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jako-aerox-hawky
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SpannerMonkey
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Nope.
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 Posted: 21:22 - 31 May 2011  Post subject: |
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Nothing if you want it too last the year.
Im assuming that your on a Provisional licence and a CBT? If so, any modification to your moped is illegal and may wind you up in a lot of trouble. Of course, you probably already know this.
Why not just save whatever ridiculous amount of money your going to spend on 'tuning' a moped on getting a full bike licence when your 17 and then getting a proper bike.
If you had bothered to do ANY research at all on bolt-on tuning a moped you would have found a few things out:
1) It massively reduces re-sale costs as its obvious to any potential buyer that the moped has been ragged about and therefore they will probably look elsewhere.
2) You risk reliability. You risk snapped cranks, damaged rings, seizing etc. etc.
3) Your pretty much wasting your money for very little gain. A massively 'tuned' moped will probably put out 12BHP. By this point you've spent over £1000 on tuning only for it too blow up a week later.
But, after all that, if you still want too go ahead, your gonna want too do:
1) 70CC/80CC kit. 2 Rings for reliability. I suggest Malossi simply for reliability and quality.
2) Malossi racing crank and bearings. This will reduce the risk of a snapped cranks.
3) 28mm Malossi/Dellorto carb
4) Malossi variator
5) Malossi Fly Clutch
6) Malossi Gear up Kit to enable you to actually put the extra power down.
7) Conversion to pre-mix oil. Otherwise you will be under-oiling the engine and risk seizing.
8) A decent exhaust. Dump the Leo-vince crap. Get yourself a decent Yasuni exhaust. I suggest the Carrera simply because its most suited to this application.
Your also probably going to want to flow the cases and port the engine to get the most power possible. This is VERY time consuming and can go very wrong if you don't know what your doing.
To add more to the cost, before you can even start running this setup your going to have to get it too a dyno center to sort out the rollers and jetting to ensure the perfect fuelling and roller weight. Your also going to have to sort out clutch springs to ensure that you are putting the power down at the right time.
After all this, you will have spent what the moped is worth just on tuning it too eventually realise that the re-sale value is so low that you wish you hadn't bothered.
____________________
Former: Derbi GP1 50, Sachs XTC 125, Suzuki GSXR 400 GK73A, Kawasaki ZX7R, Suzuki DR250, Yamaha RD350
Current: 2011 Yamaha XT660Z Ténéré, 2003 Yamaha YZR-R1 5PW (In Build), 2009 Kawasaki ZZR1400 |
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SpannerMonkey
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Posted: 21:34 - 31 May 2011  Post subject: |
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| computid wrote: | Nothing if you want it too last the year.
Im assuming that your on a Provisional licence and a CBT? If so, any modification to your moped is illegal and may wind you up in a lot of trouble. Of course, you probably already know this.
Why not just save whatever ridiculous amount of money your going to spend on 'tuning' a moped on getting a full bike licence when your 17 and then getting a proper bike.
If you had bothered to do ANY research at all on bolt-on tuning a moped you would have found a few things out:
1) It massively reduces re-sale costs as its obvious to any potential buyer that the moped has been ragged about and therefore they will probably look elsewhere.
2) You risk reliability. You risk snapped cranks, damaged rings, seizing etc. etc.
3) Your pretty much wasting your money for very little gain. A massively 'tuned' moped will probably put out 12BHP. By this point you've spent over £1000 on tuning only for it too blow up a week later.
But, after all that, if you still want too go ahead, your gonna want too do:
1) 70CC/80CC kit. 2 Rings for reliability. I suggest Malossi simply for reliability and quality.
2) Malossi racing crank and bearings. This will reduce the risk of a snapped cranks.
3) 28mm Malossi/Dellorto carb
4) Malossi variator
5) Malossi Fly Clutch
6) Malossi Gear up Kit to enable you to actually put the extra power down.
7) Conversion to pre-mix oil. Otherwise you will be under-oiling the engine and risk seizing.
8) A decent exhaust. Dump the Leo-vince crap. Get yourself a decent Yasuni exhaust. I suggest the Carrera simply because its most suited to this application.
Your also probably going to want to flow the cases and port the engine to get the most power possible. This is VERY time consuming and can go very wrong if you don't know what your doing.
To add more to the cost, before you can even start running this setup your going to have to get it too a dyno center to sort out the rollers and jetting to ensure the perfect fuelling and roller weight. Your also going to have to sort out clutch springs to ensure that you are putting the power down at the right time.
After all this, you will have spent what the moped is worth just on tuning it too eventually realise that the re-sale value is so low that you wish you hadn't bothered. |
ComputID, I've had enough of your bollocks, You spew shit EVERYWHERE. Get your facts straight. the minarelli horizontal engine has enough aftermarket parts available to take it well over 20bhp, top of the range cylinder kits are capable of 28-30bhp with the right porting and complimentary parts.
