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killa
Won't Shut Up
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| Robby |
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Robby
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| Mister James |
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Mister James
I want to believe!
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 Posted: 16:58 - 12 Sep 2006  Post subject: |
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| byke95 wrote: |
We, as an 'allied' force have killed and continue to kills tens of thousands of innocents in the name of the 'war on terror',
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Ok, I'll bite at that one.
Assuming we agree with Happyclappyliberals International, and we accept that we deliberately 'carpet bombed' a squillion housing estates and children's hospitals in Iraq and Afghanistan, where exactly are we 'continuing' to kill countless thousands of innocents?
Do you mean in Iraq, where MUSLIMS (mostly backed by Iran) are killing thousands of other muslims? In Afghanistan, where MUSLIMS (mostly backed by Iran and Pakistani elements) are killing other muslims?
| Quote: |
Except, of course, that the Americans always portray it as 3xxx of /their/ country men that died.
Yes a lot of people died at once.
But I don't see those lives as many important than say 3000 lives out of the up to one million lives of people killed in Rwanda. Yet I see so very, very little about those one million people who were killed and so very, very much about a massively smaller number of people.
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A comment I've seen on a few of our interminable 'Bike Down' threads on here is that while the forum member wishes no evil on any rider, they basically don't care if it isn't someone they know.
That applies to other areas of life apart from BCF. It is perfectly natural for Americans to express shock and outrage at an attack that killed 3000 people in an american building on american soil. It is equally natural - regardless of right or wrong - that they should show more interest in events occurring in their own country than somewhere thousands of miles away.
We are no different in that regard - and it is hypocritical to say otherwise. The UN and EU make all the right noises about Rwanda, the Congo, Dhafur, etc - and yet do absolutely nothing worthwhile about it, so how are we any different?
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| king kong |
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king kong
Nearly there...
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| Didge |
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Didge
Traffic Copper
Joined: 02 Jul 2006
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Posted: 18:59 - 12 Sep 2006  Post subject: |
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| Mister James wrote: | | byke95 wrote: |
We, as an 'allied' force have killed and continue to kills tens of thousands of innocents in the name of the 'war on terror',
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Ok, I'll bite at that one.
Assuming we agree with Happyclappyliberals International, and we accept that we deliberately 'carpet bombed' a squillion housing estates and children's hospitals in Iraq and Afghanistan, where exactly are we 'continuing' to kill countless thousands of innocents?
Do you mean in Iraq, where MUSLIMS (mostly backed by Iran) are killing thousands of other muslims? In Afghanistan, where MUSLIMS (mostly backed by Iran and Pakistani elements) are killing other muslims?
| Quote: |
Except, of course, that the Americans always portray it as 3xxx of /their/ country men that died.
Yes a lot of people died at once.
But I don't see those lives as many important than say 3000 lives out of the up to one million lives of people killed in Rwanda. Yet I see so very, very little about those one million people who were killed and so very, very much about a massively smaller number of people.
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A comment I've seen on a few of our interminable 'Bike Down' threads on here is that while the forum member wishes no evil on any rider, they basically don't care if it isn't someone they know.
That applies to other areas of life apart from BCF. It is perfectly natural for Americans to express shock and outrage at an attack that killed 3000 people in an american building on american soil. It is equally natural - regardless of right or wrong - that they should show more interest in events occurring in their own country than somewhere thousands of miles away.
We are no different in that regard - and it is hypocritical to say otherwise. The UN and EU make all the right noises about Rwanda, the Congo, Dhafur, etc - and yet do absolutely nothing worthwhile about it, so how are we any different? |
Exactly!  Points that seem to be conveniently forgotten by some people. |
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| killa |
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killa
Won't Shut Up
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| Mister James |
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Mister James
I want to believe!
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| killa |
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killa
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| Annabella |
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Annabella
Like a person, only smaller
Joined: 03 Feb 2002
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| Mister James |
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Mister James
I want to believe!
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Posted: 13:52 - 13 Sep 2006  Post subject: |
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| killa wrote: |
I think i know a lot more than you give me credit for Jim jams,
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You think?! 
You hide your vast knowledge well, young Padawan.
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i do post to get a reaction sometimes, even if it isn't my true opinion.
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I doubt that's the case here, you thought you were being smart, and you got blown out of the water by someone else.
