike-details/202008222800999?cc-from=300&body-type=Scooter&price-to=3500&postcode=dl117hh&radius=1500&advertising-location=at_bikes&sort=distance&page=1


I have to push mine backwards, up over kerbstone, then it's downhill after that.

I do it with the engine running, so if I get the angle wrong or something, just give it some juice and start again - no problem at all.

I'm about 17 stone and I've had another guy around 15 stone on the back, no big deal, even with one knackered shock.

I'll be honest, I was extremely sceptical before I bought it - at the time it was a toss up between a Deauville and the Wing and the right Wing came up first.

I deliberately didn't spend a lot of money on it (under a grand) on the basis that if I hated it, I could bail out with a minimum loss, but even then I was suffering severe buyer's remorse on the way to collect it.

I really couldn't have been more surprised, I absolutely love the thing, to the point where I'm about to throw around 500 quid at it, sorting out a few issues, like the aforementioned shocks.

I wouldn't mind a tad more acceleration, which I might sort with different rollers, but I might just leave it as is, it's not a major problem.

The only thing I can really fault is the fuel consumption, but even then it's only when you're really pressing on that you notice it and even then, it's only because like all scooters, it's got quite a small tank - at vastly inflated London prices, the most I've ever got in it was 16 quid, starting with no bars on the fuel gauge.
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83 Z1100A3, 83 GS650 Katana, 02 FJS600 Silver Wing, 94 XJ900F (Sold)
WooHoo, I'm a Man Point Millionaire! http://www.bikechatforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=234035
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barryd
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PostPosted: 15:09 - 13 Sep 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shaft wrote:

I have to push mine backwards, up over kerbstone, then it's downhill after that.

I do it with the engine running, so if I get the angle wrong or something, just give it some juice and start again - no problem at all.

I'm about 17 stone and I've had another guy around 15 stone on the back, no big deal, even with one knackered shock.

I'll be honest, I was extremely sceptical before I bought it - at the time it was a toss up between a Deauville and the Wing and the right Wing came up first.

I deliberately didn't spend a lot of money on it (under a grand) on the basis that if I hated it, I could bail out with a minimum loss, but even then I was suffering severe buyer's remorse on the way to collect it.

I really couldn't have been more surprised, I absolutely love the thing, to the point where I'm about to throw around 500 quid at it, sorting out a few issues, like the aforementioned shocks.

I wouldn't mind a tad more acceleration, which I might sort with different rollers, but I might just leave it as is, it's not a major problem.

The only thing I can really fault is the fuel consumption, but even then it's only when you're really pressing on that you notice it and even then, it's only because like all scooters, it's got quite a small tank - at vastly inflated London prices, the most I've ever got in it was 16 quid, starting with no bars on the fuel gauge.


Thanks again. My drive is small stones but it does slope ever so slightly downwards towards the garage apart from at the front where it slopes (Tarmac) down to the road gently. If I cant get it in the garage ill just leave it on the top of the drive and stick a cover on it. Its not likely to get nicked here.

It was the acceleration and pulling power I was hoping to enjoy more than the top end.

What sort of MPG do you get? Im not that fussed about it but just out of interest.
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Shaft
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PostPosted: 17:32 - 13 Sep 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

barryd wrote:
Shaft wrote:

I have to push mine backwards, up over kerbstone, then it's downhill after that.

I do it with the engine running, so if I get the angle wrong or something, just give it some juice and start again - no problem at all.

I'm about 17 stone and I've had another guy around 15 stone on the back, no big deal, even with one knackered shock.

I'll be honest, I was extremely sceptical before I bought it - at the time it was a toss up between a Deauville and the Wing and the right Wing came up first.

I deliberately didn't spend a lot of money on it (under a grand) on the basis that if I hated it, I could bail out with a minimum loss, but even then I was suffering severe buyer's remorse on the way to collect it.

I really couldn't have been more surprised, I absolutely love the thing, to the point where I'm about to throw around 500 quid at it, sorting out a few issues, like the aforementioned shocks.

I wouldn't mind a tad more acceleration, which I might sort with different rollers, but I might just leave it as is, it's not a major problem.

