How to corner

[Mr Pants!]

I was reading Bike this afternoon and there is an interesting article in there on cornering.

You have the racing line, not advisable on the road, then the safe line to come in wide to give yourself maximum view round the corner, once you see your exit you can then adjust your line to exit it nicely.

However, on left hand corners, where you would move out to the white line, there is another risk. Idiot car drivers cutting the corner and actually crossing the line. So where should you position yourself?

They monitored a corner, notorious for people cutting it and they said it seemed that the bigger the vehicle, the more they cut the bend.

There is a road near me with a nasty corner, called Yately Road, which then becomes Sandhurst road. Everyone cuts it in there cars, lorries, vans etc.

My line is tight into the kerb and very slow to get round it safely, if I took the text book road riding line, I would not live much longer!

The magazine said that cornering is about taking all the aspects into account. This is one area I had not really considered. Worth noting!

Has anyone come across this issue on corners before?
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Mr Pants! (Alex or Al)
Its better to burn out, than to fade away....

[Sparks!]

I can't say I've thought of that, but have now

Me and a mate took some very very tight twisty country lanes on the way back from a supermoto race last weekend, he's a copper and I assume he's done advanced riding, following his line taught me a LOT... my tyres are relatively new and I've only done motorway stuff on them so big chicken strips But after following his lines, maximising vision etc out of corners and lining up nicely for the next ones.. the right side chicken strip is gone and left has halved in size OK that's not exactly difficult but goes to show that IMO the "police" style lines through bends is the better lines for road riding.

He was very quick through them, despite barely speeding over the limit.. he just "flowed" and made it look easy. Respect

So yeah, I think the police style is better and take every corner for what it is, not based on a text book style
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Current Toys: 06 Yamaha WR250F | Nissan 350Z GT | Tech 4 Homes

[skyline]

the probeblem with keeping a tight line round a left hand bend is the fact if there is a parked car round then, then you are just as fooked :/ i just take every corner like there is a parked car and a car will also cut the corner so i'm always prepared for more or less whats coming

[Spiral]

I see the points made do make a lot of sense, It doesn't really matter on the road how good a rider you are, in some situations its better to be safe than sorry.

I have been looking out for any articles on rear wheel steering and was just wondering if anyone has seen any recently?

Though this month in bike magazine there is an article on brakes/pads and one called operation overtake heres a quote,

"While overtaking on the roads is about accelerating,on the track it's more often about braking"
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****NORTHERN IRELAND NEWSFLASH!!**** According to a recent survey, 94% of loyalists said the best sex they ever had was in the shower; the other 6% haven't been to jail yet.***

[stinkwheel]

[Mr C]

it all depends on the corner

whatever, the racing line is not usually the best line to take, unless you have totally clear visibility which is not often as using the racing line leaves you with no margin for error

on a left you should aim to approach with as much visibility as is safe and practical for that corner, on a wide open sweeper, you can be at the line as long as there is no traffic coming, then tip in later than you would on the racing line and follow the line of the nearside of the road

on lefts, you should be aiming to always exit on the left of your lane as this is the tightest line and gives you the freedom then to use the whole rest of the lane as necessary, depending on what you find when you get round it

as bends tighten up then you need to really approach them away from the centre line- going further away as bends get tighter, precisely because cars, other bikes and especially large vehicles will cross the centre line and you don't want to have to take avoiding action, it's better just not to be there in the first place

for rights you should approach from the left of your lane and follow the same procedure, get a good view - tip in and aim to exit on the white line

again, if there is oncoming traffic this gives you the opportunity to use more of the lane and exit further left away from the hazard as it is the tightest line, moving left away from the line is actually making the corner easier - if you are aiming to exit left you are already on the maximum radius for the corner and trying to avoid a hazard from this position requires that you tip in even more

the other advantage that this system gives you over the racing line is that it sets you up 90% of the time for the next corner - most lefts on the road will be followed by a right and vice versa so exiting a left on the left puts you in the correct position for entering the next right etc. - not always but more often than not

also of course, you shouldn't be carrying so much corner speed into blind corners that you can't stop in the distance you can see regardless

vanishing point is fine in theory but it just tells you how fast you CAN negotiate a corner - not how fast you SHOULD do it

none of this is described like this in "Roadcraft" by the way, but it is how the Police are taught as far as I know

sound about right T.C.?
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187.3bhp = 201mph

[billy whizz]

Some advanced riders use a system called "offsiding" on left handers, i do sometimes but only on roads i know well. For more details on this manouvre speak to your local advanced motorcycle group. But best advice take your advanced test first, you get quicker without riding faster and your insurance drops!
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Here comes the summer!

[Mr C]

Afaik they don't teach offsiding anymore

average riders just aren't smart enough to know when it's safe to use it

again afaik it's a Rospa fail and probably IAM too


although I have been encouraged by Police riders to do it you really do need to be absolutely sure
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187.3bhp = 201mph

[billy whizz]

How come i passed IAM last year and they taught me offsiding!??
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Here comes the summer!

[Mr C]

ah ok
it must just be Rospa then
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187.3bhp = 201mph

[AcIdBuRnZ]

[Inglesina94]

[billy whizz]

Yeah i hear Rospa is quite tricky, incidentaly my IAM test examiner was a Police motorcycle instructor. He turned up on an old clapped out BMW and i could not lose him no matter what i did! Thought he was reading my mind Spooky
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Here comes the summer!

[billy whizz]

[Inglesina94]

mmm ... the best riders I have been pillion to lately ... now don;'t blush too much for the compliment!!
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Passed my DAS - Third time lucky!!!!
Naked Bandit 600 ... Beautiful!!!

[billy whizz]

A classic case of a good bike making up for a crap rider!
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Here comes the summer!

[Mr C]

[Inglesina94]

Of course it is all in the bike ... when compered to a racing one where my head is way above the rider!! With your bike I can simple relax and enjoy the landscape without getting blown away!!
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Passed my DAS - Third time lucky!!!!
Naked Bandit 600 ... Beautiful!!!

[Davo]

[T.C]

[Mr C]

thanks T.C.

it's always good to have the correct version of stuff

I just wish I could find the time to go and actually finish the bloody training and get the test done
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187.3bhp = 201mph

[Mr C]

just found this on my desk

from the Roada (Rospa Advanced Drivers Association) Motorcycle Test Guidelines

section on positioning

"When you are riding round bends and corners, and not overtaking, you should not cross marked centre lines and you should not cut corners when entering marked junctions. Roada believes that to do so is potentially dangerous. Such actions may be the result of entering the hazard too fast and may confuse omcoming and following traffic. This view is supported by the Highway Code. If anything untoward happened during such a manouvre the rider may be seen to be at fault and might then blame the RoADA for teaching or condoning this action. If there are no centre markings then some movement over the centre of the road may be acceptable"
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187.3bhp = 201mph

[map]

I found discussion interesting so had a look on the rospa website. Downloaded the motorcycle test guidelines and IMO they read like a 1940/50s government information film (think Harry Enfield - Chumley Warner).

Apologies if OT as regards cornering topic but this bit caught my eye...

[Mr C]

nothing

but nothing

anywhere official will condone exceeding the speed limit

this is not what "making good progress" means

it's a common misconception about advanced riding that it is all dayglo vests and pottering about

well learning may be and the test may be but what it allows you to do is systematically assess hazards in a way that allows you to deal with them so that on the odd occasion where you may find yourself exceeding the speed limit you are in a bigger bubble of safety because you are (subconsciously if you are really good) applying a system which has been proven to work and developed over many years

of course no official document or training will encourage you to break the law
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187.3bhp = 201mph

[map]