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Monarchy, yes or no?

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Keep the monarchy or retire it and become a republic?
Yes, God bless 'em, long live the King etc.
60%
 60%  [ 29 ]
No, etc
39%
 39%  [ 19 ]
Total Votes : 48

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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 12:33 - 27 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Polarbear wrote:
The EU heirachy is not elected by the plebs but lots of people think we should be back under their control.


And lot's of people don't. I find it's odd that some would rail against the EU on the grounds it's an assault on our democracy but then fall to their knees at the site of a toff on a gold painted chair.
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 12:59 - 27 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ribenapigeon wrote:
the EU


Harmful.

Quote:
a toff on a gold painted chair.


Harmless.

How many people do you think you have convinced since you started this thread?
How many do you think you CAN convince?
Give it up, you'll get nowhere.
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 13:30 - 27 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

chickenstrip wrote:
Ribenapigeon wrote:
the EU


Harmful.

Quote:
a toff on a gold painted chair.


Harmless.


Exactly. Those non elected EU bureaucrats can have a huge effect on the people under thier overbearing umbrella. Charlie on his golden throne, bugger all.
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Kawasaki Jimbo
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PostPosted: 13:42 - 27 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Comparing the two Parliaments, you could say that the unelected Commission of the EU creates EU law and asks the elected EU Parliament to rubber-stamp it.*

The House of Commons creates UK law and asks the Lords to rubber-stamp it.

Both ‘upper houses’ can send it back for reconsideration and revision, but the laws and policies are driven by the lower houses, and of those only the UK’s is elected.

*Generally if it means ‘more EU’ it’ll go through.
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 14:59 - 27 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

The EU Commission has become steadily more and more overbearing, using threats of punishment for those states that don't fall into line. That doesn't seem very democratic to me.
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 17:44 - 27 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

chickenstrip wrote:


How many people do you think you have convinced since you started this thread?
How many do you think you CAN convince?
Give it up, you'll get nowhere.


It was created as a poll for it's own sake. Im pretty sure people are quite secure in their views either way. How many people do you think you've convinced of your position since the poll was launched?
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 17:47 - 27 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

chickenstrip wrote:
The EU Commission has become steadily more and more overbearing, using threats of punishment for those states that don't fall into line. That doesn't seem very democratic to me.


I wonder if his majesty King Chik exports his sausages to the EU?
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 17:51 - 27 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

History tells us that it's the germans and the Greeks that export their royal sausages to us.
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 18:19 - 27 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ribenapigeon wrote:
chickenstrip wrote:


How many people do you think you have convinced since you started this thread?
How many do you think you CAN convince?
Give it up, you'll get nowhere.


It was created as a poll for it's own sake. Im pretty sure people are quite secure in their views either way. How many people do you think you've convinced of your position since the poll was launched?


Fair enough, but I don't think we're going to hear anything new. And no, I probably haven't convinced anyone of my view, but I'm not desperate to try either.
I'm happy with the monarchy as things stand. I just see more value to it than the surface.
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Easy-X
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PostPosted: 19:57 - 27 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nobby the Bastard wrote:
History tells us that it's the germans and the Greeks that export their royal sausages to us.


TBF Germans do a better job of sausages and no one would turn down a decent Greek kebab (not the "slowly rotating elephant's leg" most of us resort to on a Saturday night, that's Turkish.)

Anyhoo, I think we can strike the word "democracy" out of this discussion seeing as Italy just had a go at it and got it so wrong the EU shat the bed.
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 07:12 - 28 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Easy-X wrote:


Anyhoo, I think we can strike the word "democracy" out of this discussion seeing as Italy just had a go at it and got it so wrong the EU shat the bed.


Her little bambinos aren't going to inherit her position though.
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 11:04 - 28 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not seeing a good argument for why we should give more power to politicians.
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 11:17 - 28 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm very much of the idea that a politician should have done something worthwile before they bocome politicians. Whether that be run a company, be a teacher, work in the NHS or whatever. Just something that gives them an insight of life in the real world.

I don't know if it would make much difference but it's got to be a better idea than having people stright from an (f)arts degree at uni with all their batsh1t theoretical ideas and on good MP's salaries not having a clue about Joe from Rochdales' woes.
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 11:19 - 28 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tbh, I don't have much confidence in the electorate either Laughing
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 13:07 - 28 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

chickenstrip wrote:
Tbh, I don't have much confidence in the electorate either Laughing


Well no, neither do I but short of scrapping the 1 person 1 vote what the hell are you going to do? I'd go for the minimum !Q but can you imagine embarresment for the country when 2/3 of the population failed to make it. Laughing Fcuk, I doubt if some of the politicians scrape an IQ of 100.