The only thing I can really fault is the fuel consumption, but even then it's only when you're really pressing on that you notice it and even then, it's only because like all scooters, it's got quite a small tank - at vastly inflated London prices, the most I've ever got in it was 16 quid, starting with no bars on the fuel gauge.


Thanks again. My drive is small stones but it does slope ever so slightly downwards towards the garage apart from at the front where it slopes (Tarmac) down to the road gently. If I cant get it in the garage ill just leave it on the top of the drive and stick a cover on it. Its not likely to get nicked here.

It was the acceleration and pulling power I was hoping to enjoy more than the top end.

What sort of MPG do you get? Im not that fussed about it but just out of interest.


The acceleration isn't really an issue, from standing it already surprises big 'proper' bikes (who I assume think it's a 125, even though it's longer than my old XJ900) I just fancy a bit extra to surprise them even more!

You could change the rollers to give it a touch more oomph, but you will lose a little top end (wouldn't be a problem for me) and it will be revving more at speed, which might hurt the consumption.

As for that, my daily commute is about 12 miles NSL, followed by 10 miles of heavy traffic and I get 130-140 miles per tank - 1 tank = 15 quid at 115p a litre - you can work that out, I don't do maths on Sundays Laughing

If you do get one, there's a web based owners forum who have done everything there is to do one and recorded it, including experimenting with rollers/clutch springs and exhausts, so it's worth joining that, just for the wealth of knowledge.
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Enduro Numpty
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PostPosted: 10:40 - 15 Sep 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maybe a little on the heavy side but what about a Suzuki Burgman 650? I met an older guy in Ullapool at the weekend who'd previously owned Goldwings for years and he was riding the 650 Burgman. He seemed to really enjoy the practicalities of it with lack of perceived weight being his main criteria. He was touring with a guy on a K1600 BMW around the NC500. I've met a few older riders on them in Europe and all have rated them highly.
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barryd
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PostPosted: 11:05 - 15 Sep 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

Enduro Numpty wrote:
Maybe a little on the heavy side but what about a Suzuki Burgman 650? I met an older guy in Ullapool at the weekend who'd previously owned Goldwings for years and he was riding the 650 Burgman. He seemed to really enjoy the practicalities of it with lack of perceived weight being his main criteria. He was touring with a guy on a K1600 BMW around the NC500. I've met a few older riders on them in Europe and all have rated them highly.


Thanks. Most of the reviews I have seen rate the Silverwing as both lighter and a better ride than the Burgman 650 though so I discounted it. I have a feeling even the Silverwing might be too heavy but I wont know until I try one.

Found two for sale in York which is about an hour from here. Old ones and one with higher miles but I dont see any issues with an older bike at those prices really. Still waiting for photos on the cheaper one.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2004-04-HONDA-FJS600-A-3-SILVERWING-ABS-BLUE-MAXI-SCOOTER-AUTO-FJS-600-CLEAN/114402845196?hash=item1aa2f0e20c:g:aQUAAOSwNF1fW0F-

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/bike-details/202008222798565?advertising-location=at_bikes&make=HONDA&sort=distance&radius=1500&model=SILVERWING&postcode=dl117hh&page=1

The one with the higher miles sounds like its been well looked after
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Shaft
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PostPosted: 13:30 - 15 Sep 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

barryd wrote:

Thanks. Most of the reviews I have seen rate the Silverwing as both lighter and a better ride than the Burgman 650 though so I discounted it. I have a feeling even the Silverwing might be too heavy but I wont know until I try one.

Found two for sale in York which is about an hour from here. Old ones and one with higher miles but I dont see any issues with an older bike at those prices really. Still waiting for photos on the cheaper one.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2004-04-HONDA-FJS600-A-3-SILVERWING-ABS-BLUE-MAXI-SCOOTER-AUTO-FJS-600-CLEAN/114402845196?hash=item1aa2f0e20c:g:aQUAAOSwNF1fW0F-

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/bike-details/202008222798565?advertising-location=at_bikes&make=HONDA&sort=distance&radius=1500&model=SILVERWING&postcode=dl117hh&page=1

The one with the higher miles sounds like its been well looked after


One thing you do need to check very carefully are the head stock bearings - they can and do fail early (age and mileage don't seem to be a factor) and they are viciously expensive to have replaced.

