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SausageBhoy
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PostPosted: 16:05 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nobby the Bastard wrote:
Dumping bonds is selling them. Thats what the market started to do and in order to protect the value of sterling the BoE had to buy them.

You have cause and effect the wrong way round.

The time line...

Mini budget
Investors start selling off loads of Uk government bonds as they lost confidence in sterling because of the mini budget
BoE started to buy them back to protect the value of the market and Interest rates spiked as banks got spooked.


Laughing
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 16:22 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

I meant sterling, not market.

If thats the best you can do to refute what I said you're losing badly, Mr 'I don't know what dumping investments means'
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SausageBhoy
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PostPosted: 16:24 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've already refuted it, you've not had the chance to say anything differently.

It's not about losing, we're just forum users airing our opinions and nothing more than that. We won't change the world on BCF.
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 16:36 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quite frankly you have no understanding of money markets etc.

How can you state that the BoE buying back bonds cause interest rates to rise, and ignore the reeason why the BoE had to do it, i.e. billions of bonds being dumped on the market by spooked investors?

Equally, what makes you think that raising base rate 0.5% would cause a massive increase in fixed term deals, when the BoE had done the same before and after the massive jump with no apparent overreaction from the banks??
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SausageBhoy
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PostPosted: 16:39 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nobby the Bastard wrote:
Quite frankly you have no understanding of money markets etc.

How can you state that the BoE buying back bonds cause interest rates to rise, and ignore the reeason why the BoE had to do it, i.e. billions of bonds being dumped on the market by spooked investors?

Equally, what makes you think that raising base rate 0.5% would cause a massive increase in fixed term deals, when the BoE had done the same before and after the massive jump with no apparent overreaction from the banks??


That's where your lack of understanding manifests, no where have I ever said a fixed deal rises, that's the whole point of a fixed deal Laughing
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 16:44 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

And the PM resigned aafter sacking her chancellor and fucking off his budget because the chaos it caused in the money markets, and not because of anything the BoE did.
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SausageBhoy
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PostPosted: 16:46 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

The budget which didn't come into effect?

Go on, tell us how.....
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 16:49 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Look what happend to the value of sterlingaround thje time of the mini-budget.

https://tradingeconomics.com/united-kingdom/currency

And this is what is left of the mini-budget ideas.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/oct/14/kwasi-kwarteng-mini-budget-what-is-left
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SausageBhoy
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PostPosted: 16:57 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nobby the Bastard wrote:
Look what happend to the value of sterlingaround thje time of the mini-budget.

https://tradingeconomics.com/united-kingdom/currency

And this is what is left of the mini-budget ideas.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/oct/14/kwasi-kwarteng-mini-budget-what-is-left


As I've already said 'at the time', the BoE did their work around the same time, so how exactly did a woman and a black man trash it?
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 17:01 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

The BoE responded to investors dumping bonds and causing the devaluation of the pound. Investors dumped bonds because the lost confidence in the pound because of the mini-budget and what investors though it was likely to happen.

You must be a bit stupid to not understand this.

Sterling wasnt devalued by the BoE buying billions of pounds of bonds that were dumped on the market and wasn't devalued by the BoE increasing interest rates by 0.5%. Sterling actually recovered because of the actions of the BoE, and of course, the u-turn on the mini-budget.
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SausageBhoy
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PostPosted: 17:15 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

And that happened before the mini budget.....so go on, how did the black man and the woman do it with a budget which didn't come into effect?
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 17:24 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Investors were spooked by firstly what they thought could be in the budget and then was in the budget.

This caused the value of the pound to fall dramatically.

Raising base rate by 0.5% doesn't cause the market for sterling to crap itself, it actually increases confidence in sterling as it's considered fiscally responsible.

Buy back bonds that have been dumped on the market doesn't devalue sterling, it does the exact opposite, and is a response to bonds being dumped onto the market.

