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airpig
Scooby Slapper



Joined: 24 Mar 2005
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PostPosted: 23:11 - 15 Nov 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
Not THE trip but A trip.

I'm trying to contribute as much of it as I can (without having to sell a kidney!) but it's not like this isn't the same scenario for many charity rides anyway!

I can see this is a lost cause. Ultimately, I can't force people to donate. Sad
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Devils Advocate
World Chat Champion



Joined: 18 Apr 2009
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PostPosted: 23:20 - 15 Nov 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
Kaph wrote:



I think the thing is, is that you should really be paying for the accomodation and evening meals yourself, rather than using the donations that were for 'charity', as part of your comfort.

Does defeat the point a little.


I disagree.
The only problem with what he`s doing is the skinflint warmongers on BCF dont agree with it...lol
If he`s genuine....his motives are honourable and at the end of the day his chosen charity will get some money.Yes,he might use a portion of it to actually fund the event....but thats hardly criminal is it.If he couldnt raise the money himself,the event wouldnt even happen...and the charity wouldn`t get anything at all.

By him doing the ride and asking for donations on a forum he`s just raising public awareness to the charity.You say you could just donate direct to the charity if he posted a link,and yes he could do that,but then he (in himself) wouldnt actually be doing anything to raise awareness would he and he wouldnt be partaking in a "charity event"...(which is obviously what it`s all about).

Also,i`ve no doubt he`d enjoy the ride and get some pleasure out of it all but whats the big deal with that.I see no harm in it but then again i`m not a moany tight arse warmongerer. Twisted Evil
He`s still going to make money for the cause....so it can only be seen as a charitable thing to do in my opinion.

i know 90% of BCF members are going to disagree with me on this and probably start the usual name calling and abuse....but that`s because 90% of BCF members are negative moany arse trouble makers who enjoy thinking the worst all the time and love twisting a good idea into one that appears bad...

There`s 2 ways to look at what he`s doing but only 1 way is ever going to be acceptable to BCF and its hangmans jury....and thats the negative way.

( "redundant/boring" karma hits predicted for max power..lol)

Last edited by Devils Advocate on 23:30 - 15 Nov 2009; edited 3 times in total
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Ariel Badger
Super Spammer



Joined: 02 Dec 2006
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PostPosted: 23:24 - 15 Nov 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
Next year I am going to a bike rally in Germany. I would like people to donate money towards my petrol, food, accommodation and boats. In exchange for your generosity I will bung £50 to the RSPCA.
That is why I will not be drawn into this stuff. Evil or Very Mad
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tatters
Exxon Valdez



Joined: 05 Jan 2004
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PostPosted: 23:32 - 15 Nov 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
1700 miles over 10 days a challenge!!! more like a leisurely bimble across europe.

Rolling Eyes
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Ste
Not Work Safe



Joined: 01 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: 23:36 - 15 Nov 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
1930 Ariel wrote:
Next year I am going to a bike rally in Germany. I would like people to donate money towards my petrol, food, accommodation and boats. In exchange for your generosity I will bung £50 to the RSPCA.
That is why I will not be drawn into this stuff. Evil or Very Mad

And anyone who doesn't contribute is an evil kitten killer who'll burn in hell?

Max Power, if his motives were honorable (ie it was about charity and wasn't about him getting to go on a cool holiday) then the whole £2650 would be being donated to charity, rather than half of it being used to pay some company for organizing the holiday. It's not even a complicated trip, for £1400 it's a bit of a rip off. Confused

I don't see raising awareness of a charity as necessarily being a good thing if people are trying to get sponsorship so that they can go on a cool holiday.

He's still going to make money for the cause so it can only be seen as a charitable thing to do? No, that's way off the mark, getting people to pay for him to go on holiday isn't charitable. Laughing
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Devils Advocate
World Chat Champion



Joined: 18 Apr 2009
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PostPosted: 23:41 - 15 Nov 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
covdude wrote:
Bollox Max,

Your post is tinged with a pinch of bitterness to what happened in your dogtard thread,


No bitterness (i`d have to actually care before an emotion would surface..lol),but yes mate it is relative.That thread was a real eye opener for me as to the mass BCF mentality and it will stick with me for a long time.

covdude wrote:
the blokes openly canvassing for some cash for a jolly on here caus BCF has been in his thoughts ...


If he is then he`s a lowlife...but you dont know that for sure do you.It`s the usual guilty till you prove yourself innocent scenario that exists on this site.

covdude wrote:
Bollox, it is a recession and if most could afford just one pound to go fully to a charity then fair enough, but not for a half paid for Jolly to fund a well backed source, ie proportion tit cancer research to testicular mentality.

