Off topic cannabis and MS

[Scotsman37]

[Mudskipper]

Scotsman, while I appreciate you taking the time to reply to my original post, I'd very much like to avoid this thread descending into a 'smokers are all slacker druggies who steal from old ladies' slanging match.

The mention of weed in my post relates to the medicinal use which has helped in reducing the pain and suffering of many MS sufferers (as well as Alzeimers, Parkinson's, Cancer and other conditions) and helping them to have a semblence of quality of life.

I have already mentioned that my girlfriend has smoked it for 15 years without becoming a jobless waster 'who does stupid things thinking it's funny', so I find the 'druggie' slur against any smoker rather offensive, even more so at this moment in time.
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"You're clumsy, you eat too much and you behave like a 12 year old boy. But you know what? Every once in a while, you find a thumb."

[Scotsman37]

[killa]

[Scotsman37]

[Mudskipper]

Thank you for your concern scotsman, like I said she has smoked it for 15 years and full well knows the consequences.

I would very much appreciate it if you could take this to one of the plenty pro-weed versus anti-weed slanging threads that already exist on BCF if you wish to continue down this line.

This is NOT what this thread is about.

Thank you.
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"You're clumsy, you eat too much and you behave like a 12 year old boy. But you know what? Every once in a while, you find a thumb."

[Ste]

Stay away from the LCA, they're a bunch of fucking idiots!

Mudskipper, do some looking into a drug called sativex and your girlfriend can see if she can get it prescribed. Ignore ignorant people like scotsman, they obviously don't know what they're actually talking about. It's a ridiculous situation when people can be drugs tested and end up losing their job because of the fact they take a drug which is beneficial to them.

Cannabis has many medicinal purposes that people are unable to benefit from due to backwards prohibition laws. For example, cannabis as a cure for cancer. Cannabis must be evil because the governbent say so.

[Scotsman37]

[Ste]

Where do you get your scientific facts from?

[Scotsman37]

[Kwaks]

[Skudd]

[Scotsman37]

Okay! I see this Cannabis subject has now got it's own thread which I am glad because a lot of my close friends & family are in the same agreement that people that actively use such things should BE prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law

If Cannabis is declared that it can only be used medicinal for purposes i.e. a controlled substance then so be it, but anybody who uses for recreational use while it's deemed illegal should be incarcerated into the prison, and go through drug counciling to get them off or if they didn't learn then double their sentence, if need be.

Ste You didn't come back with an appropriate answer to counter my answer of science. So what's your excuse and what do you base your answer, if you actually come back with one, that over turns scientific fact?

Where's your counter answer [b]Ste[/b

[c_dug]

Scotsman your views on cannabis seem very biased and the fact that your wife is an ex-police officer would suggest this further.

I would like to present another side to the argument, my view is non-biased since at present i do not smoke weed and have not done for over 6 months now, i would guess from your posts, although i may be wrong, that you have never tried cannabis.

First of all, the physical effects of smoking pure cannabis are virtualy nothing, even the damage from inhaling hot smoke can be prevented via the use of a bong, there are concerns about an increased risk of heart attack and stroke, reduced fertility and reduced immune system however there is no proof at all for any of these points, dispite what the government may have you think, feel free to try and show me some. Cannabis is not physicaly addictive.
Obviously there are no positive physical effects.

Secondly the mental effects of smoking pure cannabis, I will stay away from the medical uses. Cannabis reduces stress, it can create a buzzy feeling, or conversly can create a mong feeling for lack of a better term, the effects experienced can vary from strain to strain of cannabis and also to a lesser extent with the mood of the person when smoking. For me personaly i experience a very relaxed feeling, which i find very pleasent.
Negetive effects, long term use can cause mild psychosis however this is rare, long term use is also suspected to cause schizophrenia and apathy, although again there is no proof of either of these, infact efforts to proove so have often returned completly inconclusive results. Cannabis can cause a psycological dependence.

Cannabis and crime. This is one of my major gripes with making cannabis illegal, cannabis as shown above is largely harmless, especialy when compared to legal drugs like nicotine and alcohol, people under the influence of alcohol are far more likely to behave in a violent manner. Gang related crimes are a major impact of cannabis, funnily enough, legalising cannabis would eradicate this all together since there would be no need for "dealers" to sell it and no need for gangs to fight for areas, obviously gang drug control goes beyong cannabis and into things like cocain and heroin, however legalising cannabis would certainly help.
"Cannabis is a gateway drug" this is a phrase that i hear thrown around alot, i have smoked cannabis, i have never tried another drug, i would argue that a large majority of cannabis users have never tried another drug. I would also argue that the type of user that moves on to other drugs is more influenced by the people they hang around with, than the drugs they take.

You will notice that i have specified pure cannabis at certain points, this is because cannabis mixed with tobacco obviously then takes on some of the properties of the tobacco as well, for instance the nicotine addiction.

