ONE FOR THE BODY SHOP GUYS & ZXR61

stirlinggaz · World Chat Champion Joined: 22 Jul 2007 Karma :

hi all,
im spraying some panels & want to do a decent job, using the gravity fed,hvlp gun & compressor.
i've done a couple of things before so im getting up to a half decent standard.
obviously its all in the preparation,right?
previously i have used isopon bumper fill, P38 & cataloy or whatever i have lying around, for reparing scratches,holes etc.
im confident filling/bridging the bigger holes with fibreglass matting etc, my problem is the finer stuff.
pin holes,fine scratches etc. & especially where old paint has flaked off & ineed to fill it proud with the surface.
when i fill & then sand down, im always left with a visible patch.
should i be using something else? then using filler pimer before my basecoat?
i seem to spend ages on the smallest bits! & still dont get it right!
is there a product that is good for skimming across the top of plastic bike panels.
1 more question, im using the 2 pack system.
basecoat then lacquer with hardner but prior to basecoat, is it ok to use 1k filler primer, like mipa rapid filler? i have used it before i think, & it was ok at filling v. small pin holes etc.
is there anything else, better?
cheers,
GAZ

ZRX61 · Victor Meldrew Joined: 05 Nov 2003 Karma :

Long time since I used any UK products, but basically you need enough primer over the mud so that when it's prepped for basecoat you can't see ANY evidence of the filler.
I use FeatherFilG2 or SlickSand:
https://www.autobodytoolmart.com/evercoat-paint-products-c-621.aspx

It's basically a VERY runny filler that you hose on with your primer cannon through a 2.2 tip & it goes on THICK.

When it dries it has the ripply effect you see on flat parts of the beach where the tide has gone out... so there's quite a bit of sanding involved.

So hose on a couple of coats, guidecoat it & sand.
Repeat in needed.

Then a sealer, I use (reduced) epoxy made by PPG, but this will work:
https://www.autobodytoolmart.com/transtar-2k-epoxy-primer-sealer-gray-6131-p-16354.aspx

Then basecoat/clear coat etc...

stirlinggaz · World Chat Champion Joined: 22 Jul 2007 Karma :

Hi,
(apologies for name being mis-spelt)
that sounds like the sort of thing im looking for.
something thick (i have a 2.5mm tip) & creamy that will go on by gun or even by hand, like skimmed over the top of scratched parts?
then build up the high build primer till theres no trace?
unfortunately., i think the products you linked to are not available in UK.
usually its ISOPON stuff thats used (for fillers etc & they do produce a fairly extensive & confusing range of fillers,lol) or MIPA stuff for paint products (like their hi-build primer, RAPIDFILLER i think its called).
so, if anyone knows what i need let me know!

im thinking of something..... like if a plasterer fills a hole in a wall, he might use normal plaster at first, then to finish it off, he might use a finishing plaster.
a smooth finish product thats ready for painting.

its something like that i need for plastics.
i can bridge a large hole with mesh & resin, making a fibreglass bridge.
then i can fill up with filler, but i need something to finish it off , as the stuff i have used previously (basically cataloy) isnt the best, as it shrinks, cracks, gets pin-holes etc but its cheap, which is why i think its popular!
the other products i have tried using,so far, have involved using a hardner & getting the ratio right is a bit of a nightmare!
even the "easy sand" (P38) stuff, turns out like roughcast if you use even the slightest bit too much hardner & if you dont use enough, it doesnt set properly!

cheers,
GAZ

ZRX61 · Victor Meldrew Joined: 05 Nov 2003 Karma :

Fuck me, I'm looking online for UK auto refinishing suppliers & there's just about absolutely fuck all out there. How the hell is anyone suposed to paint a car in the UK??

Managed to find this place that has high build....:

https://auto-paint.co.uk/carpaint/index.php?act=viewCat&catId=42

ZRX61 · Victor Meldrew Joined: 05 Nov 2003 Karma :

Fiberglass doesn't bond with other plastics btw...

ZRX61 · Victor Meldrew Joined: 05 Nov 2003 Karma :

Just found this place that looked promising..

https://www.autopaintsupplies.co.uk/automotive.html

& then I clicked on their website & found that they show NOTHING of any fucking use whatsoever.. Just "email us details"
WTF?? Seriously, just WTF??

Is there ANY place in the UK like this:

www.autobodytoolmart.com

stirlinggaz · World Chat Champion Joined: 22 Jul 2007 Karma :

Hi,
can you now see my problem,lol?
theres a little place in the next town which i have used a few times & he only really stocks mipa paints & isopon stuff (& i think some u-pol stuff) but you really have to know what your looking for.
everythings behind the counter & its sometimes staffed by the son/wife who are not as good as the father when it comes to advice.
He IS good at advice though & i may just take a trip & see what he says.

theres a couple of places on ebay that seem to stock the sort of things that might be suitable, like this stuff/place https://cgi.ebay.co.uk/U-POL-PLAST-X-6-Polyester-Plastic-Filler-Primer-600ml-/260632284797?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_Body_Shop_Supplies_Paint&hash=item3caee50e7d
as they seem quite reasonable, do cheap postage & seem to do everything i need. (filler & high build filler/primer etc)
what do you think?
cheers,
GAZ

stirlinggaz · World Chat Champion Joined: 22 Jul 2007 Karma :

finpos · World Chat Champion Joined: 13 Sep 2005 Karma :

For paint supplies in the uk, you have to look in yellow pages to find the address in some backwater industrial estate of the people who supply all the local dodgy bodyshops. Then you better know what you want before you walk in because the bloke behind the counter has not yet been on a customer satisfaction training course or seemingly any training course relating to paint.