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Being someone who never admits he is wrong i can't really blame you for posting the same retarded shit back at me.
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When you prove me wrong Killa, I'll be happy to admit it. Unfortunately, all you ever do is disagree with me - totally different kettle of fish, dear boy.
@Bella
Arguing? Who's arguing? I'm edjumacating 
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| Annabella |
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Annabella
Like a person, only smaller
Joined: 03 Feb 2002
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| Posted: 14:03 - 13 Sep 2006 Post subject: |
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| Mister James |
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Mister James
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| Posted: 14:08 - 13 Sep 2006 Post subject: |
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| killa |
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killa
Won't Shut Up
Joined: 18 Oct 2004
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| Posted: 14:32 - 13 Sep 2006 Post subject: |
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| Mister James wrote: | You hide your vast knowledge well, young Padawan. |
I haven’t got the time now, but one I thing I do know from your ramblings from the past is that you have changed your opinions on something’s you didn’t agree with before. I’ve always stuck by mine.
| Mister James wrote: | I doubt that's the case here, you thought you were being smart, and you got blown out of the water by someone else. |
I should know by now not to name call because I get all sorts of flak from you whether I’m right or wrong.
And just for the record I mentioned that going to South Africa to farm would be rather stupid, not being smart, I was taking the pee a little, I wasn’t wrong about that.
I hadn’t thought about the previous statement by didge for to long so I had to agree with Bella with the generations that have made a home there. Its not really something you have to bleat on about is it?
| Mister James wrote: | When you prove me wrong Killa, I'll be happy to admit it. Unfortunately, all you ever do is disagree with me - totally different kettle of fish, dear boy. |
I don’t need to prove you wrong Jim Jams, the hilarity of it is, is that you’ve just said it again, that you are right…. 
I simply put my opinion across and read the replies, your opinion is often very well worded indeed James, I just wish you could see past your own ego to realise that sometimes you do use your cockyness and position to take the higher ground.
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| zaknafien |
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zaknafien
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| killa |
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killa
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| G |
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G
The Voice of Reason
Joined: 02 Feb 2002
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| Posted: 16:19 - 13 Sep 2006 Post subject: |
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| Quote: | A comment I've seen on a few of our interminable 'Bike Down' threads on here is that while the forum member wishes no evil on any rider, they basically don't care if it isn't someone they know.
That applies to other areas of life apart from BCF. It is perfectly natural for Americans to express shock and outrage at an attack that killed 3000 people in an american building on american soil. It is equally natural - regardless of right or wrong - that they should show more interest in events occurring in their own country than somewhere thousands of miles away. |
I appreciate that the majority of people do not consider one life to be equal to another - I suspect many on this forum would happily see 100 people in another country die for the life of an English person.
I'm not suggesting that I have a solution to the 'value' of life, but I definitely don't put as low a value on the lives of people that don't look and live like me, as many people on here do.
While I know this is the case, it doesn't mean I think that it's 'right'.
I don't think your simile to the 'RIP' threads on here is quite correct. Personally I wouldn't have a problem with someone that had lost loved ones on 11/9 commemorating their loss.
However, I don't wish to see a disproportionate amount of posts towards those that are not personally known.
People rarely criticise when they did not personally know the deceased oin bike threads, only when no one else on the forum did.
So, if anything it is more similar to my view – not wishing to see excessive media just because someone ‘like us’ has died.
As mentioned, I do appreciate that people tend to display more empathy to those that appear to be more similar to them, but I’d suggest that this is possibly partly due to self preservation – not wanting it to happen to them. I would also suggest that in some of these cases, it may be a case of finding an easy scapegoat, which appeals to people’s unconscious. After all and awful lot of people are killed in the US in other ways, but they are things that it’s much harder to be angry about.
So, yes, it is ‘natural’ as you say, but do I think it’s right? No.
I would definitely agree that people are too influenced by the media. But I would also suggest that the media is too influenced by people – they put forward what people want to see and hear, which doesn’t necessarily very well portray what is going on in the world very well. Not much that can be done about it living in a capitalist society however I suspect. |
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| Mister James |
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Mister James
I want to believe!
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| Posted: 18:56 - 13 Sep 2006 Post subject: |
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| killa wrote about me wrote: | one I thing I do know from your ramblings from the past is that you have changed your opinions on something’s you didn’t agree with before. I’ve always stuck by mine.