If there are no bills showing replacement for taper rollers, perform every test you can and if there are any signs of wear, either get them to chuck the job in with the price, or knock a chunk off - I was quoted prices ranging from 200 to 500 to have them done, the most expensive being a Honda main dealer who would only fit genuine Honda parts, which are crap.
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Things get better with age; I'm close to being magnificent........
83 Z1100A3, 83 GS650 Katana, 02 FJS600 Silver Wing, 94 XJ900F (Sold)
WooHoo, I'm a Man Point Millionaire! http://www.bikechatforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=234035
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barryd
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PostPosted: 22:15 - 15 Sep 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shaft wrote:
barryd wrote:

Thanks. Most of the reviews I have seen rate the Silverwing as both lighter and a better ride than the Burgman 650 though so I discounted it. I have a feeling even the Silverwing might be too heavy but I wont know until I try one.

Found two for sale in York which is about an hour from here. Old ones and one with higher miles but I dont see any issues with an older bike at those prices really. Still waiting for photos on the cheaper one.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2004-04-HONDA-FJS600-A-3-SILVERWING-ABS-BLUE-MAXI-SCOOTER-AUTO-FJS-600-CLEAN/114402845196?hash=item1aa2f0e20c:g:aQUAAOSwNF1fW0F-

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/bike-details/202008222798565?advertising-location=at_bikes&make=HONDA&sort=distance&radius=1500&model=SILVERWING&postcode=dl117hh&page=1

The one with the higher miles sounds like its been well looked after


One thing you do need to check very carefully are the head stock bearings - they can and do fail early (age and mileage don't seem to be a factor) and they are viciously expensive to have replaced.

If there are no bills showing replacement for taper rollers, perform every test you can and if there are any signs of wear, either get them to chuck the job in with the price, or knock a chunk off - I was quoted prices ranging from 200 to 500 to have them done, the most expensive being a Honda main dealer who would only fit genuine Honda parts, which are crap.


Thanks,. This means nothing to me. Mechanics are not my thing at all. I presume though from a quick google of the parts these are to do with steering, front shocks / wheel? These are two old bikes, 2002 and 2004 probably much older than I would have wanted. If there is no history to indicate they have been done, is there a test I Can do to check if they are sound? Wobble the steering / wheel side to side, that kind of thing?

im wondering if I should go for something newer. My budget was up to 3500. I just read that they have super longevity these bikes and Im not bothered if its cosmetically perfect just as long as its reliable and fun to ride.

Ill test ride one tomorrow anyway. At least then Ill have an idea if its suitable even if I dont buy either.
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Shaft
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PostPosted: 23:03 - 15 Sep 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

barryd wrote:

Thanks,. This means nothing to me. Mechanics are not my thing at all. I presume though from a quick google of the parts these are to do with steering, front shocks / wheel? These are two old bikes, 2002 and 2004 probably much older than I would have wanted. If there is no history to indicate they have been done, is there a test I Can do to check if they are sound? Wobble the steering / wheel side to side, that kind of thing?

im wondering if I should go for something newer. My budget was up to 3500. I just read that they have super longevity these bikes and Im not bothered if its cosmetically perfect just as long as its reliable and fun to ride.

Ill test ride one tomorrow anyway. At least then Ill have an idea if its suitable even if I dont buy either.


Yup, head bearings are on the stem that the forks pivot on.

To Test, put the bike on the main stand and get the front wheel off the ground, either by using something heavy in the top box, or get the sales person to push down on the back of the bike.

Starting with the front wheel straight ahead, tap one bar end - you want the wheel to gently and smoothly fall in that direction, test both ways - if it's not smooth, or it won't fall at all, potentially the bearings have been overtightened, maybe to mask a failure.

Still at the bars, gently move them from side to side - if there is any notchiness just either side of straight ahead, the bearings are worn.

