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chris-red
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PostPosted: 16:37 - 18 Feb 2011    Post subject: Offroading illegally Reply with quote

A quick question, I saw a while back a load of people ragging around MX bikes on a patch of waste land.

This land is clearly fit for no other purpose, there is a pylon in the middle of it, the ground is a mix of mud and rocks, nothing you would want your kids to play on or dog to walk on. I am assuming these guy where here illegally.

There is a road entrance which has 2 fence posts with a chain which you could easily squeeze a bike past.

If you where caught by the old bill on this land what would be the punishment? I have no intention of causing trouble of damaging anything, just thing when I get an offroad bike this would be a good place to practice near my house.
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chris-red
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PostPosted: 16:38 - 18 Feb 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Search 51.488308, 0.241726 on google maps.
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Skudd:- Perhaps she just thinks you are a window licker and is being nice just in case she becomes another Jill Dando.
WANTED:- Fujinon (Fuji) M42 (Screw on) lenses, let me know if you have anything.
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Imonster
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PostPosted: 16:49 - 18 Feb 2011    Post subject: Re: Offroading illegally Reply with quote

chris-red wrote:


If you where caught by the old bill on this land what would be the punishment?


Likely a Section 59. Keep your numberplate muddy. Don't get caught. Looking at it on streetview it's far too open for my liking though...

No lanes near there?
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chris-red
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PostPosted: 16:59 - 18 Feb 2011    Post subject: Re: Offroading illegally Reply with quote

Imonster wrote:
chris-red wrote:


If you where caught by the old bill on this land what would be the punishment?


Likely a Section 59. Keep your numberplate muddy. Don't get caught. Looking at it on streetview it's far too open for my liking though...

No lanes near there?


Nah doesn't seem to be anything nearby. I had no intention of running, from the fuzz, it is pretty open Maybe I'll avoid that then. Thumbs Up
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Well, you know what they say. If you want to save the world, you have to push a few old ladies down the stairs.
Skudd:- Perhaps she just thinks you are a window licker and is being nice just in case she becomes another Jill Dando.
WANTED:- Fujinon (Fuji) M42 (Screw on) lenses, let me know if you have anything.
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Imonster
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PostPosted: 17:03 - 18 Feb 2011    Post subject: Re: Offroading illegally Reply with quote

chris-red wrote:


Nah doesn't seem to be anything nearby. I had no intention of running, from the fuzz, it is pretty open Maybe I'll avoid that then. Thumbs Up


Loads not too far from you around Rochester and a little closer - have a look on:

www.bywaydatabase.com

I would never advocate circumventing the arrival of po po when being somewhere a bit naughty Thumbs Up

*cough*
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clancy
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PostPosted: 17:09 - 18 Feb 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

section 59 would be my bet, or trespassing
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silky666
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PostPosted: 17:18 - 18 Feb 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dont listen to IMonster ... I think it was him that got me in trouble last time at the Chalk Pit Thinking

Just dont do it ... in fact if you do, I hope you get Police
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Imonster
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PostPosted: 17:30 - 18 Feb 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

silky666 wrote:
Dont listen to IMonster - I think it was him that got me in trouble last time at the Chalk Pit Thinking



You boys went there of your own volition Mr Silky Tut Tut

In fact, given that I'd ridden down there without any trouble on countless occasions in the past without the arrival of our friendly peace keepers I wonder if one of you had tipped them off Thinking

Wink
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silky666
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PostPosted: 17:35 - 18 Feb 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Imonster wrote:
I wonder if one of you had tipped them off Thinking

Wink

I do like my rules Wink

I have the 'stop/search' certificate framed on my garage wall Thumbs Up
Quite chuffed of my brush with the law ... I felt all Moat.
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ChowderV4
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PostPosted: 17:39 - 18 Feb 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Depends, when i was 16 ish i used to go offroading all the time, Geevor/Levant tin mine etc. All national trust land generally i was ok riding there as long as you slowed for walkers etc.
But we did get the odd complaint, i got a section something? that said if i was caught again my bike would be crushed

....i got caught about 5 more times and nothing happened but that may have been the young age sympathy going on.