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| killa a little bit later on himself wrote: | You stick by your opinions even though they might be wrong, if someones shows you the proof or has the experience then you can learn by it.
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So you don't stick by them then?
I'm quite happy to admit that I change my opinions/beliefs/ideals/behaviour in reaction to events and people around me - that's part of growing up. It's also a key requirement of DEBATING and DISCUSSING - otherwise this forum is just a collection of poorly-spelt diatribes.
| Quote: |
I should know by now not to name call because I get all sorts of flak from you whether I’m right or wrong.
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You get 'flak' from me when I think you are talking gibberish - and when that is the case I make it quite clear.
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I hadn’t thought about the previous statement by didge for to long so I had to agree with Bella with the generations that have made a home there. Its not really something you have to bleat on about is it?
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I hardly 'bleated on' about it, I simply pointed out that you'd once again managed to knee-cap any chance of your comments in this thread being taken seriously.
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I just wish you could see past your own ego to realise that sometimes you do use your cockyness and position to take the higher ground. |
What is my 'position'?
Believing myself to be older and more mature? Having seen more of the world? Knowing more about the subjects that I open my (virtual) mouth on? Hardly a crime, is it? I quite deliberately form and express opinions based on the above - I fail to see how anyone is different.
Should I keep my mouth shut when I know I am right, simply because it's somehow cheating for me to know more than you, or be able to express it better? What a strange idea of a discussion you have!
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>Bazza Wow. Eyes like a shithouse rat, you... |
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| Mister James |
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Mister James
I want to believe!
Joined: 10 Aug 2004
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| Posted: 19:04 - 13 Sep 2006 Post subject: |
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| G wrote: |
I appreciate that the majority of people do not consider one life to be equal to another - I suspect many on this forum would happily see 100 people in another country die for the life of an English person.
I'm not suggesting that I have a solution to the 'value' of life, but I definitely don't put as low a value on the lives of people that don't look and live like me, as many people on here do.
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I think you are reading too much into it. Hopefully very few people would make such judgements as you've presented them - I would like to believe that people are quicker to measure the impact that the loss of such lives would have on them.
I know that thousands of people died needlessly in Africa this week - and yet I have done absolutely nothing about it. Were a thousand people to die in the street next to me, you can bet your bottom dollar I'd be out there with a baseball bat trying to sort it out.
People only care about what affects them. Some virtuous souls choose to be affected by distant catastrophes, whilst the majority simply decide that paying their Visa bill or scoring a couple of beers is more important to them.
| Quote: |
While I know this is the case, it doesn't mean I think that it's 'right'.
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We agree on that, at least - I simply think it's unfair to target grief over 9/11 more than anything else. I don't see many threads on here lambasting BCF for not saving the rainforest, or feeding Africa, or stopping Indian child slavery, etc.
9/11 is set apart from many events or tragedies because it represented the public dawn of a new paradigm, appearing to plunge the world into the War on Terror that had in reality been raging for years unnoticed.
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>Bazza Wow. Eyes like a shithouse rat, you... |
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zaknafien
Joined: 25 Mar 2002
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| TheShaggyDA |
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TheShaggyDA
Repost Police
Joined: 14 Jun 2004
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| Posted: 21:41 - 13 Sep 2006 Post subject: |
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Here's some posts on the other side of the 9/11 coin :-
Forbidden thoughts about 9/11
Readers respond
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Current: CB500 Previous: CB100N, CB250RS, XJ900F, GT550, GPZ750R/1000RX, AJS M16, R100RT, Enfield Bullet
[i:6e3bfc7581]But still I fear and still I dare not laugh at the madman...[/i:6e3bfc7581] |
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| killa |
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killa
Won't Shut Up
Joined: 18 Oct 2004
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| Posted: 08:50 - 14 Sep 2006 Post subject: |
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| killa wrote: | You stick by your opinions even though they might be wrong, if someone’s shows you the proof or has the experience then you can learn by it. |
| Mister James wrote: | So you don't stick by them then? |
Some of your opinions you have on related matters have changed dramatically, I actually agree with a lot you’ve said in recent posts now as they have been similar to mine.
