It's all so confusing!

[Crystal Tipps]

Hi,

It's taken me a long while to get here, but just started to look at getting a bike for the first time...last time I rode pillion was 20 yrs ago...and it's all so confusing!

I've read reviews of some of the Chinese bikes such as Kaisar, Lifan & Lexmoto as they come up for sale cheaper than the names I recognise, and I've read varying advice from "steer clear" to "that's what people said about Japanese bikes when they first arrived"

Even insurance costs seem to vary considerably depending on the manufacturer.

I don't want to spend a fortune on a first bike as I hope I won't want to keep it for too long.

Suffering from information overload at the moment, but hoping the fog will clear soon!

[Throttle]

Hi there and welcome!

Best advice which many people will no doubt suggest is buy a cheap second hand bullet proof bike like a CG or YBR as your first bike. That way if you bin it, drop it or get bored of it quickly (which will happen) you won't end up wasting too much money.

Prime examples of this was a friend of mine just past his CBT and against my advice bought a brand new YBR, in this time the clutch has gone and he has ended up sending it back for repair!

[Mudskipper]

The way I look at it is - would you buy a brand new car for a grand that was made in China, with a relatively unknown name, dubious materials quality and horror stories of bits snapping and bolts falling out?

Remember a bike is a vehicle, not an MP3 player.

Best of luck with the fog
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CBR125|||GSXR400|||CBR400|||CBR400|||CB250RS|||GSXR750|||CB250RS
"You're clumsy, you eat too much and you behave like a 12 year old boy. But you know what? Every once in a while, you find a thumb."

[Crystal Tipps]

Thank you both for your advice.

LOL at your remarks Mudskipper...that's why I read some reviews to see what people were saying about the Chinese makes! And I deffo wouldn't be thinking about a new bike...I KNOW I will be picking it up off the ground a few times.

I've seen ads for both a CG & YBR in my area so am hoping to get to see those.

[waffles]

Go for something with a known name, that way when you decide to get something bigger or newer it should retain its value better. CG's and YBR's are pretty standar learner bikes as parts are fairly plentiful and they are reliable.

And definately ring round for insurance quotes, for my XT one company quoted me £500 tpft and another quoted £200 fully comp.

Hi and welcome!
____________________
Theory test - 19/8/09, CBT - 11/10/09, MOD 1 - 16/8/10, MOD 2 - 27/10/10
Past rides Yamaha XT125X, Triumph TT600, Honda XR250
Current rides Suzuki GSXR 600, Honda MSX125

[Clanger]

Hello and welcome to BCF.
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Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter, and those who matter won't mind - Dr. Seuss

[ManxieG]

Hi and welcome

I bought myself a lovely RS 125 (second hand) and its really doing the job. I was lucky with the insurance as I went to a local broker and it was £94 for the year.

Now I just have to get the lessons booked and the test out of the way.
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Its nice to be important but more important to be nice

[keigs]

I got myself a Yamaha SR125 for £450 last May and passed on that at Easter. I know people say you'll want to get a bigger one, but for me it's just fine for my 10 mile commute to work. I do all the servicing myself. Third-party insurance and tax comes to less than £100 - and it does about 120-130mpg.

I wouldn't buy new though! Just go for a 'known' brand.

[Crystal Tipps]

Thank you all for your advice. I've answered a couple of local ads...it's just frustrating now waiting for replies!

First one I contacted had already sold his bike, and I'm expecting a few more disappointments, but hope to get there soon

[Gashead Harry]

[Crystal Tipps]

Seen recommendations for a Suzuki Marauder now...apparently might suit me as it's a bit lower than some bikes...more information to take in lol

[Mudskipper]

[chris-red]

Don't go chinese buy a cg125 or similar Jap Equivlents, bullet proof cheap and hold there value.

Insurance for me on my first 125 was £330, that is probably the most anyone will pay as I was 18 with a cbt and 0ncb, if you are in you 20's you can probably half that, any older and it will be next to nothing.
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Well, you know what they say. If you want to save the world, you have to push a few old ladies down the stairs.
Skudd:- Perhaps she just thinks you are a window licker and is being nice just in case she becomes another Jill Dando.
WANTED:- Fujinon (Fuji) M42 (Screw on) lenses, let me know if you have anything.

