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ollieholt
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PostPosted: 01:25 - 08 Jan 2011    Post subject: clever tech Reply with quote

https://www.youtube.com/user/lolzing4gifs#p/u/37/7e-sCY4xLfU

love it when he kicks it! wow. looks weird.

then of course the take piss

https://www.youtube.com/user/lolzing4gifs#p/u/35/iYwHHzziXNE
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Frost
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PostPosted: 01:38 - 08 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's also littledog. My supervisor worked on it. It may look and sound like junk, but it's extremely complex and is dynamically stable, e.g when kicked it anticipates where it has to put each leg to stabilise itself.
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L4Isoside
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PostPosted: 01:45 - 08 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah seen that before, scary/creepy thing but very clever Thumbs Up
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 03:09 - 08 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Speaking as someone who is used to asessing the neurological function of quadrupeds. That is a mind-blowingly awesome piece of technology. They seem to have built fine proprioceptive reflexes into a robot. I treat dogs with neuro problems whose balance and fine motor control is much worse.

One comment. The limb joint arrangement is wrong. Every quadruped you'll find after millions of years of evolution, often on totally seperate pathways, has the same arrangement. Essentially they have the front legs at the back and the back legs at the front on that robot. Quadrupeds also almost universally have a 70:30 front:back weight distribution.

Swap the limbs round and rearrange the weight distribution and it'll be able to run and jump. Balance and stability from the front legs, power from the rear.

The possabilities for prosthetic limb design that thing presents are revolutionary.

DaFrostyOne. If you're still in touch with those guys, get them to contact a veterinary anatomist and a human prosthetics engineer and show them that video.
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Frost
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PostPosted: 04:12 - 08 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

My PhD is in prosthetics Wink
Keep in mind that functionality is the goal, not replication of a natural system. e.g an aeroplane isn't judged on how bird like it is, so why judge robots on how animal / human like they are?
Limb joint design is often a trade off between speed and torque along with stability vs range of motion. You can bet those guys spent a great deal of time working on that joint configuration so they'll have their reasons for it being like that. It moves like a human / monkey on all fours rather than like a true quadruped.

Here's little dog:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nUQsRPJ1dYw

Of course none of this helps upper limb prosthetics where compliance and user control are the main problems.
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Carl_steveo
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PostPosted: 04:59 - 08 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

I swear when this first popped up I was adamant somebody had created a dog/robot hybrid. It's far tooo fucking creepy to be in existence.
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Frost
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PostPosted: 05:52 - 08 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

The uncanny valley. It's something writte by freud that explains why people don't like it, It's trying to trick them and they're not happy about it.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f0/Mori_Uncanny_Valley.svg/461px-Mori_Uncanny_Valley.svg.png

So generally the freakier it is, the better, until one day it will be so good it becomes acceptable. I know this seems like a big jump when it comes to humans, but imagine a prosthetic arm... It looks like a robot, your a bit wary of it. It Looks almost human, when you notice it's cold and not real, you'll freak out. It looks and feels and acts real, you will accept it as the norm.

Theres a guy in the lab with a load of robot heads on his desk, they're freaky as fuck. ou get used to them though until you see his head move when he's sat at his desk, then you shit yourself Laughing
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Frost
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PostPosted: 05:54 - 08 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gotta love SVG images. Transparent background and infinate clarity at any zoom level. *Nerdgasm*
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 10:21 - 08 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

DaFrostyOne wrote:
My PhD is in prosthetics Wink
Keep in mind that functionality is the goal, not replication of a natural system. e.g an aeroplane isn't judged on how bird like it is, so why judge robots on how animal / human like they are?


True, but why then give it legs? Tracks are easier and better (sure you've seen that tracked segway thing). They even called it big dog. They have obviously based its reflex system on nature too.

Monkeys and humans are crap at moving on all fours. Monkeys are designed to swing in trees, humans are just weird. They should've put their motion capture on a dog, not a student.