Just dont stay in one place for too long where you know people will hear/see you.
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Imonster
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PostPosted: 17:55 - 18 Feb 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

silky666 wrote:

Quite chuffed of my brush with the law ... I felt all Moat.


Laughing
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mad4it028
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PostPosted: 18:22 - 18 Feb 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

in the 80s there was loads of places waiste land ect you could ride wasnt 100%legal but nobody bothered police would come check frame and engine numbers and you were on your way again
i used to ride hempstead vally and many chalk pits around medway towns with out issue ,
now you cant fart in these places without some do gooder complaining Middle Finger
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yen_powell
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PostPosted: 09:42 - 21 Feb 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Police don't do you for trespass, the landowner has to take you to court and sue you for the damages caused by your trespass.

The damage is usually a few pence worth of grass ruined, the court costs are the killer. Me and two others were sued for trespass by a land owner in Hertfordshire, we never lost, he never won, he was awarded costs. He asked for about 70k, he was trying to offload costs from a previous law suite he's mucked up, he ended up with about 38k.

Luckily the TRF covered our costs, later on the highway authority declared our route to in fact be a carriageway, as we had argued all the way through.

The landowner went to appeal with some very expensive barristers and it is now a bridleway. He was actually pushing to stop foot and horse use as well, despite it being shown on maps from the 1700s as a main road.
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Hetzer
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PostPosted: 10:03 - 21 Feb 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

silky666 wrote:
Imonster wrote:
I wonder if one of you had tipped them off Thinking

Wink

I do like my rules Wink

I have the 'stop/search' certificate framed on my garage wall Thumbs Up
Quite chuffed of my brush with the law ... I felt all Moat.


The pigs came and gave agg for being in the Lewes chalk-pit?
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Wafer_Thin_Ham
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PostPosted: 10:17 - 21 Feb 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't do it kids.

The more people that do it, the more it gives the ramblers ammunition to close the few rights of way we do have.
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chris-red
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PostPosted: 10:54 - 21 Feb 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Everywhere I look I see land that would be perfect to take a bike on Laughing
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Well, you know what they say. If you want to save the world, you have to push a few old ladies down the stairs.
Skudd:- Perhaps she just thinks you are a window licker and is being nice just in case she becomes another Jill Dando.
WANTED:- Fujinon (Fuji) M42 (Screw on) lenses, let me know if you have anything.
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silky666
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PostPosted: 11:14 - 21 Feb 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hetzer wrote:
The pigs came and gave agg for being in the Lewes chalk-pit?

Or using more acceptable language: Yes, the local constabulary sent their finest Community Officer to clear us from the Chalk Pit.

Factual Background:
1) The naughty boys MikeJ and Imonster invited the SE Originals (Joe, Myself, Philo etc) to "come down to this place where we are allowed to ride, and its great and everyone does it so its fine ".
2) We turn up and find that to access this chalk pit we have to navigate a number of purpose built access blockades (mounds of dirt and metal barriers).
3) We are of course assured that " this is fine and its always been like this".

4) We then have a good 3 or so hours of rip roaring fun.
Some great riding ... some horrible climbs .. and watching IMonster throw an old TTR around like a loony.
A few other off roading types join us and there are no dramas of local people complaining etc.

5) I am at the far end of the pit (its a big place) when I notice everyone either:
a) Hiding in bushes or b) scurrying to bikes and riding quickly around the edge towards the exit.

6) Like some sort of moth being drawn to a flame ... I decide to ride towards this official looking chap in the middle of the pit.
He appears flustered as numerous bikes avoid him and roar off into the distance / exit.

