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New biker at 48 advice please! !!

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Diggs
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PostPosted: 17:55 - 22 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nobby the Bastard wrote:
I don't get why people have the thing about countersteering.

If you can cycle, you do it automatically. Thats how you go round corners.


You don't need to force it, the only people who consciously do it deliberately are racers to get into the corner faster.

Absolutely of no use on the road.


I disagree. Take a big bike, fully laden with camping gear and someone on the back around a few tight bends and countersteering is something that happens naturally because it is easier to ride that way.
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 14:32 - 23 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Never guaranteed to not drop a bike at any point in your riding 'career', whether it be overzealousness with the throttle, or not putting the stand down properly, or some other silly mistake. Granted you're less likely to make the silly mistakes when you're more experienced, but they can still happen.

Never dropped my first big bike, although came close a couple of times. Get what you want, but if it has a lot of power, be respectful of that.

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A100man
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PostPosted: 20:30 - 23 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

He guys, OP - he gawn!

PS Counter steer blah blah.. shite. I never even heard the term until i stumbled across a post on here. FortNine = click bait bollocks. and yes i have been to the pub - so what?
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ThunderGuts
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PostPosted: 14:34 - 24 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nobby the Bastard wrote:
ThunderGuts wrote:


3) Get yourself a middleweight naked bike, £2k-3k at most, less than 80bhp ideally and ABS is a bonus as with a new rider it's all too easy to grab a handful of brake



I do take issue with this. Learn to use brakes properly or don't do it at all.

I absolutely hate the principle of linked brakes for the same reason. I want to chose how much front and back brake I use based on the surface I see in front of me.

When filtering, quite often you find yourself on grit and so I do not, under any circumstances, want my front brake to activate when I'm using the rear brake.


I don't disagree about learning to use the brakes, but there's still every chance that one day (experienced or not) there is a need to brake (and brake hard) on a slippery surface . . . on that day, ABS could make the difference between stopping safely or binning it.
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Abaaba
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PostPosted: 09:49 - 25 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

ThunderGuts wrote:
As per all of the above really. Enjoy the learning process, but getting your licence is just opening the door to a whole load of other learning. As said, the requirements of the test are all about "by the book" riding and don't necessarily correlate to the "best" riding; just do exactly as your instructors say until you've got your licence, then think about other things. You won't necessarily drop your bike, but it's most probable early on, particularly if it's top-heavy. You think you know what you want, you'll buy it and you'll think you've got what you want, but sometime down the line (probably 6-12 months) you'll start to realise you want something else.

1) CBT then DAS so you can get yourself a bike capable of living in traffic and with enough go for you to learn on (as opposed to a 125 which you'll be wringing the neck off all the time and you can almost handle like a bicycle) - you will find two camps on this though, some will suggest riding around on a CBT for a while, others (me included) straight to DAS. You presumably drive and know how a road "functions", so I'd just go straight for it

2) Follow the instructions of the instructor to the letter until you've got the licence

3) Get yourself a middleweight naked bike, £2k-3k at most, less than 80bhp ideally and ABS is a bonus as with a new rider it's all too easy to grab a handful of brake

4) Ride it and learn it, then you can start thinking about further training and what bike you really want

My 2p worth, but it's pretty much what I did.


You have described exactly the route I am on now after starting and passing not so long ago Thumbs Up

As long as you remember you know nothing and passing is just the first step with so many training afterwards then you shall be alright Smile
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Abaaba
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PostPosted: 09:54 - 25 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

ThunderGuts wrote:
As per all of the above really. Enjoy the learning process, but getting your licence is just opening the door to a whole load of other learning. As said, the requirements of the test are all about "by the book" riding and don't necessarily correlate to the "best" riding; just do exactly as your instructors say until you've got your licence, then think about other things. You won't necessarily drop your bike, but it's most probable early on, particularly if it's top-heavy. You think you know what you want, you'll buy it and you'll think you've got what you want, but sometime down the line (probably 6-12 months) you'll start to realise you want something else.

