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Torque Wrench Adjustment

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Commuter_Tim
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PostPosted: 18:34 - 17 May 2013    Post subject: Torque Wrench Adjustment Reply with quote

So I figured it was time to buy a professional torque wrench and get learning how to maintain my CG.

I bought one of these https://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_storeId_10001_catalogId_10151_productId_178843_langId_-1_categoryId_165469
Arrived today and I had a play, say theoretically if I twisted the adjustment down into the dotted lines (using about the same force as my throttle twist) and then read in the manual immediately afterwards that this is detrimental to the calibration... am I realistically likely to have done harm?

Not a great start! Sad
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 18:40 - 17 May 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Doubtful IMO so long as you didn't crank it hard against a stop. If you know someone else who has a small torque wrench you can check them against each other but I would not worry about it personally.
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Commuter_Tim
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PostPosted: 17:55 - 19 May 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cheers for the reply, put my mind at ease a bit. Smile

I tried it out today, didnt shear any bolts but i wasnt even able to remove the rear wheel nut anyway, and Im not weak either.
I was sat backwards on the seat above the bike, pulling the wrench upwards, put some serious pressure on the suspension, still wouldn't come loose, so no chain adjustment for me til I figure it out!

Anybody know a good way to remove a nut that looks like it has been painted to the frame? :/
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serlant
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PostPosted: 18:02 - 19 May 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't use the torque wrench for undoing things. If the nut is being stubborn I just put the ratchet facing towards the bike and stand on it.
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fozzym
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PostPosted: 18:07 - 19 May 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

I hope you weren't using the torque wrench to try and undo the wheel nut!

You need a long fixed bar or a long handle ratchet thats up to the job. One way to f*ck a ratchet up is by trying to make it do jobs it wasn't designed to. Slipping a metal tube on for extra leverage doesn't always turn out to be a good idea, I know this to my cost!

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Walloper
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PostPosted: 18:08 - 19 May 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Commuter_Tim wrote:
Cheers for the reply, put my mind at ease a bit. Smile

I tried it out today, didnt shear any bolts but i wasnt even able to remove the rear wheel nut anyway, and Im not weak either.
I was sat backwards on the seat above the bike, pulling the wrench upwards, put some serious pressure on the suspension, still wouldn't come loose, so no chain adjustment for me til I figure it out!

Anybody know a good way to remove a nut that looks like it has been painted to the frame? :/


Make sure it isn't 'welded' to the frame then painted over. Shocked

As said don't use a torque wrench as a breaker bar (or a ratchet for that matter). There are moments in torquing where the torque can 'spike' and momentarily become higher than the maximum setting of the torque wrench. Ratchet mechanisms are very delicate things so if you want the ratchet to last, look after it well. Keep it clean and oil it regularly.
Use a 1/2" drive breaker bar on the nut and the correct socket.
For tight stuff a hex socket can be more useful than a double hex. Hex sockets don't slip off as easily.
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Commuter_Tim
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PostPosted: 18:13 - 19 May 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh dear, it sounds like if I had not fucked a £75 torque wrench before, I have now...
Another expensive life lesson Sad

I guess I will be buying a breaker bar tomorrow!

I have to admit, when I was applying the same amount of force as Atlas lifting the world (well maybe not) to the rear wheel nut, and the suspension was compressing, the ratchet did pass the pressure I had it set for, clicked loudly, and since I was loosening I thought it OK to still apply pressure...

I don't believe it is welded to the frame thankfully, as i was able to scrape around the nut to remove a lot of the paint, and apply WD40, not that it helped much.

I don't suppose you fellas know any other way to test a torque wrenches accuracy without knowing someone else with access to one to test it by?
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Walloper
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PostPosted: 18:47 - 19 May 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Commuter_Tim wrote:
Oh dear, it sounds like if I had not fucked a £75 torque wrench before, I have now...
Another expensive life lesson Sad

I guess I will be buying a breaker bar tomorrow!

I have to admit, when I was applying the same amount of force as Atlas lifting the world (well maybe not) to the rear wheel nut, and the suspension was compressing, the ratchet did pass the pressure I had it set for, clicked loudly, and since I was loosening I thought it OK to still apply pressure...

I don't believe it is welded to the frame thankfully, as i was able to scrape around the nut to remove a lot of the paint, and apply WD40, not that it helped much.

I don't suppose you fellas know any other way to test a torque wrenches accuracy without knowing someone else with access to one to test it by?


You could take it back to Halfords and tell the manager you over pulled on it and can I please have another one. Embarassed

Or you could ask a main dealer if they could test it for you.
It really needs to be checked in a Calibrated machine. Some bigger engineering works should have a meter. But lots of little workshops either don't know any better or don't care.

When you use a torque wrench you should only pull gradually until it clicks. Pulling rapidly injects too much load onto the mechanism and can stretch things putting the bar out of calibration.

You can't check it without a calibrated meter. Checking one against another is a bit hairum-scairum and probably wouldn't be worth the trouble.
You could, if you are bold enough, take it back to Halfords and ask for it to be calibrated. They may have a service for this. But would need ot be sent away which could cost.

Chances are your wrench is still 'as good as new' but no point in having a calibrated tool to remove doubt when you doubt it's accuracy.

