ROAD PRICING SCRAPPED

[db_dogsbody]

Hi folks, thought i'd make my 1st post on here good news-

Just heard on Radio2- the Govenment has today abandoned it's road pricing policy due to the petition against it reaching over 1,000,000 votes.

DEMOCRACY AT WORK
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It's just a game...

[Kickstart]

Hi

Cannot find any mention of that.

Have found this SafeSpeed press release from this morning.

[nick606]

[G]

Not sure this has anything to do with democracy?

[Tommy]

From the Bee bee See

[flat spot]

[db_dogsbody]

Hmm jus read that Beeb link... i may have had the rose-tinted glasses on this morning Still it'll make the f****rs squirm a bit.
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[ColdInsomnia]

[Syx]

[Wafer_Thin_Ham]

Surely that tracking lark is an invasion of human rights and therefore in violation of the Geneva convention.

Or once it's a reality get as many people as possible to remove the tracker.

* O no it's the feds *
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[Zem]

[Mister James]

In fact, instead of road pricing being scrapped, Blair is going to email us all to let us know why we are wrong and his discredited, tax-hungry government is right - despite 1.5 million people taking the time to tell him otherwise.

https://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/6372877.stm
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>Soultrader Mister James, I bet you are a copper
>Bazza Wow. Eyes like a shithouse rat, you...

[stinkwheel]

Well people. If he emails you, make bloody sure you reply telling him why you personally disagree.

[Wafer_Thin_Ham]

Or send him a virus
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[MarkJ]

"Over the next few days I [Blair] will be sending out a response to everyone who has signed the petition against road charging explaining the problems the country faces and why I believe road pricing is surely part of the answer here as it is in many other countries."

What are these 'many other countries', and how have they implemented this road pricing system?

[Itchy]

[Itchy]

Er Singapore via a Card which you stick on your windscreen

Stockholm via a RFID card which you also stick to your windscreen , the smaller and more efficient vehicle you
drive the cheaper it becomes

also both are more like London Charge rather than a national unescapable system


2 does not = many!
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Spain 2008France 2007Big one 2009 We all die. The goal isn't to live forever, the goal is to create something that will. In the end, your life will flash before your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.

[Itchy]

[MarkJ]

So just one entire country that uses the system and one city in Sweden? What a joke.

Surely there is something we can do to stop him doing this? there are apparently 60million people in England, and 1.5 is a hell of a lot of people who: have their own transport, know about the travel tax, know about the website and actually agree with the petition! If it gets to 2 million votes which isn't beyong the realms of possibility (especially since it was aired on Top Gear today) that's 1/30th of an ENTIRE country against a government idea, which is a hell of a lot of people.

And if we are forced to have these boxes, what's going to stop us ripping it our of our car/bike/van/lorry and having it sat in the garage being supplied through a 12v charger? Yes they could link it into the ANPR system (ANPR camera sees car registration in Sheffield centre, yet it's being told that the black box is sat in a garage in the centre of London), but surely that would be yet more money which they don't have?

[Itchy]

the thing is, alot of people say they won't pay fines etc , but the government is actively seeking to link its judicial system with the PAYE system so if you are fined it comes straight out of your wages before you even see it ,

unlike the poll tax this targets people with stuff to lose ie me and you even though I'm piss poor I still have things,

but if they annoy 35 million people lets say 5 of them are rich thats 30 mil people who'll mark on London and have a good old fashiined lyniching
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Spain 2008France 2007Big one 2009 We all die. The goal isn't to live forever, the goal is to create something that will. In the end, your life will flash before your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.

[Itchy]

Also Singapore is a geographically based system much like the London system , rather than an everywhere have to pay sort of system

there are a few more alledgedly Toronto , Oslo and New york but these are based on a London system ie enter and you pay , avoid it and you don't
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Spain 2008France 2007Big one 2009 We all die. The goal isn't to live forever, the goal is to create something that will. In the end, your life will flash before your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.

