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Setting Up Carbs & EGT

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JackButler
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PostPosted: 03:30 - 18 Mar 2021    Post subject: Setting Up Carbs & EGT Reply with quote

I'm fettling my other wumman for a hard season of pure sexual abuse & treated myself to yet another tool for the workshop.

I bought one of those IR thermometers to aid in setting up the carbs fuel/air mixture but don't seem to get any sense out of the readings.

I know the thermo is fairly accurate, it registers boiling water at 100deg & ice at 0ish deg, but I don't seem to be able to get all four pipes at the same temp?

Will this ever work properly with OEM dual skin downpipes????
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bikenut
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PostPosted: 08:58 - 18 Mar 2021    Post subject: T Reply with quote

When engine has been running for a while, how cold are the carb bodies, consider carb warmers with may be fitted to yours...
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redeem ouzzer
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PostPosted: 09:41 - 18 Mar 2021    Post subject: Re: Setting Up Carbs & EGT Reply with quote

JackButler wrote:
I'm fettling my other wumman for a hard season of pure sexual abuse & treated myself to yet another tool for the workshop.

I bought one of those IR thermometers to aid in setting up the carbs fuel/air mixture but don't seem to get any sense out of the readings.

I know the thermo is fairly accurate, it registers boiling water at 100deg & ice at 0ish deg, but I don't seem to be able to get all four pipes at the same temp?

Will this ever work properly with OEM dual skin downpipes????


Just go to dyno and get it done properly you greedy twat. How the fuck do you think you can set AFR accurately using an IR thermometer?
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martin734
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PostPosted: 11:04 - 18 Mar 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

I use a two-gas exhaust gas analyser and an air flow meter to set up the carbs on my bike.
I set up a baseline for the carbs, making sure that each carb has the same idle screw setting, same mixture screw setting and same airflow. I dismantle each exhaust to the collector box and stick the EGA probe into the downpipe. I do two tests, one at idle and one at 2000 rpm. The values I set my bike to are 0.45% CO and less than 35ppm HC at both idle and 2000 rpm.
CO values higher than 1%-1.5% indicate an engine that is running too rich. HC values higher than 40-45 ppm indicate unburnt fuel in the exhaust gas due to misfire.
No doubt some people will say that you are supposed to use a 5 gas analyser, for best accuracy and precision but for making sure your carbs are reasonably in tune I find a 2 gas analyser is fine. You can get a basic but accurate 2 gas analyser for about £150 and a carb airflow meter for less than £40.
I have never heard of setting up carbs with exhaust temp alone, I can't see that it would be that accurate as there are many variables that can affect the exhaust temperature. It can be used as an indicator that something might be wrong with a particular cylinder or carb, but I doubt it can be solely used to set up a carb.
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 13:04 - 18 Mar 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

IR thermometers read the frequency of the infra red coming off a surface. If the surface is reflective, the temperature reading is not necessarily the temperature of the surface itself.
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Robby
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PostPosted: 15:05 - 18 Mar 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

This post is pretty much why people shouldn't go fiddling with fuelling if they have no idea what they are doing.

Leave it stock, or get it set up on a dyno. Anything else and you'll just make it worse.
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JackButler
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PostPosted: 18:28 - 18 Mar 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

stinkwheel wrote:
IR thermometers read the frequency of the infra red coming off a surface. If the surface is reflective, the temperature reading is not necessarily the temperature of the surface itself.


That would explain it then, a few experiments & bingo, it isn't accurately reporting because it can't possibly accurately report.

Borrowed a mates 'touch' thermometer & all pipes indicate the same'ish temps.

This is after setting up my carbs using my years of experience, reading the plugs & my keen ear for a healthy motor. Makes you wonder what we did in the days before (mostly innaccurate) digital measuring devices . . .

Oh, BTW. If you think I have no idea of what I'm doing then "why don't you come up & see me some time"?
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 18:38 - 18 Mar 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

JackButler wrote:

Makes you wonder what we did in the days before (mostly innaccurate) digital measuring devices . . .


We used highly accurate, analogue measuring devices.

But progress...

People used to set up exhausts with a wax crayon.
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“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.
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martin734
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PostPosted: 18:53 - 18 Mar 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

JackButler wrote:
stinkwheel wrote:
IR thermometers read the frequency of the infra red coming off a surface. If the surface is reflective, the temperature reading is not necessarily the temperature of the surface itself.


That would explain it then, a few experiments & bingo, it isn't accurately reporting because it can't possibly accurately report.

Borrowed a mates 'touch' thermometer & all pipes indicate the same'ish temps.

This is after setting up my carbs using my years of experience, reading the plugs & my keen ear for a healthy motor. Makes you wonder what we did in the days before (mostly innaccurate) digital measuring devices . . .

Oh, BTW. If you think I have no idea of what I'm doing then "why don't you come up & see me some time"?

It's funny, but my inaccurate digital measuring device gives exactly the same emissions readings as the MOT test centre's equipment. Amazing that they are both inaccurate by exactly the same degree. Rolling Eyes
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Easy-X
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PostPosted: 18:55 - 18 Mar 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

And, pray tell, is the model of motorbike being discussed here?
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JackButler
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PostPosted: 18:58 - 18 Mar 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

stinkwheel wrote:


We used highly accurate, analogue measuring devices.

But progress...

People used to set up exhausts with a wax crayon.


I grew up a few doors down from a very underrated 500GP rider & he was/is like a BIG brother to me. When it got to serious business with him in his career, he kind of pushed us all to one side, which was/is totally unnatural behaviour for someone who was always described as "the nicest bloke in the paddock".

I once sat quietly in the back of his workshop & watched him while he stripped & rebuilt 5million quids worth of HRC's bestest effort.

In all my years I've never met anyone else who could tune & balance carbs by ear & beat even the most expensive of equipment . . .
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Kawasaki Jimbo
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PostPosted: 19:00 - 18 Mar 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

martin734 wrote:
It's funny, but my inaccurate digital measuring device gives exactly the same emissions readings as the MOT test centre's equipment. Amazing that they are both inaccurate by exactly the same degree. Rolling Eyes

A bad workman blames his tools, hence JackButler, when he’s not busy calling people stupid or bragging about some imaginary aspect of his life, can’t even take technical advice with good grace.
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Easy-X
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PostPosted: 00:58 - 19 Mar 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm starting to wonder if there's a real bike in this story or whether this is just a vehicle to punt out some bollox Thinking
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 13:27 - 19 Mar 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd be surprised of anyone could balance carbs more accurately by ear than by using a manometer.
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“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.
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The last post was made 5 years, 12 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful?
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