1) CBT then DAS so you can get yourself a bike capable of living in traffic and with enough go for you to learn on (as opposed to a 125 which you'll be wringing the neck off all the time and you can almost handle like a bicycle) - you will find two camps on this though, some will suggest riding around on a CBT for a while, others (me included) straight to DAS. You presumably drive and know how a road "functions", so I'd just go straight for it

2) Follow the instructions of the instructor to the letter until you've got the licence

3) Get yourself a middleweight naked bike, £2k-3k at most, less than 80bhp ideally and ABS is a bonus as with a new rider it's all too easy to grab a handful of brake

4) Ride it and learn it, then you can start thinking about further training and what bike you really want

My 2p worth, but it's pretty much what I did.


You have described exactly the route I am on now after starting and passing not so long ago Thumbs Up

As long as you remember you know nothing and passing is just the first step with so many training afterwards then you shall be alright Smile
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grr666
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PostPosted: 10:34 - 25 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

ThunderGuts wrote:

I don't disagree about learning to use the brakes, but there's still every chance that one day (experienced or not) there is a need to brake (and brake hard) on a slippery surface . . . on that day, ABS could make the difference between stopping safely or binning it.

I made absolutely certain that my first big bike had no ABS for the reasons Nobby stated. I have ABS on the current
bike and to be honest it's a little intrusive, coming in way before grip has been exceeded in warm, dry conditions ( I only
ride on sunny days because I have the ghey). Maybe it would be useful in cold, wet or slippery conditions but that's why I pay to
run a car and van, to avoid those entirely...
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Freddyfruitba...
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PostPosted: 12:38 - 25 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

grr666 wrote:
I have ABS on the current bike and to be honest it's a little intrusive, coming in way before grip has been exceeded

In my 5-6 years/25,000 miles of born-again-bikership I've only ever had ABS bikes (it didn't even exist on bikes first-time around) I'm pretty sure the only time I've actually triggered the ABS was testing it in a car park to see how it felt.

I must have the ghey too then, I guess.
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PotatoHead202...
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PostPosted: 12:59 - 26 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nobby the Bastard wrote:
ThunderGuts wrote:


3) Get yourself a middleweight naked bike, £2k-3k at most, less than 80bhp ideally and ABS is a bonus as with a new rider it's all too easy to grab a handful of brake



I do take issue with this. Learn to use brakes properly or don't do it at all.

I absolutely hate the principle of linked brakes for the same reason. I want to chose how much front and back brake I use based on the surface I see in front of me.

When filtering, quite often you find yourself on grit and so I do not, under any circumstances, want my front brake to activate when I'm using the rear brake.


That's absolute nonsense. You can learn to brake properly with an ABS system. If the ABS activates you can be pretty dam sure you would have locked the brakes otherwise. Practically all new bikes above 125cc have it now and there are loads of options on older, cheaper bikes with it. Like it or not it IS a life saving device - and quite frankly - especially as a new rider or a commuter - you'd be stupid to choose a bike without it. The odd professional, in perfect circumstances, can (very rarely) out-brake it but you sure as shit can't guarantee you can on a wet commute after a long, tiring day.

I partially dislike linked brakes due to the rear activating the front which can make feet up U Turns difficult.
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Fat Angry Scotsman
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PostPosted: 13:05 - 26 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

PotatoHead2020 wrote:
That's absolute nonsense. You can learn to brake properly with an ABS system. If the ABS activates you can be pretty dam sure you would have locked the brakes otherwise. Practically all new bikes above 125cc have it now and there are loads of options on older, cheaper bikes with it. Like it or not it IS a life saving device - and quite frankly - especially as a new rider or a commuter - you'd be stupid to choose a bike without it. The odd professional in perfect circumstances can out-brake it but you sure as shit can't guarantee you can on a wet commute after a long, tiring day.

I partially dislike linked brakes due to the rear activating the front which can make feet up U Turns difficult.


My little Chinese 125 (Zontes ZT125-U) has ABS instead of linked brakes and I felt it really helped when I was riding it in slush and snow last winter. My ER6-F doesn't have ABS and thankfully this year the winter has been extremely mild so far.