He's gone about it the wrong way, and i would rather use what little change i have for charity to get me letters sent from my pet sponsored tiger TIT50 ... Thumbs Down


I wont be contributing to it either as i`ve got my own "max power charity" to fund with only "max powers" donations....but i differ from you lot in that i dont instantly think the worst all the time.
if i wanted to donate to his charity,but wanted proof first,i`d just ask him for it....plain and simple.If he revealed himself to a blagger....he`d get it both barrels (but not before i actually knew)
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airpig
Scooby Slapper



Joined: 24 Mar 2005
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PostPosted: 23:47 - 15 Nov 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
tatters wrote:
1700 miles over 10 days a challenge!!! more like a leisurely bimble across europe.

Rolling Eyes


I agree that it is wrongly named a "challenge" (for the average biker anyway!) but I can't change that Embarassed

I'm certainly not trying to scam anyone though. I could easily pay less than the tour company's share for a biking holiday but then CLIC-Sargent wouldn't be involved and so they'd get no money. I just want to help them in some way and if it has to involve a tour company, then so be it.

I don't know why you're trying to make me feel bad about this? Rain

Thanks for your moral support, max power. Thumbs Up
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Last edited by airpig on 00:10 - 16 Nov 2009; edited 2 times in total
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Devils Advocate
World Chat Champion



Joined: 18 Apr 2009
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PostPosted: 23:57 - 15 Nov 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
covdude...i`ve said my piece...thats me "done" mate. Thumbs Up Wink

I`m quite happy to sit on the edge of the group,alienated from the inner circle mentality.I take that position in the real world aswell and "be myself" at all times. Smile ...regardless Wink
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yuri2085
World Chat Champion



Joined: 05 Jul 2008
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PostPosted: 00:30 - 16 Nov 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
I think really, the problem is that the other woman doing this challenge was paying the whole xx amount to the tour company? (didn't re read the thread).
If you can't afford to do this 'challenge' then you can't afford it. You are not putting yourself out there for something people think you would need donations to motivate you to complete this difficult task. You are some random guy having a subsidised holiday, also a charity gets something out of it too. But there are much better ways for people to give to charity.

I can see maybe friends and family donating to you, but why would anyone else want to pay for your holiday? They gain nothing, and if they support the charity they give it to the charity.
Unless you are a charity case also and feel people should donate to you too?
No problems with you but its quite clear to see why people wouldn't easily support and donate to your endeavor.
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Ste
Not Work Safe



Joined: 01 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: 00:51 - 16 Nov 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
airpig wrote:
I'm certainly not trying to scam anyone though. I could easily pay less than the tour company's share for a biking holiday but then CLIC-Sargent wouldn't be involved and so they'd get no money. I just want to help them in some way and if it has to involve a tour company, then so be it.

CLIC-Sargent would still get their money, do the trip without the tour company and then you could donate all the money to charity.

As said previous, but was ignored....

Why not donate the whole £2650 to charity rather than half of it being used to pay "Classic Tours"?

If you're going to do the trip anyway then the costs to yourself will remain the same (fuel, bike consumables, hotels, etc etc) but by not participating in the "Barry Sheene Memorial Motorcycle Challenge 2010" you could double your charity contribution.

That would be the way to make the biggest difference to children with cancer and leukemia, wouldn't it?

----

That way you get to do the trip and the charity gets the maximum amount of money. The only people who don't benefit are the tour company who I'm sure will get over it. Everyone would win, right?

It's a pretty simple route with nothing complicated, no need for a tour company, especially when they're charging £1391 for their organizing. Smile

The bit people don't like, "trying to make you feel bad", is the way you're trying to get people to finance you going on holiday because that's what it is. Thumbs Up
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Rufus
Brolly Dolly



Joined: 04 May 2008
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PostPosted: 03:18 - 16 Nov 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
Ste wrote:
Rufus wrote:
if that's the case then why not just direct people to the charity's website so they can donate directly what they'd otherwise pay you.

Eh? He's not asking people to pay him.


donate to the charity through sponsoring him. you know what i mean. if it's only a couple of quid just give it straight to the charity.
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airpig
Scooby Slapper



Joined: 24 Mar 2005
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PostPosted: 09:33 - 16 Nov 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
I appreciate what you guys are saying and to be honest, Classic Tours IS getting a lot. At the end of the day though, it's an organised tour where a worthy charity is getting a wedge of cash.

I feel it's worth mentioning for every £ raised, CLIC-Sargent gets an extra 28p from the government via a scheme called Gift Aid. Classic Tours see's none of that! Cool
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The Shaggy D.A.
Super Spammer



Joined: 12 Sep 2008
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PostPosted: 10:17 - 16 Nov 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
If you already pay basic rate tax, any donation you give CLIC-Sargent qualifies for Gift Aid, regardless of who organises it, so you can still go DIY and cut out the middleman.