I will gladly provide links to sources for any bits of information you want

c_dug
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[Ste]

The only way that cannabis could be a gateway drug is caused by prohibition. As it's illegal its sold by drug dealers who may offer harder drugs but if it was legal then cannabis could be bought from licensed shops that only sold cannabis.

The idea of sending someone to prison for smoking cannabis is mad. It would be completely out of proportion for the offence, if someone wants to smoke cannabis then that's their own choice.

Cannabis will always be around. It's a plant that anyone can grow in their garden if they want to, it's survived years of being illegal and two world wars.

The only people who benefit from it being illegal are criminals and corrupt police. If it was legal then it would be taken out of the hands of criminals, police time and money could be used for more important things and there would be tax revenue from cannabis being sold in licensed shops.

Scotsman, do you think that it would be better for the supply of cannabis to be regulated and controlled properly rather than being left to criminals?

[Scotsman37]

[Suitor_Stu]

[Kwaks]

To nail my colours to the mast:

I do not take illegal drugs of any sort, and even have to be careful about what kind of painkillers I use as I am drug tested for work and some painkillers are banned (instant dismissal in failure of test).

However what I find more abhorrent than the use of recreational "softer" drugs is the holier than thou attitude more often associated with religious zealots.

Scotsman, if every cannabis user was to be locked up, where shall we put the real criminals? Just release them even earlier? Who is going to pay for this counciling you speak of?

People should be able to make informed choices in what they do, however government propaganda and misinformation along with criminalisation take away this freedom.

I have seen these "spaced" out users you speak about, and the ones who giggle and laugh at the slightest thing. What I have not seen is the ones who think attacking people is funny, seeing as in every case the use makes them more lethargic. I wouldn't be surprised in your obvious blinkered state if you were getting your "recreational drug" mixed up with another.

I do not support the legalisation for anything other than medicinal use, I do however feel the de-crimilisation may have been the best option.

Perhaaps you would like to see cannabis users put on a program similar to Heroin users, where we swap one illegal addictive drug for another ,albeit controlled, more addictive drug ie methadone, seeing as that approach realllllllly seems to be working
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[Visitor Q]

Scotsman, did you get your 'scientific information' from Labour press releases and 1960's Anti-pot propaganda?

Seriously, you're far too vocal for someone who obviously has not the remotest clue on what they're on about.
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[Visitor Q]

[killa]

[Mudskipper]

I am grateful for this being moved out of the other thread, but just want to add one point in this one.

The attitude of 'I've seen X effects of people using this, therefore all use is bad and it should be banned' is effectively a child's way of looking at something.

My 7 year old daughter spent a Saturday night overnight in A&E a few months ago. Busy night, full of the usual drunks that have injured themselves/others or poisoned themselves.

Coming home (thankfully ok), she declared 'If I was in charge of the world, I would un-invent (ban? ) beer.'

Asking why, she said 'because when people drink beer, they go all silly and do silly things. I've seen it at the hospital.'
____________________
CBR125|||GSXR400|||CBR400|||CBR400|||CB250RS|||GSXR750|||CB250RS
"You're clumsy, you eat too much and you behave like a 12 year old boy. But you know what? Every once in a while, you find a thumb."

[killa]

Strange to think of a world without man made 'legal' narcotics isn't it.
Strange also when 30+ officers storm a club/pub and are all trained for one thing, to seek out the tax free, illegal drug users, not the spirits fags and beer at the bar. lol

Scotsmans view is that no one should offer help to illegal drug users. Yeah fuck em. Even if they had everything they ever wanted before and turned to drugs, fuck em.
Hard life? Grew up without guidence, wanna escape a little with narcotics, fuck em.

I know drug users with a more level view of the world.
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[Ste]

[The Artist]

Here we go, my view.

Cannabis is illegal in the UK so if you want to smoke it and advertise that and openly say that and think that you can just go ahead and do it with NO consequences then go eleswhere. You live in this country you abide by the rules. If you think they are wrong, there are appropriate routes to go down. Most of which do jack shit but thats the UK.

If you smoke it and don't advertise it then fine. I have smoked it before but I am not rambling on about whether its good or not.

I think one of the reasons is boundaries. I learnt this from a school situation but if you made cannabis legal then people would think hmm, what's the next step. What is more radical kind of thing. Part of the thrill especially for the younger generation is the whole illegality of it.

Scotsman37, you have helped me in many posts before and you seem like reasonable person but you seem very closed minded in this topic.

What I just said may seem like a pro/against weed thing but its not. I am just saying that the amount of research is minimal because it is illegal but if it was made legal, then drugs that actually have noticeable downsides would become more popular.

Probably why the government is trying to ban smoking. Once that is fully illegal, smoking tobacco will become more radical and kids will want to do it.

Health wise, if I had MS or similar, then I would probably continue smoking cannabis if you think it helps. Doctors are not going to say it helps, government isn't going to say it helps so you have to rely on your own opinions OR other peoples REAL LIFE stories.

If you think a bit of weed is bad, look at alcohol, causes more problems than weed yet its legal.