Resend my activation email : Register : Log in 
BCF: Bike Chat Forums


Triumph looking worried by RE?

Reply to topic
Bike Chat Forums Index -> Biking News & Rumours Goto page Previous  1, 2
View previous topic : View next topic  
Author Message

Mawsley
Traffic Copper



Joined: 07 Apr 2016
Karma :

PostPosted: 13:22 - 26 Oct 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wonder how any Triumphs get sold, I've either been ignored or experienced complete disinterest when looking around for a bike to buy.

Conversely, our local Enfield dealer is the most welcoming place - thrusting a coffee into your hands the minute you walk through the door.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

om15
Nova Slayer



Joined: 12 Aug 2018
Karma :

PostPosted: 12:39 - 28 Oct 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Over the years I have owned five Hinckley Triumphs, a Trident 900, 790 Bonneville, T100, Adventurer and Street Twin, after 20 years I thought would try something else and had a RE Classic 500 (not bad), Himalayan (very good), Intercepter (pretty poor) and Classic 350 (very ordinary).
I found that Royal Enfields in general were heavy, under powered, poor brakes and suspension and very cheap consumables (brake pads, fork oil and battery), build quality isn't very good and dealer servicing ( to keep warranty valid) is very expensive. They are very popular and people are happy to live with the shortcoming for the price.
I sold the Classic 350 because it was very, very dull and had about as much charisma as a mobility tricycle.
After a great deal of thought I came to the decision that I much preferred the early carb Bonneville to the modern Royal Enfields, I luckily found a very low mileage good condition 2001 790 Bonneville, excellent build quality, no EFI, ABS, mode selectors and so on, very happy to return to Triumphs.
____________________
Alcohol doesn't solve problems, but neither does milk
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Polarbear
Super Spammer



Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Karma :

PostPosted: 12:29 - 30 Oct 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mawsley wrote:
I wonder how any Triumphs get sold, I've either been ignored or experienced complete disinterest when looking around for a bike to buy.

Conversely, our local Enfield dealer is the most welcoming place - thrusting a coffee into your hands the minute you walk through the door.


Our Triumph dealer in Wobern has got the sales pitch right in my view. Can I help you Sir? Just looking? Please shout me if you need any help.

I don't like people hanging over me or trying to strike up a conversation when I'm just looking around but conversly I expect them to be watching in case i do need any help.
____________________
Triumph Trophy Launch Edition
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail You must be logged in to rate posts

Mawsley
Traffic Copper



Joined: 07 Apr 2016
Karma :

PostPosted: 12:35 - 30 Oct 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

om15 wrote:
Over the years I have owned five Hinckley Triumphs, a Trident 900, 790 Bonneville, T100, Adventurer and Street Twin, after 20 years I thought would try something else and had a RE Classic 500 (not bad), Himalayan (very good), Intercepter (pretty poor) and Classic 350 (very ordinary).
I found that Royal Enfields in general were heavy, under powered, poor brakes and suspension and very cheap consumables (brake pads, fork oil and battery), build quality isn't very good and dealer servicing ( to keep warranty valid) is very expensive. They are very popular and people are happy to live with the shortcoming for the price.
I sold the Classic 350 because it was very, very dull and had about as much charisma as a mobility tricycle.
After a great deal of thought I came to the decision that I much preferred the early carb Bonneville to the modern Royal Enfields, I luckily found a very low mileage good condition 2001 790 Bonneville, excellent build quality, no EFI, ABS, mode selectors and so on, very happy to return to Triumphs.


Conversely, I think the Interceptor is built to a high standard and is a fun bike to ride - albeit with an OEM seat that taxed my arse. And, when it only cost £5500 for the chrome tank version, offered decent VFM. The sound of a set of liberated pipes is golden. It also delivers the concept of an old British twin far better than anything Triumph has managed in recent times imo.

The Himmy on the other hand, despite being exceptionally affordable, combined discomfort with a top heavy lacklustre offroad ability. Still had a decent build quality though.

