Getting away with murder

[scott666]

Just looking on the beeb website at the welsh news and come across this,

https://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/south_west/6724367.stm

How is it you can basically murder an innocent victim because of you own selfishness and get away with a fine??

[LeeR]

"Judge Vosper said he appreciated that Mr Freeman's family would view the penalties as inadequate, but no punishment could make up for their loss. " Hanging the cunt would... if the biker had fallen asleep and killed someone does anyone think the sentence would have differed?

You know I used to be soo anti-death penalty, but as I've got older I've mellowed
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My claim to fame: Austin Vince nicked my pen...

[Sephiroth]

Skewen? That's far too close to me for my liking.

[JonB]

That's disgusting.

IMO driving whilst tired is ten times more dangerous than having a couple of pints. I try and limit myself to riding or driving a maximum of 2 hours in one stint. Even just going for a pee at the services, or sitting down having a drink is sufficient to make you feel awake.

A quick Red Bull helps as well.

But that guy who fell asleep was selfish and I can't believe he has effectively got away with it.

What message does this give to people who regularly drive tired? That they can do it, kill an innocent person and get away with it. "Getting away with murder".
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[scott666]

There was something on tv the other day (think it was brainiac) where they tested the effects that sleep and alcohol have on the body and they were virtually the same.

[iooi]

Even the judge did not come down hard on him.....

[fire]

That makes me sick.

Falling asleep at the wheel is just as bad, if not worse than driving under the influence.

Deepest condolences to the Victims Wife.

£700 Fine 1 Year Ban, and a Careless Driving Charge?!

I've had more for LESS!
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[doggone]

Interesting how differently he was treated to the guy who ran down a railway embankment (after falling asleep) causing a train crash 2 or 3 years ago - he was jailed.

[Mooncatt]

utterly disgusted. i cant think of the words i would love to say because the english vocabulary doesnt host the words to do any justice for this shambles of a court case. many more people will die until it is realised that people who drive in this way i.e drunk driving/falling asleep etc etc need to be put behind bars for a long time.
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current bike...CBR400RR
"you always need more chicken"

[Syx]

[Mooncatt]

in most cases i would agree syx but there are some occasions that it would not be appropriate like e.g your cars tyre blows out on the motorway doing 70 mph and you loose control of the car you then crash into another car killing the driver......forgive me but i would feel a tad hard done by if i got the death sentence
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current bike...CBR400RR
"you always need more chicken"

[kart racer]

I think Syx is a little harsh

If you set out to take a life - you lose yours

If you take another Life in accident (as tyre blow discribed) - i don't know, but your life would be too hard a punishment.

If you take another life due to recklessness/stupiditly (basically an easily avoid accident), - definaltey a hell of a lot more than 700 quid and no driving for a year

I remember somthing my wife said a few years back - Replace the airbag with a metal spike - people would drive a hell of a lot safer - would have made him think twice about falling asleep.
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Winners never quit, and quitters never win

[Mooncatt]

[kart racer]

remove the seat belt aswell - who would want to do an emergency stop then, we would all be going around giving everybody huge amounts of space.
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Winners never quit, and quitters never win

[Itchy]

[kawakid]

I would have thought a 3-4 year prison sentance would have been the ideal punishment.

He clearly didn't intend for it to happen, but then he drove when he was tired.

I suppose its subconsciously different than drink driving, but the results are exactly the same.

Working 14 hour shifts should be illegal anyway any firm that allows or makes it staff do so, should be prosecuted imho. FFS I'm knackered after my 7.5 hours.
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I've a twin and a 4.

[Mooncatt]

[KTM Gordo]

First of all, to those that think the penalty wasn't "hard" enough, do you know all of the circumstances of the accident? Or just what has been reported in the press?

The magistrates will have had the full facts and circumstances presented to them, and will have come to their decision taking everything in to consideration. They also have to punish the offence (falling asleep at the wheel) and not the consequence.

Some areas of the press seem to think that anything short of a gaol sentence is being "let off". What a court imposes is a punishment, whereas people seem to want revenge - which isn't the same thing.

Equally, a victim cannot offer an impartial view-point because they will understandably want an element of revenge.

Perhaps the biggest punishment is that the driver will have to live with the death of the motorcyclist on his conscience for the rest of his life.
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[ColdInsomnia]

As tragic as this was, it wasn't murder.

If the driver had purposely tired himself in order to kill the motorcyclist, then that would be murder.

This was an accident. The driver was of course, at fault, but he did not intend to hurt anyone. Thus, it isn't murder. Manslaughter at most.

Though I do think he deserves a harsher penalty.
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[gs5pete]

[Mooncatt]

even if it was a sh1tty old tyre and a plod had stopped you the day before to say you should replace it, and you'd got it overinflated? okay I'm being facetious but most people these days don't really connect cause and consequence (and no I'm not saying unexpected blowouts don't occur!)

I also agree re. seatbelts, SIPS, airbags... a lot of cagers I see seem quite happy to risk hitting me as "at worst it will mean a little scratch".[/quote]

yeah you are being facetious it was the only example i could think of at the time lol. i got more if ya want em
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current bike...CBR400RR
"you always need more chicken"

[LeeR]

It's manslaugther isn't it? I mean he knew the dangers of driving whilst tired, we all do. He chose to endanger his own life and others and in a premeditated way, he didn't "think" or "care" about the consequences, frankly 15 years sounds right to me...
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My claim to fame: Austin Vince nicked my pen...

[wristjob]

ok compare to a motorcyclist on his own bike with tax insurance etc.going a bit quick through shuflers on a duel cabbage way(sub 100mph)nobody got hurt,there was no crash and no police chase.
got a 15 month ban and a 6 month curfew.
this killer gets a fine.
he admitted that 5 min before the crash he nodded off.
but he wasnt speeding so he must be let off with fuck all punishment.
its a world gone mad!

[eifion]

So he falls asleep, veers into oncoming and takes out a motorcyclist.

And is then acquitted of causing death by dangerous driving.

What in the name of God's arse do you have to have done in order to be convicted of that offense? Is it even possible? Because if that doesn't count as causing death by dangerous driving then I can't imagine what does.

If you want to kill someone in the UK don't shoot them, don't stab them, don't hit them over the head, just run them over. Chances are you'll get away with it.
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[iooi]