The veil, the media and our knee jerk reaction

[craigie b]

Jack straw made some comment about how he asked veil wearers to remove their veil when they came to see him.

Lets drop all terror inspired analogies and look at really how innocuous a request that is.

If a biker came into my office to chat to me I would like him to remove his helmet so we could chat. It is a very reasonable request. As an MP I think he has every right to see the face of the person he is talking to.

Yet this has been turned into a media frenzy where people are suddenly demanding everyone remove their veils.

In a free country why is this the case? You can wear what you want so why is a veil so offensive? In individual cases, yeah, remove it....I would ask you to if you were talking to me. Also if you were teachin my kid. I do think the veil is weird but if you want to wear it in public then fill your boots.

Problem is, I've been talking to people who say they shouldn;t wear it as it makes them look like terrorists...WTF? With the exception of Chechenya and possibly Iraq and Afghanistan, there has been no veiled terrorists so this assumption is completely speculative.

Remember, if we remove their right to wear a veil we're opening the doors to the governmnet telling us what we can and can't wear. Its a control issue being applied to a group of people who are easily targeted by the public, but in the long run once we allow it to happen to one group of people why could it not happen to others?

To paraphrase Siggi, we need to wake up and smell the coffee because we are very quickly turning on one section of society based on falsehoods and speculation when the people who are actually responsible is the government. The government lets illegal aliens in unchecked, give em benefits, makes the uK a very attractive country to get into, gives them a different set of rules (which we then use to further hate the muslims).

Fuck the muslims, its the governmnet who should be gettig booted out of the country.

[ram_doom]

I think the public perception is... muslims and thieves... both wear masks
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[zaknafien]

[Retro-Man]

Problem with your argument is you are making it too simple, by blending 3 very different issues in to 1.
Your argument whilst basically correct does see the seperation of:

1. terrorism
2. the rights of one group of people being sacrificed to suit the beliefs of another group of people
3. immigration controls

it just so happens that all 3 issues can be linked with Muslims(amongst others), but that does prevent each issue being argued in it's own right.

it just so happens IMO that the muslim faith is the one that remains un bending and uncompromising with the rest of the world.
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[pwntifex]

Again, you fail to see the veil as anything but a piece of clothing, when instead it is the very mark of a person who is unwilling to integrate into our society. I have argued this to the death, but the veil is oppressive and medieval. These woman who say it is empowering are simply the puppets of their husbands/higher powers. This was proven to great effect by the teaching assistant, who fell to pieces when questioned - she was simply stirring the pot under someone else's orders. The veil is the great tool of extremist Islam, and it is being used as a weapon against the west - it is simply another piece of propaganda, wherein the 'dirty infidels' can be seen to oppress the 'loving, peaceful muslims'.
We are a very tolerant nation, but there is only so far that you can tolerate intolerance.
These people do not want to integrate - they do not want to become 'British muslims'; they do not consider themselves British muslims, but muslims before all else and forever. These people abhor our western values and instead of adapting themselves, wish to adapt our culture to suit them. And our ridiculous level of political correctness makes us ripe for manipulation.
We have banned hoodies from our shopping centres and for all intents and purposes helmeted bikers from our forecourts yet we allow the veil - which does not show any recognisable features whatsoever - to prosper.

Yes, you have the right to freedom of speech. As long as you say it quietly.

You cannot seperate the veil from muslim extremism. You can put an end to this debate about the veil but it will not rest. These people do not want a peaceful life in Great Britain, they want a platform from which they can set about 'easternising'/islamicising the western, predominantly christian world.

Moderate muslims do not wear the veil.
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the warped one: This is a follow up from the thread 'my willy hurts'

[byke95]

[zaknafien]

[G]

[daz|n00by]

[zaknafien]

[Mister James]

[killa]

Where’s it all going to end?

That’s what I ask myself, it was interesting to see how many Muslims are involved in some way to the government the other day when this was brought up in the news.
Will this get to a point?
In simple terms, unlike many other cultures we’ve allowed in here, this Islam bullshit is causing a force to act against us. We are a force, from what I remember a force to be reckoned with, it’s a shame we’ve been so lenient about all this so far, but I’m sure it will reach a point.
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Cleverly disguised as a responsible adult.
Bike:- Yamaha TRX850 | Killas Biking History | Killas Gaming History | Killas autmotive history

[craigie b]

Right, everyone has immediately left what I have said to jump on the 'lets slag islam' frenzy.

My point was, this is a free country and if you want to wear a veil then you should be allowed. Freedom of choice.

My point was realistic though, as I think if you choose to wear the veil
you should accept that some people will want you to remove it for social interaction. Much like bikers at a forecourt. That is a moderate solution in a moderate country. Hard line veil wearers are equally as bad as people who are hardline anti veil wearer, like most of the answers in this thread.

Also realise the UK government is using this to gain support so theuy can dictate what you can and cannot wear.

What kind of free country are we when we wish to ban people for banning some thing completely for reasons of hate?

[G]

Zak:
Fair doos, then.

Mister James:
A rather extreme example, maybe.

But could also easily be how people that are used to being covered up whenever in public feel.

Infact, someone used to walking around in their underware daily could see it as a bit offensive that you feel you have to cover your self.


Siggi:
You are talking about the people practicing the religion, not the religion it's self.
From what I've seen there are a more people doing things I don't like in the name of Islam than in the of Christianity. That doesn't mean I think that all people that practice Islam are bad people, now do I think all christians are bad people, or athesists.
I expect in all group there's a decent proportion that thrive from power and hate, who wish to create conflict with other groups.

Not so bad now, but have a look at some of the child-sex scandals involving Christians priests. Was never as bad here as it was in Ireland I believe.


From what I see, an awful lot of the grief from Islam comes from White British people. And to those, I suggest that if you don't like it, you get out along with those of other skin colours that aren't causing trouble .

[craigie b]

Oh, yeah, and also.......

Its not the Muslims fault that they get laws bent in their favour......They do not make the rules....its our government who grants them the rights that feeds the flames of hatred, which us whites use to hate them even more. We're being manipulated like puppets.

[Mister James]

[craigie b]

[craigie b]

[killa]

[killa]

[craigie b]

[killa]

[Mister James]

[craigie b]

[craigie b]