I want to see that robot but with a hock joint at the back. It works for mammals and reptiles and it worked for dinosaurs. There has been sufficient evolutionary oppertunity to develop a hock and carpus that bends the other way. The fact that it hasn't suggests it's not as good.
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LordShaftesbu...
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PostPosted: 11:16 - 08 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah but then evolution didn't have titanium, electric motors, hydraulic pistons and Kevlar to work with. Sure you could maybe point to biological equivalents (bone, muscles etc.), but still, the different properties of the artificial materials may well open up directions in which evolution could not go.

Not just materials either, there are structures which organisms cannot create, e.g. wheels or truly freely-rotating joints*. That's not so much a problem of materials as the fact that biological structures need to grow into existence.

The robot may not have wheels (or tracks), but I bet there's plenty of components that evolution could never find simply due to the fact that they cannot be grown.

Looking to nature is great for inspiration, but you needn't try to copy it exactly because you don't have to worry about the same limitations (you have other, different, limitations of course).


*Ok so the bacterial flagellum is an example, but it's an odd one out.
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LordShaftesbu...
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PostPosted: 11:26 - 08 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

DaFrostyOne wrote:
There's also littledog. My supervisor worked on it. It may look and sound like junk, but it's extremely complex and is dynamically stable, e.g when kicked it anticipates where it has to put each leg to stabilise itself.


I saw the video of it a while ago and just about spunked it's so cool. I mean, it really looks alive!
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silky666
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PostPosted: 11:32 - 08 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

That video has always given me the creeps.

The bit where it recovers from being kicked especially so.
Dont know why ... just does.
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ollieholt
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PostPosted: 11:53 - 08 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

silky666 wrote:
That video has always given me the creeps.

The bit where it recovers from being kicked especially so.
Dont know why ... just does.


me too, we are programmed so far to see a robot as inferior but this one has a natural motion to it that is freaky, i agree with the freud post, if it was dressed as a fluffy animal it would be easier to accept.
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pinkyfloyd
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PostPosted: 12:52 - 08 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

It didnt spook me in any way. I thought it was rather clever.

However this little bugger scares the pants off me.

Asimo

On no level is that natural. The human walking movement is a complex series of movements that is very hard to replicate. The fact that Honda have done it so well disturbs me. Its just a little too lifelike for my liking.
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Paxovasa
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PostPosted: 13:01 - 08 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Asimo walks like he shit himself Laughing

Just for you Pinky Thumbs Up

https://chandlersfantasyblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/I.Robot.jpg
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pinkyfloyd
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PostPosted: 13:16 - 08 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Paxovasa wrote:
Asimo walks like he shit himself Laughing

Just for you Pinky Thumbs Up

https://chandlersfantasyblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/I.Robot.jpg


That doesnt bother me. I know it was just a movie. That asimo wasnt. Its all too much a step towards terminator Laughing
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illuminateTHEmind wrote: I am just more evolved than most of you guys... this allows me to pick of things quickly which would have normally taken the common man years to master
Hockeystorm65:.well there are childish arguments...there are very childish arguments.....there are really stupid childish arguments and now there are......Pinkfloyd arguments!
Teflon-Mike:I think I agree with just about all Pinky has said.
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Frost
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PostPosted: 13:38 - 08 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

stinkwheel wrote:

True, but why then give it legs? Tracks are easier and better (sure you've seen that tracked segway thing). They even called it big dog. They have obviously based its reflex system on nature too.


Legs are better on rough ground than tracks. Tracks are better than wheels. But wheels are more efficient than tracks, and tracks more efficient that legs. So it's a matter of what you want really. There are also things called 'Whegs' which are a cross between wheels and legs. They're less efficient than wheels, but work on rougher terrain.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4GF2UFhv8Y
That video shows the adjustable gait of the robot to mimic that of a cockroach.

Chances are that bigdog is based on whats called the subsumption architecture. This is the coding in of each behaviour seperately, then they all come together to form an emergent behaviour. e.g code in stability, then seperately code in recovery, and walking. Run all at once and the outcome attempts to do them all.