I've had to brake hard on both bikes in dry conditions and apart from the Kwak having much more powerful brakes I never saw the need for ABS. Riding the little 125 in slush the ABS kicked in a few times, I find it's a really weird feeling when it happens.
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jeffyjeff
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PostPosted: 03:24 - 27 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fat Angry Scotsman wrote:
I've had to brake hard on both bikes in dry conditions and apart from the Kwak having much more powerful brakes I never saw the need for ABS.

Man, I thought like you for years...decades. From 1976 to 1995 my main ride had drum brakes on both wheels. I thought, "shit, I'm an experienced rider. Who needs ABS? ABS is for pansies." I took advanced rider training with the local Motor Officers, I practiced emergency stops until I was confident in my skills.

One day out of the blue, the stars aligned for one brief millisecond. As I was merging my VFR onto an urban motorway, someone in an Accord suddenly realized she was about to pass her exit, and nose-dived her car across 3 lanes of traffic, straight across my path. I hammered both brakes. Too much front brake-too quickly. I remember thinking "Wow, the forks never compressed this much before!" as the front wheel washed out to the right and I went down hard on my left side at 65 mph.

Next thing I remember is an ant's view of the motorway and traffic backed up as far as I could see. A patrol officer knocking on my helmet, "Anybody home?" "Is there anybody in there?"

They towed my bike away and an ambulance carted me off. The attendant said, "You were born again today, man." At the hospital, the doctor ran me through concussion protocol and treated me for a fractured shoulder blade. As we parted, he said, "You were born again today."

Needless to say, I am now a believer in ABS. When that instant comes, reaction time and instinct kick knowledge and training to the curb. ABS is not a panacea, but I believe it is the next best thing.

06 March 2016; my second birthday.
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Last edited by jeffyjeff on 15:59 - 27 Jan 2022; edited 1 time in total
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Fat Angry Scotsman
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PostPosted: 11:56 - 27 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

jeffyjeff wrote:
06 March 2016; my second birthday.


I came on here to sip a coffee, chill and catch up on bike shenanigans before heading on to 9gag for memes. Reading that was fucking harrowing mate. Pale
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jeffyjeff
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PostPosted: 19:06 - 27 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fat Angry Scotsman wrote:
Reading that was fucking harrowing mate. Pale

Sorry for that, man. The experience was harrowing for me, too. For me, the reward is worth the risk. Motorbikes are my fountain of youth. At 68, riding my bike makes me feel 18 again, and occasionally lets the hooligan in me loose Wink Sadly, you can do everything right, by the book, and still get squashed like a bug. It's the risk we take every time we throw a leg over. Personally, more than worth it. Ride safe, bro. Rubber side down.
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 19:09 - 27 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Meh, I locked up the front wheel of my FZ750 on the fast lane of the M5 doing about 65.

Slid to a halt on the central reservation. All the trafiic stopped so I ran across to the bike in the middle of the motorway and picked it up and pushed it over to hard shoulder.

Restarted it after a couple of minutes and rode back home.
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deadbat
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PostPosted: 22:37 - 28 Jan 2022    Post subject: Re: New biker at 48 advice please! !! Reply with quote

CormacBaptiste wrote:
Hi. My CBT is booked for April 14th. I'm a 48 year old guy with very little riding experience. Soaking up YouTube videos at the moment. Loving the look of the BMW F750gs as my first bike. Getting a Nivala jacket and pilot gloves. Very excited to start this new (midlife!) chapter in my life... going through cancer treatment so want something to be excited about. Looking forward to chatting with you and hearing advice etc. Many thanks. JC


I would say have fun doing CBT and DAS. Make sure you find good riding school, as it is all about confidence imo. If you have good instructors you will have no issues with Mod1 & Mod2.

And "don't buy new" mantra I call BS. Do a few test rides and buy what you like. Don't worry about dropping your bike, don't think about it. Just enjoy it and ride safe.
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deadbat
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PostPosted: 22:42 - 28 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

jeffyjeff wrote:
Man, I thought like you for years...decades. From 1976 to 1995 my main ride had drum brakes on both wheels. I thought, "shit, I'm an experienced rider. Who needs ABS? ABS is for pansies." I took advanced rider training with the local Motor Officers, I practiced emergency stops until I was confident in my skills.