Half decent accuracy should be about 0-5% for general use. Most OEM torque settings have tolerance to allow for wrench error/fastener condition and friction etc.

https://www.calibrate.co.uk/torque/

First googled result. Pretty website so they 'MUST' be good. Smile Razz

Found this in the Q&A for the link you posted.

Yes a calibration certificate is available for the Halfords Professional Torque Wrench 8-60Nm. A calibration certificate is supplied with the product. A calibration and repair service is available direct from the manufacturer for any customer requiring a new certificate or repair. Please phone Norbar torque tools on 01295 270333. There is a charge for this service.

Just leave the Quarmah Karma in the usual place mate. Thumbs Up
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Commuter_Tim
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PostPosted: 19:12 - 19 May 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks again for the help, I bought it from online halfords just days ago, and in all honesty the plastic tube it came in, it was loose inside, and the tube was smashed, whats to say it was even calibrated correctly initially... Neutral
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Walloper
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PostPosted: 19:18 - 19 May 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Commuter_Tim wrote:
Thanks again for the help, I bought it from online halfords just days ago, and in all honesty the plastic tube it came in, it was loose inside, and the tube was smashed, whats to say it was even calibrated correctly initially... Neutral


I never heard/saw that.. Shifty

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Commuter_Tim
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PostPosted: 19:28 - 19 May 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Walloper wrote:
Commuter_Tim wrote:
Thanks again for the help, I bought it from online halfords just days ago, and in all honesty the plastic tube it came in, it was loose inside, and the tube was smashed, whats to say it was even calibrated correctly initially... Neutral


I never heard/saw that.. Shifty

Very Happy


Understandable, and I wont waste time arguing over "truth" on the internet, but the packaging was genuinely smashed when it arrived, however that fact may not have concerned me as much until today :p

Just to crowd-source more knowledge from you guys, I'm assuming since the torque range is quite wide for the rear nut (about 26-36lb. ft), and me being an amateur, I'm assuming the accuracy change may not even be in danger zones anyway?

I'm no pro, so just being able to do things accurate enough to not kill myself is cool with me tbh.
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Walloper
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PostPosted: 19:38 - 19 May 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Commuter_Tim wrote:
Understandable, and I wont waste time arguing over "truth" on the internet, but the packaging was genuinely smashed when it arrived, however that fact may not have concerned me as much until today :p

Just to crowd-source more knowledge from you guys, I'm assuming since the torque range is quite wide for the rear nut (about 26-36lb. ft), and me being an amateur, I'm assuming the accuracy change may not even be in danger zones anyway?

I'm no pro, so just being able to do things accurate enough to not kill myself is cool with me tbh.


Rule of thumb for tightening shit.

Using a combination spanner (ring end) turn it until you feel everything suddenly stop turning. This will be very close to the torque for the fastener. Even a weakling will be able to put enough force on the do that. Torque is determined by a weight/load applied a certain distance from a fulcrum. So normal human effort on a normal combination wrench will be tight.
Torque settings are demanded in critical areas.

For the record, I haven't used a torque wrench on a motorbike for general maintenance except on bike I had that had a specific pre-load setting for the rear axle.
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Commuter_Tim
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PostPosted: 19:50 - 19 May 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Walloper wrote:

For the record, I haven't used a torque wrench on a motorbike for general maintenance except on bike I had that had a specific pre-load setting for the rear axle.


That puts my mind at ease somewhat.

Cheers dude Thumbs Up
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fozzym
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PostPosted: 20:47 - 19 May 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just to add.....Many people don't have access to a torque wrench but carry out general maintenance on their bike or car. If you have a workshop manual then by rights you should torque virtually everything!

For me, though others may disagree, I wouldn't worry about torquing wheel spindle nuts, the sump plug or tank bolts, things of that ilk. Just tighten them tight but don't "murder em" as I was once told!

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serlant
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PostPosted: 21:59 - 19 May 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Many a time I have lifted the rear wheel off the floor trying to undo rear axle nuts, which is why i now do it with the ratching facing the front of the bike, so it pushes down on the wheel.
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Commuter_Tim
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PostPosted: 22:16 - 19 May 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

serlant wrote:
Many a time I have lifted the rear wheel off the floor trying to undo rear axle nuts, which is why i now do it with the ratching facing the front of the bike, so it pushes down on the wheel.


I did attempt that, but there wasn't much clearance that way, next time this is attempted I will of course be using the right tool.

I've not been on this site long but it really is a wealth of information Smile
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Ichy
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PostPosted: 22:20 - 19 May 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

What is your location? Someone might be able to check the wrench for you.
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Commuter_Tim
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PostPosted: 22:38 - 19 May 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Vincent wrote:
I hardly ever use my torque wrench either - obvious use is the cylinder head nuts but that's because they need to be tightened down evenly.
If you're new to spannering I guess it could be a bit confusing knowing how tight to fasten things and with parts like brakes and wheel nuts there's the worry that they may come undone if not tight enough..............or break if over-tightened. Most large bolts and nuts can be tightened as much as possible with a 10 inch socket wrench - maybe ease off a bit if pumping iron or on steroids.

I think how hard to tighten something up is best shown, and something you get a "feel" for over time.

OP; where are you? Maybe someone could lend a hand.


Definitely agree on the being concerned when new to spannerwork, I can't say I know any bikers either.
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