If anybody wants i'm sure i could post up some papers on bigdog?
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Carl_steveo
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PostPosted: 13:59 - 08 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

pinkyfloyd wrote:
However this little bugger scares the pants off me.


Don't worry pinky, if he comes at you just go upstairs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YruAOxWG5uU&feature=related


DaFrostyOne wrote:
That video shows the adjustable gait of the robot to mimic that of a cockroach.


Was there a cockroach on a treadmill in that video. Confused
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pinkyfloyd
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PostPosted: 14:07 - 08 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Carl_steveo wrote:
pinkyfloyd wrote:
However this little bugger scares the pants off me.


Don't worry pinky, if he comes at you just go upstairs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YruAOxWG5uU&feature=related



Thats because it was tryin to be cocky. If you look on the one I posted the little bugger was looking where it was going and analysing every step. On the one you posted the thing was posing for the crowd probably working out who its going to kill first.
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illuminateTHEmind wrote: I am just more evolved than most of you guys... this allows me to pick of things quickly which would have normally taken the common man years to master
Hockeystorm65:.well there are childish arguments...there are very childish arguments.....there are really stupid childish arguments and now there are......Pinkfloyd arguments!
Teflon-Mike:I think I agree with just about all Pinky has said.
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ollieholt
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PostPosted: 14:10 - 08 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

james may did a thing on robots and azimo was in it, its ability to learn objects and names and then apply it to unkown objects was unreal, well on its way to full auto-intelligence.

azimo doesn't spook me at all to be fair, one with guns and shit might, oh and a self sustaining power source.
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Carl_steveo
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PostPosted: 14:31 - 08 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Last thing we need though is an army of Big Dogs led by Azimo's.

Toyota made one that can play violin, they is taking over everything already.
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pinkyfloyd
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PostPosted: 16:12 - 08 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Carl_steveo wrote:
Last thing we need though is an army of Big Dogs led by Azimo's.

Toyota made one that can play violin, they is taking over everything already.


Big dogs led by azimo's playing the violin. Now that is a scary thought!
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illuminateTHEmind wrote: I am just more evolved than most of you guys... this allows me to pick of things quickly which would have normally taken the common man years to master
Hockeystorm65:.well there are childish arguments...there are very childish arguments.....there are really stupid childish arguments and now there are......Pinkfloyd arguments!
Teflon-Mike:I think I agree with just about all Pinky has said.
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ollieholt
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PostPosted: 16:32 - 08 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

dying listening to mozart, could be worse... unless.....

what if the play venessa may?!?!!! or enya!!!!!

were all fucked... Praying The world's smallest violin player, just for you! Hurt
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Visitor Q
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PostPosted: 11:06 - 10 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know this is just programmed movement, but I always thought this was awesome.

Especially how they drop the flags.

Qrio Dancing

Will be nice to see where the jipnaps are in 50 years.
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GhostRider
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PostPosted: 12:16 - 10 Jan 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

DaFrostyOne wrote:
stinkwheel wrote:

True, but why then give it legs? Tracks are easier and better (sure you've seen that tracked segway thing). They even called it big dog. They have obviously based its reflex system on nature too.


Legs are better on rough ground than tracks. Tracks are better than wheels. But wheels are more efficient than tracks, and tracks more efficient that legs. So it's a matter of what you want really. There are also things called 'Whegs' which are a cross between wheels and legs. They're less efficient than wheels, but work on rougher terrain.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4GF2UFhv8Y
That video shows the adjustable gait of the robot to mimic that of a cockroach.

Chances are that bigdog is based on whats called the subsumption architecture. This is the coding in of each behaviour seperately, then they all come together to form an emergent behaviour. e.g code in stability, then seperately code in recovery, and walking. Run all at once and the outcome attempts to do them all.

If anybody wants i'm sure i could post up some papers on bigdog?


I guess the next thing is to develop real life "Transformers", such that they can switch to tracks for say desert terrain, then transform to big dog legs when they hit a rocky ascent.

Very cool anyway, and I for one welcome our Robot Overlords.

GhostRider
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