Now go to the front wheel and, with it still off the ground and pointing straight ahead, grab the bottom of the fork legs and gently pull/push them from front to back - if you feel movement from the top of the steering head (you will know it if you feel it) the bearings are worn.

If the sales person doesn't want to help you check, or the steering felt odd on the test ride, be suspicious.

The parts to do the job are not expensive (typically about 35 quid for a set of taper rollers) the cost is in the labour - all of the front fairing has to come off (which is easier than it looks, but still longwinded and tedious) and then the problems start, because the usual methods of removing the lower bearing race don't work.

It can't be punched out from above and a normal blind puller won't get at it from below, plus there is some suggestion Honda used thread locker when they installed them at the factory, just to make removing them that little bit harder.

There is a Honda special tool (there always is!) or I've seen people make up something involving bits of high strength steel bar, adding heat in the form of a blow torch and still struggling like buggery.

I've reached the conclusion that going straight to the nuclear option is the quickest way, Dremeling slots into the race then having at it with a hammer and chisel, but that's not very elegant; you will also be needing an awkwardly sized socket to do the whole plot up again.

Whatever way, doing the head bearings on a Silverwing is reputed to be the hardest single job on the whole bike (dropping the engine out is easier and quicker) so if you're going to have to pay someone to do it, make sure you factor that cost in.

Buying a newer/lower mileage one is no guarantee they aren't shot, reports are they go can go at well under 20K, so if there is no evidence they have ever been changed, or there is even the slightest hint of wear, you know what you need to do.

It will pay you to get into doing some home maintenance, head bearings aside, there's nothing terribly hard to do, even changing the drive belt (every 16K or so) isn't difficult and you will save yourself a decent chunk of money over time.

Edit: Don't let any of the above put you off, there are lots of bikes out there that have quirky and expensive little foibles, some very quirky and very expensive!

It might pay you to spend a little more, but I would rather have a higher mileage with a history, than low mileage and no service invoices at all.

I did an awful lot of research before I bought mine, mainly because, as I said before, I was highly sceptical of the whole concept - it does seem that the Honda is the best of the bunch, in terms of all round bang for your buck.

The Suzukis and Piaggios are probably the nearest direct competitors, but it seems Burgmans are more awkward for maintenance and Piaggios are significantly more fragile.

The Yamaha T-max is the Hi-Po option, but passenger and luggage carrying aren't it's strong point.
____________________
Things get better with age; I'm close to being magnificent........
83 Z1100A3, 83 GS650 Katana, 02 FJS600 Silver Wing, 94 XJ900F (Sold)
WooHoo, I'm a Man Point Millionaire! http://www.bikechatforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=234035


Last edited by Shaft on 23:23 - 15 Sep 2020; edited 1 time in total
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barryd
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PostPosted: 23:11 - 15 Sep 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shaft wrote:
barryd wrote:

Thanks,. This means nothing to me. Mechanics are not my thing at all. I presume though from a quick google of the parts these are to do with steering, front shocks / wheel? These are two old bikes, 2002 and 2004 probably much older than I would have wanted. If there is no history to indicate they have been done, is there a test I Can do to check if they are sound? Wobble the steering / wheel side to side, that kind of thing?

im wondering if I should go for something newer. My budget was up to 3500. I just read that they have super longevity these bikes and Im not bothered if its cosmetically perfect just as long as its reliable and fun to ride.

Ill test ride one tomorrow anyway. At least then Ill have an idea if its suitable even if I dont buy either.


Yup, head bearings are on the stem that the forks pivot on.

To Test, put the bike on the main stand and get the front wheel off the ground, either by using something heavy in the top box, or get the sales person to push down on the back of the bike.

Starting with the front wheel straight ahead, tap one bar end - you want the wheel to gently and smoothly fall in that direction, test both ways - if it's not smooth, or it won't fall at all, potentially the bearings have been overtightened, maybe to mask a failure.

Still at the bars, gently move them from side to side - if there is any notchiness just either side of straight ahead, the bearings are worn.

Now go to the front wheel and, with it still off the ground and pointing straight ahead, grab the bottom of the fork legs and gently pull/push them from front to back - if you feel movement from the top of the steering head (you will know it if you feel it) the bearings are worn.