By the time I realise I am riding towards a rozzer .. Its too late.
In my defence, I did try to challenge him on his right to take my details (he was a PCSO and I am still unsure if I legally have to give my details) .... But being the good law abiding citizen I am, I thought better of it and took my 'certificate' like a man (lemming ?).
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michael j
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PostPosted: 19:50 - 21 Feb 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Firstly, I would like to point out that I am one of the SE Originals and secondly, ha ha you mug! lol
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Imonster
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PostPosted: 19:55 - 21 Feb 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

michael j wrote:
ha ha you mug!


+1

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Imonster
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PostPosted: 20:11 - 21 Feb 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Big_Ham wrote:
Don't do it kids.

The more people that do it, the more it gives the ramblers ammunition to close the few rights of way we do have.


Agreed in principle. Except the Lewes Chalk pit has no rights of way for anybody running through it that I'm aware of. It's completely disused, in a "bowl" and has no neighbours to disturb anywhere nearby other than a dog kennels - obviously well known for their quiet atmosphere...

I'm not convinced that illegal riding "shuts down lanes" anyway - one look at GLEAM's website tells you that they won't be happy until ALL vehicular access from the countryside is removed regardless of the legality of the routes or not. Though I stick to legal routes these days, your attitude towards other users is far more important than the classification of a lane.

Route A is a Byway: There are ten of you in a group, riding at speed down it down it. A rambler objects, someone in your group responds with "fuck off, I'm allowed to be here." or words to that effect (not conjecture, I've seen it happen)

Route B is a Bridleway; two of you are bimbling down it and you come across a horse. You pull over immediately, kill your engines and remove your lids if the horse is still acting a bit skittish. You have a friendly chat with the other users and then move on when it's safe to do so.

Which group has caused more damage to the image of bikes in the countryside?
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garyd
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PostPosted: 15:57 - 22 Feb 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

B............as they were riding illegally ,group A should have knocked him silly for obstructing vehicles on a road
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silky666
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PostPosted: 16:05 - 22 Feb 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Imonster wrote:

Route B is a Bridleway; two of you are bimbling down it and you come across a horse. You pull over immediately, kill your engines and remove your lids if the horse is still acting a bit skittish. You have a friendly chat with the other users and then move on when it's safe to do so.

Which group has caused more damage to the image of bikes in the countryside?

I kind of get your point ..... but there is a slight flaw.
Being of horsey background .... I cannot think of any time when an experienced horse person would have a "have a friendly chat" if you were riding down a bridleway Shocked

I am a confused person.
One part of me want to stick to the legal byways and be polite even in the face of the abuse that we get on an hourly basis from the rambliars.
The other part of me want to say "fu*k it ... its a lost cause anyway" and ride where I want and give twice the amount of abuse back.

Maybe other BCF off-roaders could give their views and advise me on what stance I should take this year Smile
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Wafer_Thin_Ham
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PostPosted: 16:11 - 22 Feb 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Imonster wrote:

I'm not convinced that illegal riding "shuts down lanes" anyway - one look at GLEAM's website tells you that they won't be happy until ALL vehicular access from the countryside is removed regardless of the legality of the routes or not.


This is true, however they see us as hooligans, and the more we pander to that image by riding illegally/abusing ramblers etc, the more likely the councillors are to side with the ramblers.

I think we need to be whiter than white to even stand a chance of keeping them open.
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chris-red
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PostPosted: 16:13 - 22 Feb 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have been thinking about this after hearing about Rambliars and watching Svens video. I figure the best thing to do is be as polite as possible, if they kick of when you are in the right and you stay chilled, they will look and feel like a twat and you can keep an feeling smugness for quite a while. Thumbs Up
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Well, you know what they say. If you want to save the world, you have to push a few old ladies down the stairs.
Skudd:- Perhaps she just thinks you are a window licker and is being nice just in case she becomes another Jill Dando.
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garyd
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PostPosted: 16:42 - 22 Feb 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Making them feel a twat wont change the legallity of the lanes or their ability to report you /argue with you .....whereas, a 70s style rag dolling quits their jibber jabber and will make them think twice before either ,walking that way again or mouthing off to you ,number plate fell off and is in your rucksack,every other week keep your hand in at the local footy match Laughing
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