If you're a malossi whore, fine... But you cant purely suggest malossi parts, polini are also high quality, as are stage 6 and metrakit.
And the yasuni carrera systems? You mean you looked at the most expensive exhausts and assumed they'd be the best? Some of those yasuni systems dont even hit the power till over 12k revs... HOW ON EARTH IS THAT SUITABLE FOR HIS FUCKING APPLICATION?!
He's obviously after a fast-road scoot for his own pleasure. I suggest an entry-level to mid-race cylinder kit, a matched exhaust... a suitable intake (Nothing above 19mm carb) a gear up kit from any of the manufacturers, and a half decent variator kit. That is ALL he needs.
Lastly... a conversion to fucking premix? Get a grip dude, as long as the oil to fuel mixture stays the same (Will under normal circumstances) then all he needs to do is alter the amount of mixture coming through the cylinder to suit.
Back to the OP...
I would not suggest exceeding 10k rpm on the standard crank...
Also, make sure you up-jet at every required point, I cannot stress this enough!
The aerox's airbox in my experience is a pretty efficient design and doesnt require bodging with sports air filters.
Too pissed off to think.
Will reply another time dude...
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My bike? A YX140 powered one-off Monkey Bike, something a little different! |
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Nope.
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| Posted: 00:01 - 01 Jun 2011 Post subject: |
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| LittleHonda50 wrote: |
The minarelli horizontal engine has enough aftermarket parts available to take it well over 20bhp, top of the range cylinder kits are capable of 28-30bhp with the right porting and complimentary parts.
If you're a malossi whore, fine... But you cant purely suggest malossi parts, polini are also high quality, as are stage 6 and metrakit.
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Note: Most of the following data is from Here
As with any object a scooter needs more power to reach a higher speed but as you go faster you need more power to push through the air. Most scooters are pretty awful when it comes to aerodynamics!
The figures you need to look at are the Drag Coefficient and Frontal Area. You also need an idea of the weight of the rider but minimal weight changes wont make much of a difference.
The figures were going to use are 1.0 for Drag Coefficient and 0.56 metres squared or about 6.02 feet squared for the Frontal Area.
1.0 Drag Coefficient is a good guess due to most sports bikes being around 0.6 and a person standing upright is around 1.0 - 1.3. I will give links later to charts of different vehicles/things and their Drag.
0.56 meters squared is what the guy from the first post came up with.
Using a Vespa PX as a base and taking into consideration the likes of a Piaggio Typhoon which are a bit larger.
If we then use a Aero-Horsepower and Drag calculator like this (https://www.rbracing-rsr.com/aerohpcalc.html) You get the following results:
30mph = 1.64bhp. Much less than a restricted 50cc which normally have around 3.5bhp.
40mph = 3.52bhp.
45mph = 4.82bhp. The 45-50mph bhp figures are about spot on for a de-restricted scooter which can range from 4.5 to 6.5.
50mph = 6.47bhp.
60mph = 10.94bhp. Getting into the sport 70cc kit bhp figures and also 125cc 4 stroke bhp specs and 100cc's.
65mph = 13.76bhp. More like the Mid race 70cc kit bhp and the stock 125cc 2 stroke bhp.
70mph = 17.05bhp. A 125cc with just a 172cc kit fitted is around 17bhp and you will now start seeing the bhp figures increasing a lot for not much more mph.
75mph = 20.82bhp. A 172cc with pretty much all the bolt ons.
80mph = 25.05bhp. A street ported 172cc bike with all the bolt ons is around this.
90mph = 35.41bhp. Now you are talking some serious porting and hardly any reliability without a lot of maintenance. Pretty much a sprint bike.
100mph = 48.23bhp. Not even a figure that is reachable by tuning a scooter without nos.
Remember these are engine power figures not rear wheel... the rear wheel, gearing loss aswell as any times UPTO these speeds are irelevent, this is mearly if your crank was permanently attached to your wheel and you were geared for these exact speeds you would need these flywheel figures of bhp to attain the speed on the road.
Now, there are exceptions to the rule. Pm tuning got a scooter to reach 104 mph BUT it was seriously lightened and pretty much just a frame with a 172 kit.
And whilst polini is fine, id rather spend the extra money and get a Malossi kit.
____________________
Former: Derbi GP1 50, Sachs XTC 125, Suzuki GSXR 400 GK73A, Kawasaki ZX7R, Suzuki DR250, Yamaha RD350
Current: 2011 Yamaha XT660Z Ténéré, 2003 Yamaha YZR-R1 5PW (In Build), 2009 Kawasaki ZZR1400 |
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jako-aerox-hawky
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Old Thread Alert!
The last post was made 14 years, 205 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful? |
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