If the sales person doesn't want to help you check, or the steering felt odd on the test ride, be suspicious.

The parts to do the job are not expensive (typically about 35 quid for a set of taper rollers) the cost is in the labour - all of the front fairing has to come off (which is easier than it looks, but still longwinded and tedious) and then the problems start, because the usual methods of removing the lower bearing race don't work.

It can't be punched out from above and a normal blind puller won't get at it from below, plus there is some suggestion Honda used thread locker when they installed them at the factory, just to make removing them that little bit harder.

There is a Honda special tool (there always is!) or I've seen people make up something involving bits of high strength steel bar, adding heat in the form of a blow torch and still struggling like buggery.

I've reached the conclusion that going straight to the nuclear option is the quickest way, Dremeling slots into the race then having at it with a hammer and chisel, but that's not very elegant; you will also be needing an awkwardly sized socket to do the whole plot up again.

Whatever way, doing the head bearings on a Silverwing is reputed to be the hardest single job on the whole bike (dropping the engine out is easier and quicker) so if you're going to have to pay someone to do it, make sure you factor that cost in.

Buying a newer/lower mileage one is no guarantee they aren't shot, reports are they go can go at well under 20K, so if there is no evidence they have ever been changed, or there is even the slightest hint of wear, you know what you need to do.

It will pay you to get into doing some home maintenance, head bearings aside, there's nothing terribly hard to do, even changing the drive belt (every 16K or so) isn't difficult and you will save yourself a decent chunk of money over time.


Thats really helpful thanks. Will print all this off and take it with me. Sadly there is no chance of me doing it myself, ever. Im pretty badly disabled with Arthritis, cant really bend down that well or stand for more than a couple of minutes. Decrepit before my time sadly but there you go. I can still ride an automatic scooter though. Had a 50 mile ride out on the vision two up today around the Dales and Swaledale. Great fun apart from some of the 15 and 20% climbs where the bike is down to 10mph flat out Very Happy Great on the twisties and flat though. Overtaking takes careful planning. Mr. Green
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Shaft
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PostPosted: 23:49 - 15 Sep 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

barryd wrote:

Thats really helpful thanks. Will print all this off and take it with me. Sadly there is no chance of me doing it myself, ever. Im pretty badly disabled with Arthritis, cant really bend down that well or stand for more than a couple of minutes. Decrepit before my time sadly but there you go. I can still ride an automatic scooter though. Had a 50 mile ride out on the vision two up today around the Dales and Swaledale. Great fun apart from some of the 15 and 20% climbs where the bike is down to 10mph flat out Very Happy Great on the twisties and flat though. Overtaking takes careful planning. Mr. Green


I think that's what I like about it.

There's all the practical crap like being able to get a week's shopping under the seat and in the top box, or the excellent weather protection, or the comfortable ergos, but it's the effortless way it performs that's the icing on the cake.

It really will get going when you want it to, you can get decently sticky rubber for it and you will learn very quickly that it can properly handle.

So you don't have to think about what gear you're in, going fast is just a flick of the wrist away and slowing down is more about how much pressure your forearms can stand (the linked brakes are brilliant, later ones will have ABS for added carefree riding) all you have to do is sit back and enjoy the ride.

It's probably the most relaxing bike I've ever ridden at speed, all you have to concentrate on is where you are on the road, relative to the next corner.
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Things get better with age; I'm close to being magnificent........
83 Z1100A3, 83 GS650 Katana, 02 FJS600 Silver Wing, 94 XJ900F (Sold)
WooHoo, I'm a Man Point Millionaire! http://www.bikechatforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=234035
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barryd
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PostPosted: 17:12 - 16 Sep 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

An update

Went to York today to try the Silverwing. Michelle looked a bit horrified when she saw it and it did look a bit daunting but we went out and gave it a half hour ride out over about 15 miles or so. It was like sitting in a flaming big arm chair compared to the tiny Vision. I was a bit put off by that at first and couldnt quite get the position I wanted which is a bit more forward and aggressive but I soon got used to it.