[edit] The JustGiving site you're using takes 5% of the donation too, so another reason to DIY.
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Last edited by The Shaggy D.A. on 10:25 - 16 Nov 2009; edited 1 time in total
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G
The Voice of Reason



Joined: 02 Feb 2002
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PostPosted: 10:23 - 16 Nov 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
Seeing that I've already been named, I feel I should stick my oar in, though despite max power's claims, the 'argument' seems very reasoned on the 'anti' side.
Quote:
I agree that it is wrongly named a "challenge" (for the average biker anyway!) but I can't change that Embarassed

You could change your first post.

Quote:
I'm certainly not trying to scam anyone though.

Perhaps you should also, then, change your first post to something like...
"I'm trying to raise over £1000 in sponsorship to pay towards my holiday and an extra £1000 for the UK's top children's cancer charity, CLIC-Sargent," (Replace with the actual figures.)
I believe that, coming from the previous thread, they actually specified that it was up to the participant to make donators aware of who the money was going to.

Many charity things are 'scams'. An ideal example is many 'chuggers', where often 90% of your first year's direct debit goes to the commercial chugger company. I don't donate to them and will happily publically question them.

I'd suggest you have a good read through the other thread and see why that one had a happy ending.

Maxpower- it's quite possible to participate fully and yet hold opinions contrary to others. Furthermore, I don't see that if a number of people do hold opinions contrary to yours, that they should be restricted from expressing them.
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Hetzer
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Joined: 19 Feb 2007
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PostPosted: 10:29 - 16 Nov 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
I won't donate to any charity that has paid staff, much less to one that is using a percentage of the donations to line some company's pockets (as is the OP's).

I regularly donate to the Sally Army, about the only honest charity I know of.
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Devils Advocate
World Chat Champion



Joined: 18 Apr 2009
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PostPosted: 11:00 - 16 Nov 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
G wrote:
I don't see that if a number of people do hold opinions contrary to yours, that they should be restricted from expressing them.


Neither do i mate.Life is like a box of chocolates...after all.Wink
If someone asks for other opinions thats great,its having negative opinions continually forced down your throat from "questionable" people that i take objection to.
Some people raise valid points and express them in a reasonable way,such as yourself,others take a more hard line,offensive,and ignorant approach to airing their views but if you want to support those peoples rights,and back them up thats your call.

G wrote:

Maxpower- it's quite possible to participate fully and yet hold opinions contrary to others.


In some instances yes.....others ...not so much.
In the instance of BCF (until i see different) i`ll continue to sit on the fence,enjoy the view,and occasionally "yell out" from my side of the field in the hope that someone actually hears me. Mr. Green

Fully participating in BCF "debates" (and i use that term loosely)....would be about as productive as me (a mixed race man) standing up on stage at a KKK meeting and telling them "it`s time for change" Mr. Green

A debate is a reasoned,logical discussion between intelligent human beings......not an excuse for irrational emotional outbursts by a load of nutters with "personal issues and unfounded opinions" Wink

BTW,i`m not saying everyone on BCF is a fucked up idiot......just 90%..Cool

have a nice day Mr. Green

Last edited by Devils Advocate on 11:06 - 16 Nov 2009; edited 1 time in total
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Devils Advocate
World Chat Champion



Joined: 18 Apr 2009
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PostPosted: 11:19 - 16 Nov 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
covdude wrote:
People can decipher the weet from the chaft, and BCF very nature that allows red hot heated debates and antagonism is the very reason i'm still here rather than on a don't hurt their feelings super moderated forum ... Thumbs Up


I fully support freedom of speech Thumbs Up ....but without basic intelligence and respect for mankind it`s imposssible for some people to express themselves in a way suitable for a "debate" Wink

Example:

person A..."lets talk about famine in 3rd world countries and how to help them"

person B...." i hate niggers and spicks and you`re a fuckin dickhead.I`ve got loads of mashed potato on my plate right now and i`m not sharing it with no skinny wogs"

yeah...you gotta love BCFs "red-hotness" sometimes..dont ya

Thumbs Down Wink

Last edited by Devils Advocate on 11:23 - 16 Nov 2009; edited 1 time in total
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Hetzer
Super Spammer



Joined: 19 Feb 2007
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PostPosted: 11:22 - 16 Nov 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
max power wrote:
covdude wrote:
People can decipher the weet from the chaft, and BCF very nature that allows red hot heated debates and antagonism is the very reason i'm still here rather than on a don't hurt their feelings super moderated forum ... Thumbs Up


I fully support freedom of speech Thumbs Up ....but without basic intelligence and respect for mankind it`s imposssible for some people to express themselves in a way suitable for a "debate" Wink

Example:

person A"lets talk about famine in 3rd world countries"

person B" i hate niggers and spicks and you`re a fuckin dickhead.I`ve got loads of mashed potato on my plate right now and i`m not sharing it with no skinny wogs"

yeah...you gotta love BCFs "red-hotness" sometimes..dont ya

Thumbs Down Wink


What would you prefer, that person B dress his response up in some rational-sounding disguise, like the nazis? Personally I'd rather see the true colour of a person's cloth.
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