[moog]

Well, I got an e-mail this morning from 10 Downing Street. Here's the e-mail...

E-petition: Response from the Prime Minister
The e-petition asking the Prime Minister to "Scrap the planned vehicle tracking and road pricing policy" has now closed. This is a response from the Prime Minister, Tony Blair.

Thank you for taking the time to register your views about road pricing on the Downing Street website.

This petition was posted shortly before we published the Eddington Study, an independent review of Britain's transport network. This study set out long-term challenges and options for our transport network.

It made clear that congestion is a major problem to which there is no easy answer. One aspect of the study was highlighting how road pricing could provide a solution to these problems and that advances in technology put these plans within our reach. Of course it would be ten years or more before any national scheme was technologically, never mind politically, feasible.

That is the backdrop to this issue. As my response makes clear, this is not about imposing "stealth taxes" or introducing "Big Brother" surveillance. This is a complex subject, which cannot be resolved without a thorough investigation of all the options, combined with a full and frank debate about the choices we face at a local and national level. That's why I hope this detailed response will address your concerns and set out how we intend to take this issue forward. I see this email as the beginning, not the end of the debate, and the links below provide an opportunity for you to take it further.

But let me be clear straight away: we have not made any decision about national road pricing. Indeed we are simply not yet in a position to do so. We are, for now, working with some local authorities that are interested in establishing local schemes to help address local congestion problems. Pricing is not being forced on any area, but any schemes would teach us more about how road pricing would work and inform decisions on a national scheme. And funds raised from these local schemes will be used to improve transport in those areas.

One thing I suspect we can all agree is that congestion is bad. It's bad for business because it disrupts the delivery of goods and services. It affects people's quality of life. And it is bad for the environment. That is why tackling congestion is a key priority for any Government.

Congestion is predicted to increase by 25% by 2015. This is being driven by economic prosperity. There are 6 million more vehicles on the road now than in 1997, and predictions are that this trend will continue.

Part of the solution is to improve public transport, and to make the most of the existing road network. We have more than doubled investment since 1997, spending £2.5 billion this year on buses and over £4 billion on trains - helping to explain why more people are using them than for decades. And we're committed to sustaining this investment, with over £140 billion of investment planned between now and 2015. We're also putting a great deal of effort into improving traffic flows - for example, over 1000 Highways Agency Traffic Officers now help to keep motorway traffic moving.

But all the evidence shows that improving public transport and tackling traffic bottlenecks will not by themselves prevent congestion getting worse. So we have a difficult choice to make about how we tackle the expected increase in congestion. This is a challenge that all political leaders have to face up to, and not just in the UK. For example, road pricing schemes are already in operation in Italy, Norway and Singapore, and others, such as the Netherlands, are developing schemes. Towns and cities across the world are looking at road pricing as a means of addressing congestion.

One option would be to allow congestion to grow unchecked. Given the forecast growth in traffic, doing nothing would mean that journeys within and between cities would take longer, and be less reliable. I think that would be bad for businesses, individuals and the environment. And the costs on us all will be real - congestion could cost an extra £22 billion in wasted time in England by 2025, of which £10-12 billion would be the direct cost on businesses.

A second option would be to try to build our way out of congestion. We could, of course, add new lanes to our motorways, widen roads in our congested city centres, and build new routes across the countryside. Certainly in some places new capacity will be part of the story. That is why we are widening the M25, M1 and M62. But I think people agree that we cannot simply build more and more roads, particularly when the evidence suggests that traffic quickly grows to fill any new capacity.

Tackling congestion in this way would also be extremely costly, requiring substantial sums to be diverted from other services such as education and health, or increases in taxes. If I tell you that one mile of new motorway costs as much as £30m, you'll have an idea of the sums this approach would entail.

That is why I believe that at least we need to explore the contribution road pricing can make to tackling congestion. It would not be in anyone's interests, especially those of motorists, to slam the door shut on road pricing without exploring it further.