One day out of the blue, the stars aligned for one brief millisecond. As I was merging my VFR onto an urban motorway, someone in an Accord suddenly realized she was about to pass her exit, and nose-dived her car across 3 lanes of traffic, straight across my path. I hammered both brakes. Too much front brake-too quickly. I remember thinking "Wow, the forks never compressed this much before!" as the front wheel washed out to the right and I went down hard on my left side at 65 mph.

Next thing I remember is an ant's view of the motorway and traffic backed up as far as I could see. A patrol officer knocking on my helmet, "Anybody home?" "Is there anybody in there?"

They towed my bike away and an ambulance carted me off. The attendant said, "You were born again today, man." At the hospital, the doctor ran me through concussion protocol and treated me for a fractured shoulder blade. As we parted, he said, "You were born again today."

Needless to say, I am now a believer in ABS. When that instant comes, reaction time and instinct kick knowledge and training to the curb. ABS is not a panacea, but I believe it is the next best thing.

06 March 2016; my second birthday.


I don't understand why some see ABS as a bad thing.
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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha
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PostPosted: 06:41 - 29 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

there's some evidence that stopping distances are shorter without ABS in some conditions with some riders - not me though, I admit!

also, some ABS systems can be an absolute bastard to fettle
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Abaaba
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PostPosted: 07:06 - 29 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

deadbat wrote:

I don't understand why some see ABS as a bad thing.


I don't know why but as a new rider I was told ABS is my friend and I rather have it and NOT need it than need it and NOT have it.
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Easy-X
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PostPosted: 13:16 - 29 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

ABS, while a good thing on its own, represents the start of the "driver aids" creeping in on vehicles. Manualists* would prefer to ride their bike than merely direct it.

*21st Century neo-luddites.
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 13:23 - 29 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

ABS is a good idea but it does mean someone who has always relied on ABS won't necessarily develop the skill to ride one without ABS.

Linked brakes, on other had, are the devils work and whomever thought them up should be given several stout kicks to the testes every day.
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Abaaba
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PostPosted: 20:41 - 29 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nobby the Bastard wrote:
ABS is a good idea but it does mean someone who has always relied on ABS won't necessarily develop the skill to ride one without ABS.

Linked brakes, on other had, are the devils work and whomever thought them up should be given several stout kicks to the testes every day.


You assuming the inventor was a MAN!! #Not Cool Very Happy
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Zen Dog
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PostPosted: 15:31 - 30 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nobby the Bastard wrote:
Linked brakes, on other had, are the devils work and whomever thought them up should be given several stout kicks to the testes every day.


Agreed. When I first bought the VFR800, the back brake was great, but the front was squidgy as hell. After much fettling and multiple rounds of bleeding, front brake is better, and the back is a bit squidgy and 60% of the force seems to go to the front. I'm just living with it, but what is the fucking point! Evil or Very Mad I considered getting braided hoses at one point. For the linked brake system I think there are 17 separate hoses or something equally bloody stupid. Shocked
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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha
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PostPosted: 17:27 - 30 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hel do a de-linking kit for the bird - probably for the viffer to
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jeffyjeff
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PostPosted: 20:31 - 30 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

trevor saxe-coburg-gotha wrote:
Hel do a de-linking kit for the bird - probably for the viffer to

Do you really want to do that? Won't you then assume liability for altering OEM design? Improvement or not, I know that if I were the victim in an accident where the other party altered their brake system from OE standard, my attorney would be all over that! The burden would then be on the other guy to prove that his/her alteration was indeed an improvement.

I think some riders are quick to modify their bikes without thinking through potential consequence.
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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha
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PostPosted: 21:23 - 30 Jan 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

irony is that de-linked set up is hugely easier to service and bleed up so for those who actually bother to service their brakes regularly, their bikes may well have more stopping power
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