Regarding filler - you need to be cautious as it'll bond superficially but once you start using the bike the vibration and flexing will eeantually cause it to crack and you'll cry when you recall all the hours you put into it.

f.

tutton · World Chat Champion Joined: 04 Jan 2008 Karma :

I havnt read nearly all the above posts may of already been covered, but what it sounds like your wanting is stopper.
common bodyshop brand being TopStop, another being Plastic padding stopper
Stopper is like filler but good for filling imperfections in filler, smoothing and small scratches, its ususally so smooth once applied it only needs a quick sand with 320/400 before being ready.
____________________
Past: '05 Peugeot XPS '99 Aprillia RS125 '94 FZR600R
Current: '02 ZX636 A1P '51 CCM R30

stirlinggaz · World Chat Champion Joined: 22 Jul 2007 Karma :

ZRX61 · Victor Meldrew Joined: 05 Nov 2003 Karma :

It's called glaze, don't use the stuff that comes in squeezy tubes that's already mixed tho...

Use something like this:

https://www.autobodytoolmart.com/evercoat-euro-soft-polyester-glazing-putty-p-15570.aspx

or

https://www.autobodytoolmart.com/evercoat-glaze-coat-417-p-16701.aspx

or

https://www.autobodytoolmart.com/evercoat-glaze-it-finishing-putty-410-p-14782.aspx

or you can make your own..... just take whatever filler you are using & add more fiberglass resin to it... but not too much.. & then add hardener as usual...

oldmanstoner · Derestricted Danger Joined: 25 Jul 2010 Karma :

ZRX61 · Victor Meldrew Joined: 05 Nov 2003 Karma :

stirlinggaz · World Chat Champion Joined: 22 Jul 2007 Karma :

stirlinggaz · World Chat Champion Joined: 22 Jul 2007 Karma :

that place on ebay i mentioned a few posts back, seems to have just about everything i need, which im quite chuffed about AND they only charge you for one lot of postage.RESULT indeed.
going to give U-POL DOLPHIN GLAZE a try, good reviews all over internet.
use this to do final skim before spraying with MIPA RAPIDFILLER or similar (4+1?), then basecoat?
then clearcoat,
finish off with hand-glaze?( FARECLA BLACK TOP - which i dont think this place has Crying or Very sad

but think i still have some left over)
does sound like a plan?
want to make a REALLY good job of this, hence the time spent researching preparation.
the bikes nothing special, but fancied the challenge of doing a full re-spray but with concourse results. (a bit too ambitious?) as i've painted a few panels & done couple of full re-sprays & i have been fairly pleased with the finished article.
so next logical step would be to see how good i can do it, using the right products, still only using the one colour as im a bit wary of masking after some bad results.

already got :
the basecoat-a one off shade of mettalic blue
the clearcoat : 7.5l of VALSPAR UNI VARNISH (probably a wee drop more than i need,lol but got it cheap)
plenty of wet & dry from 240 right up to 2000
compound,gun-wash etc, so just the fillers/primers & im ready to start next week!
expect more silly questions when i've done the clearcoat.lol (like what next? when to polish etc)
cheers,
GAZ

finpos · World Chat Champion Joined: 13 Sep 2005 Karma :

Pretty hard to get a concourse result in a garage, but with perseverance you can get a very good finish that only the most anal will pick up on.

There's a trick to masking (besides using the proper tape you get from the bodyshop place) -

Paint with your base colour. Then apply the tape. Then paint onto the masking with the base colour again. If it's going to bleed, it'll bleed the base colour. Then put on the second colour; you need to be brave and do this all quite quickly so you can pull off the tape before the paint gets too hard.

f.

ZRX61 · Victor Meldrew Joined: 05 Nov 2003 Karma :

stirlinggaz · World Chat Champion Joined: 22 Jul 2007 Karma :

ZRX61 · Victor Meldrew Joined: 05 Nov 2003 Karma :

stirlinggaz · World Chat Champion Joined: 22 Jul 2007 Karma :

ZRX61 · Victor Meldrew Joined: 05 Nov 2003 Karma :

hondafatboy · L Plate Warrior Joined: 06 Feb 2002 Karma :

Hunt down a guy called Angry Painter on The Revcounter forum site.

He's a pro (mad as a bag of frogs, but a pro)

HFB

stirlinggaz · World Chat Champion Joined: 22 Jul 2007 Karma :

tutton · World Chat Champion Joined: 04 Jan 2008 Karma :

Sounds to me like your using gash filler,
ratio rule of thumb is a pea size of hardener to a golf ball filler..
ive never had filler too hard to sand myself, try a filler that advertises easy sand on the pot..
stopper is only good for finishing ontop of filler or small scratches etc.
____________________
Past: '05 Peugeot XPS '99 Aprillia RS125 '94 FZR600R
Current: '02 ZX636 A1P '51 CCM R30