Would proper PR make a worthwhile difference? I don't know enough about it really to make an observation.
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 13:39 - 28 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Polarbear wrote:


Well no, neither do I but short of scrapping the 1 person 1 vote what the hell are you going to do?


Not rely on politics to make life worthwhile, and vote for anything that keeps politicians securely at arm's length.
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Islander
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PostPosted: 15:10 - 28 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Polarbear wrote:


Would proper PR make a worthwhile difference? I don't know enough about it really to make an observation.


Yes it would IMO, as long as it was single transferable vote (STV) rather than the additional member system (AMS). STV allows the voter to rank their votes on a list of candidates so, for example, if there are seven candidates and you prefer three of them then you can rank them 1 2 and 3 - right down to 7 if you prefer although you don't have to. They run the votes through an algorithm that weeds out the lower votes over a few passes and you have a candidate elected.

I don't see it gaining any popularity in parliament though because it really does give the voter far more power over who is elected and would probably wreck the party system. All points that are firmly in its favour but equally points that politicians heavily invested in party dogma universally hate. Laughing
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 18:36 - 28 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Polarbear wrote:
I'm very much of the idea that a politician should have done something worthwile before they bocome politicians. Whether that be run a company, be a teacher, work in the NHS or whatever. Just something that gives them an insight of life in the real world.

I don't know if it would make much difference but it's got to be a better idea than having people stright from an (f)arts degree at uni with all their batsh1t theoretical ideas and on good MP's salaries not having a clue about Joe from Rochdales' woes.


Most politicians seem to have either a law background or a PPE (politics, philosophy and economics) degree. The form seems to be, go to the right university, study PPE, join the student union as a right or left wing activist then go and "work" in a union or a think tank then get a post as an assistant/sex slave to an MP then if you have the right stuff you get a shot at becoming an MP but maybe doing a trial run as a local councilor first.
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 18:38 - 28 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

chickenstrip wrote:
Tbh, I don't have much confidence in the electorate either Laughing


Well, you are one of them Laughing
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 18:58 - 28 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ribenapigeon wrote:
chickenstrip wrote:
Tbh, I don't have much confidence in the electorate either Laughing


Well, you are one of them Laughing


Exactly! Laughing
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Easy-X
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PostPosted: 19:59 - 28 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Islander wrote:
I don't see it gaining any popularity in parliament though because it really does give the voter far more power over who is elected and would probably wreck the party system. All points that are firmly in its favour but equally points that politicians heavily invested in party dogma universally hate. Laughing


Turkeys voting for Christmas Smile The electorate are unqualified to vote and that's the way the politicians like it: manipulation of the easily confused.

Back in the day before all this Universal Suffrage stupidity it was only landowners that got the vote (mostly but not necessarily just men.) I'm not sure what sort of contemporary metric would equate. Probably easier to draw up a long list of disqualifications: prisoners, mentally ill, religious zealots... ermm... actors Very Happy
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 21:43 - 28 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glad to see that is the fucking shit show that the current tory offering is being treated as such.

IMF, bank of england and world markets all think its shit.

How socialist of them to expect the 600k in the UK in that bracket to keep paying an extra 5% tax.
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 21:48 - 28 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just as a reminder, the last time we had to go cap in hand to the IMF the result was right to buy and no more council houses.

Expect to sacrifice your first born this time.
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 21:55 - 28 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nobby the Bastard wrote:
Just as a reminder, the last time we had to go cap in hand to the IMF the result was right to buy and no more council houses.

Expect to sacrifice your first born this time.


Thank god we have King Chik our young and lusty new Monarch of our hearts to save the day.
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Easy-X
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PostPosted: 22:14 - 28 Sep 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote

This "tax the rich" mantra bores me, it smacks of another große Lüge Thinking

Could someone point me at an economic analysis that irrefutably proves "tax the rich" always nets more receipts for HMRC? The Orangutan cut taxes when he got in and apparently government income went up.

I'd hazard that inflation is much more important at this point as effectively it's a tax on everyone and everything.
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