[amrath]

I completely agree with everyone, buy a cheap second hand bike that is a well known make.

As for the marauder thing they are low and very comfortable, great for cruising and they have the space for some bags to go at the side etc.
great little bike, but they hold their value just as well as CG's and they cost a little more so you are looking at a higher price range there.

Keep a lookout for some bikes that might need a little bit of easy work doing to them as well. I got my Varadero for £800 when its worth between £2000 - £2500 just because it needed a little bit of work and a new paint job because the previous owner did a rubbish job.


the right bike will appear at some point don't worry, you just have to keep looking and be patient
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Current Bike: Honda Varadero XL125 V5

[Jesta_ZX6R]

[Crystal Tipps]

Thanks for all your comments.

Have finally found some reasonably priced bikes not too far from home, & went and sat on some today. Decided the Marauder probably isn't for me...the forward pegs felt a bit weird!

Liked both the CG and the YBR (though liked the price of the CG better, lol)...so now got to wait til Thursday to do my CBT and go from there.

I'm not really excited about it at all!

[hedgehugger]

Good Luck for the CBT

I couldn't sleep before mine lol, like a kid @ Christmas hehe

[Crystal Tipps]

[Teflon-Mike]

OK, Instructor Mode [on]

Starting out, you want as GOOD a bike as you can get.

Now, the unfortunate thing about Learner-Legal bikes is learners..... and 'commuters' who are often the same thing.

Next unfortunate thing is that learner bikes are little. Little bikes cost darn near as much to manufacture as big ones, but becouse they are little, they are slower, so people dont pay big money for litle bikes.

All this conspires to create a bike which is small, slow, and built down to a price.

Its then riddeen by people who dont know or care much about bikes, who ride them hard, trying to squeeze the speed they dont have out of them, often badly, mashing gears, yanking brakes, and generally being clumsy with them.

Then, becouse they dont intend hanging on to them, or they only want them for cheap transport, they resent spending any money or time looking after them.

This does NOT bode well for the long term durability of the typical learner-legal motorcycle!

In short, they are cheap little bikes, built down to the lowest possible quality, that then get thrashed, trashed and crashed by a succession of learner-commuters.

Now, as a learner, the MOST important thing you need is confidence. and the LAST thing you need, as YOU will be wobbly enough in your own riding to begin with, is a clapped out bike beneath you doing some wobbling of its own!

Idea of buying a 'Cheap' 125 becouse you 'ONLY' want it to do your test, and you ONLY want it for a little while, is, I'm afraid a bad start.

You want a 'good' 125, to give you a 'good' start. And if THAT means paying a bit over the odds and perhaps loosing a bit on resale, so be it. THAT is the 'price of experience'.

You can go looking for bargains, and putting up with bikes that have foibles when you have passed your test. AND once you have passed your test, there ARE bargains to be had.

ANY-ONE can ride a little bike, the demand is high, so prices are high.

Big-Bikes can only be ridden by qualified riders, so the demand is NOT so high, and MANY dont stick with bikes. Big bikes cost a lot to run, and many give up as the costs start mounting and enthusiasm dwindles or other interests or demands on disposeable take precedence.

And 'Big-Bikes' tend not to be so compromised in original build quality, or abused by incompetant riders, or neglected of essential maintenence.

With a grand in your pocket, you'll struggle to find a really good bike in the Learner-Legal market; best you'll get will be 'OK'.

With that same grand in the 'Big-Bike' market youll find a lot of bikes, and bikes with more performance, that are in much better condition, and of a higher original quality.

BUT those bikes are, at the moment, beyond you, you HAVE to get a licence first.

UNLESS you go DAS, and 'skip' the aprenticeship on a little bike all-together.

Worth a thought. Its expensive, especially if you dont pass, BUT all told, it CAN be as ecconomical, and a much better start than trying to skimp on a Learner-Legal 'first-bike'.

Down-side is that you get basically three days of intensive training, and having passed, you have STILL got to get through those early days riding solo, but on a bigger bike.