But, yes, the servicing charges are horrific considering how easy it is to access everything on the engine. In no small part this has contributed to me shifting them on...but then our local Triumph dealer may as well wear a mask and wave a flintlock about because their servicing prices are equally stupid.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

om15
Nova Slayer



Joined: 12 Aug 2018
Karma :

PostPosted: 14:42 - 31 Oct 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

I bought a new Baker Express, first job was to replace the huge cat exhausts with TEC pipes and fit a DNA filter, this made the bike go well and sound nice, I improved the suspension by stripping the forks and fitting YSS emulators and pre load adjusters and replaced the rear shocks with IKONs, this did improve matters, and I also replaced the brake pads with items that worked. I fitted some nice accessories, a sump guard, fly screen and fork gaiters.
The bike looked great, but I still compared it unfavourably with the Bonneville, it didn't handle as well and I found it uncomfortable after an hour or so.
It is value for money, but I would rather pay a little more and get something better, with the slower Royal Enfields (Classic 350, 500, Himalayan) it is acceptable to ride a bike with poor handling, suspension and brakes when you are in the 40-60 mph range, but with the Interceptor you are in the 60-80 mph range and need something better.
____________________
Alcohol doesn't solve problems, but neither does milk
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

stinkwheel
Bovine Proctologist



Joined: 12 Jul 2004
Karma :

PostPosted: 16:11 - 31 Oct 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the problem the retro enfields have is they are actually like the originals in terms of performance and character. It turns out this isn't what people who want a retro bike are after. What they want is a bike that looks like the original but has the performance of a modern one.

What the Enfields give you is a bike that does everything the original did but much more reliably with working brakes, lights and charging system and no need to get the spanners out every couple of weeks.

What Triumph give you is a modern motorcycle that looks superficially like an original triumph.

I rode a 350 classic for a couple of weeks recently. I agree it's pretty dull, but was also entirely competant and capable, it never missed a beat and I put a few thousand miles on it. Performance was comparable with my pre-unit 350 bullet, the riding experience was considerably easier but in many ways, was less for that. What makes the old iron barrel interesting is the highly involved riding experience from nailing a gearshift to feathering the throttle to keep it on the boil to planning and using your limited brakes. I could probably hustle both bikes about at the same speed but the old bullet would be more of an achievement. Yes, it was boring. But there is a market for boring bikes. It's perfect for the Indian home market where nobody is going over 60mph anyway.

I suspect the new interceptors are similar in some ways. Put one next to an original interceptor which was no slouch for its day, you're probably getting comparable performance but in an overall easier to ride package. A good rider on an original 750 interceptor would probably hand an average rider on a modern 650 their arse.

Compare that to Triumph. Mrs stinkwheel has a speed twin while I was on the enfield. I had a go and it's a thoroughly modern hooligan of a bike that makes you power it out of corners on the twisties with the throttle pinned just to feel it pull. Safe in the knowledge that if you screw up, the traction control will take over. Almost no comparison to the performance and riding experience you'd get from the likes of an original 650 bonnie.

So two different markets. An actual retro bike from RE or a retro-looking bike from Triumph.

Of course, if you do want some performance, they are doing some interesting things with the RE 650s. Lots of tuning parts coming on the market. Like S&S are doing an 865 big bore kit which bumps it to 11:1 (from 9.5:1), performance cams, firged conrods etc-etc.

Be interesting to see how an RE650 +£5k of goodies would compare to a T120 Bonneville.
____________________
“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Easy-X
Super Spammer



Joined: 08 Mar 2019
Karma :

PostPosted: 16:38 - 31 Oct 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm spending a lot of time tuning the exhaust with the Husky in the same way I did with the XSR because of the manufacturing limitation all new bikes have with regards to noise and emissions.

But if you're going to the trouble of redoing suspension, rebuilding the top end, etc. the obvious question is did you buy the right bike to start with.
____________________
Husqvarna Vitpilen 401, Yamaha XSR700, Honda Rebel, Yamaha DT175, Suzuki SV650 (loan) Fazer 600, Keeway Superlight 125, 50cc turd scooter
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

stinkwheel
Bovine Proctologist



Joined: 12 Jul 2004
Karma :

PostPosted: 16:57 - 31 Oct 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Easy-X wrote:

But if you're going to the trouble of redoing suspension, rebuilding the top end, etc. the obvious question is did you buy the right bike to start with.