What a feckin hoot. On the dual carriageway once I got used to it I gave it the full beans and flaming hell, it hauled its lardy arse up the fast lane like a rocket ship (Well for a scooter at least). Cornered way better than I thought it would but its no sports bike of course. What I liked about it though was the fun factor, not having to worry about what gear to be in and that I could move my knackered legs about where I Wanted them.

"Shaft" I think you were spot on with your description.

However. The raised pillion was not much fun for Michelle. She reckoned she was a lot more buffeted than on the little Vision, her legs were uncomfortable against the side of the bike as its too wide and despite the fairing both of us decided we would get a bit weary doing a long stint on it which was kind of the point of getting one.

Bit torn now as I want one just for arsing about on but I can kind of do that on the Vision or a new vision. In the end I decided I might hold out for a local winter bargain mainly for myself but I reckon a big maxi scooter is the way to go.

They had a Honda X ADV 750 in as well which just looked Awesome, like something out of a Mad Max film but 7k and it wasnt even new.

I dont think there will be anything of that kind of power without the raised pillion sadly or a narrower body.
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Shaft
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PostPosted: 23:09 - 17 Sep 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

^^^^ Glad you enjoyed most of it, good fun aren't they!

TBH, I had a similar problem with the buffeting, it seemed like wherever I put my head it was in the jet stream and I felt like some sort of extended screen would do the trick.

Apparently the guys on the forum have had good results with Givi screens, there's another company that makes an adjustable flap that goes across the top of the standard screen and one guy made a similar thing from a cut down helmet visor.

In practice, after a couple of weeks I wasn't noticing it anymore, so I either subconsciously adjusted my position, or I just got used to it.

I'm about to replace my screen with another standard one, so if I can polish the old one enough to make it usable again, I might experiment with some sort of fabricated Gurney flap, see if it makes enough of a difference to be worthwhile.

As for your pillion problem, I can see where she's coming from, the seats on all of them do seem to assume a passenger isn't going to be taller than 3'6", but I haven't noticed that they are significantly wider than a normal bike - dumb question, but you did use the flip down pillion footrests, didn't you?

It sounds like you liked it enough to be tempted though, so I would suggest you do what I did and buy one cheapish, then either modify and improve it as you go, or get properly used to it (I don't think half an hour is near enough) and if you still like it and get used to stuff that seems different immediately, trade up to a better one.
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barryd
Nova Slayer



Joined: 31 Aug 2010
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PostPosted: 23:18 - 17 Sep 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shaft wrote:
^^^^ Glad you enjoyed most of it, good fun aren't they!

TBH, I had a similar problem with the buffeting, it seemed like wherever I put my head it was in the jet stream and I felt like some sort of extended screen would do the trick.

Apparently the guys on the forum have had good results with Givi screens, there's another company that makes an adjustable flap that goes across the top of the standard screen and one guy made a similar thing from a cut down helmet visor.

In practice, after a couple of weeks I wasn't noticing it anymore, so I either subconsciously adjusted my position, or I just got used to it.

I'm about to replace my screen with another standard one, so if I can polish the old one enough to make it usable again, I might experiment with some sort of fabricated Gurney flap, see if it makes enough of a difference to be worthwhile.

As for your pillion problem, I can see where she's coming from, the seats on all of them do seem to assume a passenger isn't going to be taller than 3'6", but I haven't noticed that they are significantly wider than a normal bike - dumb question, but you did use the flip down pillion footrests, didn't you?

It sounds like you liked it enough to be tempted though, so I would suggest you do what I did and buy one cheapish, then either modify and improve it as you go, or get properly used to it (I don't think half an hour is near enough) and if you still like it and get used to stuff that seems different immediately, trade up to a better one.


I wonder if the screen actually makes things worse for the pillion. If it was possible (not sure if it is) I would take it off. I think a half hour test ride was useful. A lot of places I phoned wouldnt allow a test ride at all! Ill see what comes up over the winter but I dont hold out much hope as they are few and far between. I might try a couple of traditional bikes though. Maybe go for 600 to 750 twins. Now I know I can handle and push around a heavy bike I am not so worried.
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