To be honest, though, big-bikes CAN be easier to ride. with more weight and more power, they are less demanding, and more forgiving of a 'bit' of clumsyness. BUT you DO have to be sensible. Even though you might have passed DAS, you are still a learner, and on a Big-Bike, with pottentially a LOT of performance you could use to get yourself into trouble VERY quickly. Remember the throttle goes both ways, and dont let your confidence out-strip your competance, though, and you SHOULD be OK.

Going back to Learner-Legals:-

It IS perplexing, and teh advice IS contradictory, and it CAN all get 'too-much'.

But, take it a step at a time. Rushing is a sure way to get hurt on a bike, so just take it at your own pace, and NOT try and worry about too much, too soon.

First thing you need is CBT.

Instructors There will give you a LOT of useful advice and encouragement, and with some 'hands-on' training, it should all start to make more sense.

So, do your CBT, and see how it goes. Then worry about the rest.

As for Chinese bikes; their knockers are part right, thier fans are part right, there's no black and white. Dont dismiss them, weigh them on merit along side everything else.

A Brand New Chinese 125 wont have the performance or build quality of a Jap, and it certainly wont have the resale. But it WILL be cheaper, and for your money you should get a newer, less abused bike. But being built to a lower standard, how clapped out it'll be in comparison, for your money, is a bit of a lottery.

[Crystal Tipps]

Wot a long post! Thank you...I can see where you're coming from on many issues there, and I am certainly looking forward to learning a lot from the instructor during my CBT. I fully intend to go at my own pace...I've no need to rush, have nothing to prove, and fully expect to be a bit slow as I'm a bit long in the tooth to be learning a load of new stuff, but if anyone else has a problem with that on the day then it will be their problem, not mine! I just want to know what I'm meant to be doing and keep as safe as I can.

As for cost of a first bike, I didn't want to have to take out a mortgage and I'm happy with the deal I've got for £1,200, and I don't mind how long I keep it for, getting gradually "bike-wise" and some confidence.

I also got some good advice on helmets today, and that's an area where I'm not going to skimp on quality...I'm happy to pay a fair bit of money to protect my head...as far as I know I only get one, so I plan to take care of it

As for insurance...I have shopped around and it's not going to cost all that much (as I'm not in the first bloom of youth) so that's not a big issue.

All in all I'm simply looking forward to getting out there & enjoying biking, as it's what I've wanted to do for many years, but just not had the means or opportunity until now.

[Freaky_1]

A touch off topic at this point (Great choice on the CG btw), but for future reference, I thought I'd add this.

We've had a few chinese clones come in and one was abandoned after repairs.

For starters, a visual of the "forks" will almost always show smaller diameter and weaker material.

We stripped down a chinese yamaha clone and compared it component for component with the real thing (80s yamaha). (250)

First thing of note was that the yamaha barrels are MUCH heavier. First visual showed MUCH more meat on the yamaha bores.

Pretty much every component was this way, step for step. When we finally got down to bare frames, the Yamaha took both hands to lift, where the chinese was easily lifted with one hand. Tried the peen hammer test and killed a chinese frame where as the Yamaha needed the paint touched up.

I don't recall the exact model name, but will dig through our pics at my work and find out when I get a chance.

That's the component for component check. Now for the fun. 90% of the chinese bikes we work on are all for electrical issues. Poor connections, poor crimps, lack of weather sealing, light gauge wire, and numerous chafing shorts are the largest culprits.

In short, I will and do buy chinese bikes, but never for more than scrap value, to have used spares on hand. Mostly though, we get them for under 100 and just have fun killing them trying to do what the Japanese bikes readily do.

EDIT: almost forgot to add. The second most common is valve adjustment. Seems every chinese 4 cycle engine we've had a chance to deal with, has been bad to stretch valves / peen seats. Miced valve stems on above bikes and a DRAMATIC difference in size. Not sure on the seats, as I've never pulled one to see if it was poor materials or poor fitting, but my assumption is first the first and second the second. lol

[Crystal Tipps]

Finally got my CG and loving getting out & about