It has been calculated that a national scheme - as part of a wider package of measures - could cut congestion significantly through small changes in our overall travel patterns. But any technology used would have to give definite guarantees about privacy being protected - as it should be. Existing technologies, such as mobile phones and pay-as-you-drive insurance schemes, may well be able to play a role here, by ensuring that the Government doesn't hold information about where vehicles have been. But there may also be opportunities presented by developments in new technology. Just as new medical technology is changing the NHS, so there will be changes in the transport sector. Our aim is to relieve traffic jams, not create a "Big Brother" society.

I know many people's biggest worry about road pricing is that it will be a "stealth tax" on motorists. It won't. Road pricing is about tackling congestion.

Clearly if we decided to move towards a system of national road pricing, there could be a case for moving away from the current system of motoring taxation. This could mean that those who use their car less, or can travel at less congested times, in less congested areas, for example in rural areas, would benefit from lower motoring costs overall. Those who travel longer distances at peak times and in more congested areas would pay more. But those are decisions for the future. At this stage, when no firm decision has been taken as to whether we will move towards a national scheme, stories about possible costs are simply not credible, since they depend on so many variables yet to be investigated, never mind decided.

Before we take any decisions about a national pricing scheme, we know that we have to have a system that works. A system that respects our privacy as individuals. A system that is fair. I fully accept that we don't have all the answers yet. That is why we are not rushing headlong into a national road pricing scheme. Before we take any decisions there would be further consultations. The public will, of course, have their say, as will Parliament.

We want to continue this debate, so that we can build a consensus around the best way to reduce congestion, protect the environment and support our businesses. If you want to find out more, please visit the attached links to more detailed information, and which also give opportunities to engage in further debate.

Yours sincerely,

Tony Blair

There was also a bit at the bottom titled "Further Information"...

Further information
Both the 10 Downing Street and Department for Transport websites offer much more information about road pricing.

This includes a range of independent viewpoints, both for and against.

You can also read the Eddington Report in full.

You can reply to this email by posting a question to Roads Minister Dr. Stephen Ladyman in a webchat on the No 10 website this Thursday.

There will be further opportunities in the coming months to get involved in the debate. You will receive one final e-mail from Downing Street to update you in due course.

If you would like to opt out of receiving further mail on this or any other petitions you signed, please email....

I have removed the e-mail opt out address and I'm not sure wether to post the address that the e-mail was sent from so others could reply with their feelings on the issue. If the moderators deem it ok to do so, I will add the e-mail address later, so please let me know you lovely moderator type people!
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[Itchy]

remember politician translation rules , replace NOT with WILL/IS/Or delete

ie


this is not about imposing "stealth taxes" or introducing "Big Brother" surveillance.

changes to

this is about imposing "stealth taxes" and introducing "Big Brother" surveillance.



But let me be clear straight away: we have not made any decision about national road pricing.

changes to

But let me be clear straight away: we have already made our decision about national road pricing, and have already tendered contracts to our big political donors if you don't like it blow me


We have more than doubled investment since 1997, spending £2.5 billion this year on buses and over £4 billion on trains - helping to explain why more people are using them than for decades. And we're committed to sustaining this investment, with over £140 billion of investment planned between now and 2015. We're also putting a great deal of effort into improving traffic flows - for example, over 1000 Highways Agency Traffic Officers now help to keep motorway traffic moving.



haha so funny this means we are still going to spend less than 10% of road revenues on roads ,
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Spain 2008France 2007Big one 2009 We all die. The goal isn't to live forever, the goal is to create something that will. In the end, your life will flash before your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.

[cagiva gezzer]

[Rhino]

If road pricing comes in, I'm 'selling' my car (possibly bike too). Then I won't have to tax, insure or MOT it, and can go through Congestion Zone and speed camera's as I wish (because I'll be on foot). I never see police patrol's on the road in London.

I'm probably not alone in this view.

And people think there is a problem with uninsured/ illegal drivers at the moment?