Depends what you want. One of the UCE 500 classic enfields does everything my 612 bullet will do out of the box, looks very similar and at probably half the overall cost. I wouldn't swap it though. Although I suspect a 500 classic wouldn't actually do 90mph on the flat which I did get out of the 612 the other day (off the top of the speedo and on a very slight uphill). I wouldn't do it often or for very long on the 612 either mind but some fucker overtook me in a Fiesta and I can't be having with that kind of thing.
____________________
“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Easy-X
Super Spammer



Joined: 08 Mar 2019
Karma :

PostPosted: 18:16 - 31 Oct 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, that always amazes me. Round my way there's a 40mph dual carriageway section that I'd probably scream away from the lights doing well over 50 obviously within the speed limits and some battered old van comes past me trying to do 70. Then 500 yards later screeches to a halt at the next roundabout. What was the point of that?!
____________________
Husqvarna Vitpilen 401, Yamaha XSR700, Honda Rebel, Yamaha DT175, Suzuki SV650 (loan) Fazer 600, Keeway Superlight 125, 50cc turd scooter
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

om15
Nova Slayer



Joined: 12 Aug 2018
Karma :

PostPosted: 19:12 - 13 Jan 2024    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have spent the last couple of months working on my new/old Bonneville, fitted original oem exhausts, cleaned and ACF 50'd everything, completed all servicing items, but still had an itch.
So I bought a 2015 RE Bullet 500 UCE this week, can't keep away.
____________________
Alcohol doesn't solve problems, but neither does milk
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

om15
Nova Slayer



Joined: 12 Aug 2018
Karma :

PostPosted: 19:14 - 21 Jan 2024    Post subject: Reply with quote

here it is,
____________________
Alcohol doesn't solve problems, but neither does milk
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Robby
Dirty Old Man



Joined: 16 May 2002
Karma :

PostPosted: 22:09 - 21 Jan 2024    Post subject: Reply with quote

stinkwheel wrote:


Compare that to Triumph. Mrs stinkwheel has a speed twin while I was on the enfield. I had a go and it's a thoroughly modern hooligan of a bike that makes you power it out of corners on the twisties with the throttle pinned just to feel it pull. Safe in the knowledge that if you screw up, the traction control will take over. Almost no comparison to the performance and riding experience you'd get from the likes of an original 650 bonnie.

So two different markets. An actual retro bike from RE or a retro-looking bike from Triumph.


This is pretty much why I went for a new Guzzi. It's somewhere in the middle. The V7 and V9 are a product of continuous* evolution of a bike from the 1960s until the modern day. The frame design is very similar, the engine can trace it's lineage back but is trigger's broom by this point. It does feel like someone took a classic bike and did an expensive resto-mod rebuild of it.

It also highlights some of the drawbacks of the resto-mod approach. There's more to decent suspension that fitting good dampers and fork internals, geometry and rear wheel travel play a big part. You also aren't getting a big airbox without a frame built for it. Modern necessities like ABS brakes, exhaust air injection, evap canister etc are going to look ugly, although can be hidden quite well with a bit of skill.

*interrupted by bankrupticies
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

doggone
World Chat Champion



Joined: 20 May 2004
Karma :

PostPosted: 14:13 - 22 Jan 2024    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can see it being a bit gutless if you are wanting to overtake on fast A roads especially with pillion.
Nice enough for single track road bimbling and commuting, at that price should sell plenty.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website You must be logged in to rate posts
  Display posts from previous:   
This page may contain affiliate links, which means we may earn a small commission if a visitor clicks through and makes a purchase. By clicking on an affiliate link, you accept that third-party cookies will be set.

Post new topic   Reply to topic    Bike Chat Forums Index -> Biking News & Rumours All times are GMT + 1 Hour
Goto page Previous  1, 2
Page 2 of 2

 
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum

Read the Terms of Use! - Powered by phpBB © phpBB Group
 

Debug Mode: ON - Server: birks (www) - Page Generation Time: 0.08 Sec - Server Load: 0.13 - MySQL Queries: 17 - Page Size: 87.83 Kb