I don’t believe when Mr James says he is right, that he is right, and the more you keep referring to me as someone totally out of his depth really would infuriate anyone to TBH and you know that. I can imagine in a real life discussion if someone expressed an opinion and it was something you instantly disagreed with, you wouldn’t answer back with replies that you’ve displayed your just being a cock.
| Mister James wrote: | I'm quite happy to admit that I change my opinions/beliefs/ideals/behaviour in reaction to events and people around me - that's part of growing up. It's also a key requirement of DEBATING and DISCUSSING - otherwise this forum is just a collection of poorly-spelt diatribes. |
There hasn’t been a huge amount of threads where I’ve seen you except anything from members on similar topics, a lot of regular debaters agree with a lot you say, often I will to, hence the lack of replies you’ll get, but sometimes I throw in some of my own views and some that I think another party would ask, either to get the ball rolling or make you think.
My writing style maybe not to your liking but at least I am giving some input to a thread, I think a majority of times it ends up like this because of the replies I get from you.
| Mister James wrote: | You get 'flak' from me when I think you are talking gibberish - and when that is the case I make it quite clear. |
Again, you reply for a reaction, I spell correctly 95% of the time, and I take time to reply to posts, I never expect anything from you other that the odd stupid dig at something I may have missed, instead of a reply that starts with a concern and ends with why you think I’m wrong. I wouldn’t mind if you replied like that, perhaps you should learn from this.
| Mister James wrote: | Should I keep my mouth shut when I know I am right, simply because it's somehow cheating for me to know more than you. |
You may know a lot on related topics such as this, which shows you’re not stupid, which is also why when you post shit like that you know exactly what you’re doing. You usually mention how you’re tried of all bickering, so here’s some advice, stop being a bell end.
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killa
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killa
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| Posted: 12:40 - 14 Sep 2006 Post subject: |
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Mister James
I want to believe!
Joined: 10 Aug 2004
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| Posted: 12:49 - 14 Sep 2006 Post subject: |
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| killa wrote: |
I don’t believe when Mr James says he is right, that he is right, and the more you keep referring to me as someone totally out of his depth really would infuriate anyone to TBH and you know that.
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The problem is 'killa' that you often are out of your depth, and refuse to admit it. That is where my scorn starts chipping in. And for the record, if I say I am right - I obviously think I am right so no I won't be saying "hey, maybe it's 6 of 1 and half a dozen of the other".
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I can imagine in a real life discussion if someone expressed an opinion and it was something you instantly disagreed with, you wouldn’t answer back with replies that you’ve displayed your just being a cock.
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You can imagine all you like. In real life, most people make more sense than you, and don't call me a cock.
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a lot of regular debaters agree with a lot you say, often I will to, hence the lack of replies you’ll get, but sometimes I throw in some of my own views and some that I think another party would ask, either to get the ball rolling or make you think.
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So what are you, a teacher? My Jedi Master or something? If that's the excuse you need for your frequent outbursts of waffle then fine, whatever.
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My writing style maybe not to your liking but at least I am giving some input to a thread, I think a majority of times it ends up like this because of the replies I get from you.
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| Quote: |
Again, you reply for a reaction, I spell correctly 95% of the time, and I take time to reply to posts,
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Your writing style ranges from the patronising (quite how you feel able to patronise myself and others is beyond me) to the gibbering - often in the same paragraph.
You mistake reasonable spelling for a readable writing style - that is not the case at all. Where I highlighted a post of yours as being gibberish earlier in this thread, it was because its content and structure made so little sense I couldn't tell which side of the argument you were coming down on! Add to that your constant self-contradictions and your self-proclaimed habit of never changing your opinion except for when you do, and you have a recipe for confusion.
Once you've done stuff like that, you suddenly feel able to take the moral high ground and lecture everyone else on how they should admit being wrong, just because you have been forced to!
| Quote: |
You may know a lot on related topics such as this, which shows you’re not stupid, which is also why when you post shit like that you know exactly what you’re doing. You usually mention how you’re tried of all bickering, so here’s some advice, stop being a bell end. |
Of course I know exactly what I'm doing when I post, just as your motives in attempting to present yourself as the mature one in this argument are achingly transparent. I get tired of your refusal to face facts on a case-by-case basis, so please don't stop yet, I'll be fine for a bit yet.
As usual, your petty name calling does nothing but highlight your relative immaturity and inability to put forward a proper argument.
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Mister James
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Old Thread Alert!
The last post was made 19 years, 92 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful? |
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