What did the BoE do to cause sterling to devalue around the time of the mini budget because it was clearly neither of these things?
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Last edited by Nobby the Bastard on 17:25 - 11 Jun 2023; edited 1 time in total
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SausageBhoy
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PostPosted: 17:25 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

We've already done that bit.........so go on, how....
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 17:27 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

So how does raising the base rate by 0.5% cause sterling to collapse and why doesn't it happen every other time the BoE raises base rate?

How does the BoE buy a glut of bonds off the market that have been dumped there before they are dumped?
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SausageBhoy
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PostPosted: 17:39 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

I already told you on the previous page.

So you're answering a question by asking me another.....so I guess you've ran out?
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 17:42 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

You keep just saying that the BoE raised rates before the mini-budget and this caused sterling to tank.

The bank of England has raised rates multiple times in the last few years. Why didn't Sterling tank every other time interest rates rose?

You then go on about buying back bonds but th BoE started doing that after Sterling started to tank.

Why did sterling recover after the mini-budget was largely reversed by Hunt?

You keep saying that the BoE caused all this but fail to explain exactly why raising base rate and buying back bonds cause investor confidence in Sterling to tank when the two are generally known to do the exact opposite.
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SausageBhoy
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PostPosted: 17:49 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

The mini budget wasn't reversed. You can't reverse something which didn't come into effect......

Tell us how you hate black people and women, without telling us how much you hate them in power, go on....
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 17:50 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

You're fucking deranged.

Reversed or didn't follow through with. Same effect, Chancellor sacked and PM eventually resigned.

This was not caused by the BoE but the markets losing confidence in their stewardship.
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SausageBhoy
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PostPosted: 17:53 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nobby the Bastard wrote:
You're fucking deranged.

Reversed or didn't follow through with. Same effect, Chancellor sacked and PM eventually resigned.

This was not caused by the BoE but the markets losing confidence in their stewardship.


After the misogynistic and racist hate campaign by Labour and the left wing papers.........all caused by the BoE and their mismanagement.....
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 18:06 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Left wing media like The Telegraph?

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2023/06/01/liz-truss-abandoned-plan-simon-case-led-civil-service/
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SausageBhoy
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PostPosted: 18:13 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Did you actually read that article?
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 18:16 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

SausageBhoy wrote:
Did you actually read that article?


yes, several times, especially this bit.

Quote:
Ms Truss announced a swathe of tax giveaways in her only budget as prime minister last September, including abolishing the 45p income tax rate.

But the statement, which was not accompanied by an OBR forecast or any money raising measures like spending cuts, sparked chaos on the markets.

Government borrowing costs soared by a record amount in a single day as investors sold off UK assets over fears the pledges were unaffordable.

Ms Truss was forced to sack Mr Kwarteng just three weeks later and bring in Jeremy Hunt, who immediately reversed almost all of the measures.

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SausageBhoy
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PostPosted: 18:20 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

You do realise that's another news papers version of events? As said earlier, the media went on a frenzy, much to the sigh of relief of the BoE. Go on, regurgitate more media frenzies.....
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 18:24 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

SausageBhoy wrote:
You do realise that's another news papers version of events? As said earlier, the media went on a frenzy, much to the sigh of relief of the BoE. Go on, regurgitate more media frenzies.....


Thats what the telegaph is reporting on their website and not disputing.

The Simon case element is what was reported in the Spectator.

Another Telegraph report stating that the mini-budget caused the market chaos.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/05/25/britains-borrowing-costs-jump-to-highest-in-g7/

Here's another article from the Telegraph frrom a couple of days after the mini-budget describing it as cluster bomb that is blowing up British credibility

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/09/25/kwasi-kwartengs-tax-cluster-bomb-risks-blowing-britains-credibility/
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SausageBhoy
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PostPosted: 18:32 - 11 Jun 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's what a journalist reports, did you not look into it deeper than what a journo said? I'm going to guess no.
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